(10-21-2018, 08:20 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:04 PM)Nashville.Dave Wrote: [ -> ]Tacks are gonna get good at the right time.
Vrabels new plan
You guys are getting healthy. That can be your saving grace.
(10-21-2018, 08:11 PM)Nashville.Dave Wrote: [ -> ]Thats no way to be. I'm hoping for a 4 way 8-8 log jam at the end of the season. Afc south championship will be texas hold em at vrabels house.
Well heck I can hope for that too.
But the reality is any team with a good pass rusher is capable of completely shutting down our offense.
We have quite a few of those teams remaining on our schedule, including road games against the tacks, the Texans, the Eagles, the Skins, Miami.
At this stage, I see no way we beat Pittsburgh, barring the Steelers having a slew of injuries similar in scope to ours, including Big Ben missing the game.
Ouch. Yeah them squeelers gonna be out for blood when you play em.
Will watch the jags game later, its on the dvr. So you say your offensive line is the weakness atm?
And isnt fournette due back pretty soon,? After the bye maybe?
(10-21-2018, 08:26 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:10 PM)Krayz_Jville_D Wrote: [ -> ]You are one of the few OG posters here who has a clue, and I agree this doesnt prove he has lost the locker room
However, the product on the field and the things coming from Wash about the defense proves he has, and what ramsey alluded to after the game shows he has. This season quite literally blew up
Its over, and we HAVE to rebuild yet again because we have NO QB
So the season is over even though the Jags are 1 game back in the division? Cool.
They have 9 more games. 9. The offense can’t play any worse and they’ll be getting Hyde and Fournette back here shortly.
I’m not happy at all with what’s going on but I’d like to think a team that went to the AFCCG can somehow find a way to turn it around. Maybe it won’t happen. Maybe they get shelled every single game from here on out. But maybe rock bottom finally hit and they’ll shock everyone with a win against Philly next week. 4-4 at the BYE and then anything can happen.
Thank you, some positivity, I'm not ready to rip this team apart on 3 games. Yes it's been bad, but this team can go on a run, we just need a win and it doesn't matter how ugly it is, but all we need is to get that arrow pointing the right way again. Fournette will be back.
And of course we could just give up, keep squabbling and destroying all the good we did last year. We will see what team we have, we will see who the guys that keep fighting for this team.
Just get to the bye, rest up, get players on the same page and go for it.
(10-21-2018, 08:34 PM)Nashville.Dave Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:20 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]You guys are getting healthy. That can be your saving grace.
Well heck I can hope for that too.
But the reality is any team with a good pass rusher is capable of completely shutting down our offense.
We have quite a few of those teams remaining on our schedule, including road games against the tacks, the Texans, the Eagles, the Skins, Miami.
At this stage, I see no way we beat Pittsburgh, barring the Steelers having a slew of injuries similar in scope to ours, including Big Ben missing the game.
Ouch. Yeah them squeelers gonna be out for blood when you play em.
Will watch the jags game later, its on the dvr. So you say your offensive line is the weakness atm?
And isnt fournette due back pretty soon,? After the bye maybe?
Yes and no.
Bortles achieved last year because he had all of the pieces around him and wasn't asked to do too much. He wasn't put in too many bad positions, and he thrived because of it. Before last year, there were so many deficiencies around him he pressed and made killer mistake after killer mistake.
With the loss of our top two LTs, our top 2-3 TEs, #1 WR, #1 and #3 RB, too much is being placed on his shoulders again, and the errors are coming back. Fournette may be available after the bye, but for how long...who knows? But our LTs aren't coming back this year.
(10-21-2018, 08:39 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:26 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]So the season is over even though the Jags are 1 game back in the division? Cool.
They have 9 more games. 9. The offense can’t play any worse and they’ll be getting Hyde and Fournette back here shortly.
I’m not happy at all with what’s going on but I’d like to think a team that went to the AFCCG can somehow find a way to turn it around. Maybe it won’t happen. Maybe they get shelled every single game from here on out. But maybe rock bottom finally hit and they’ll shock everyone with a win against Philly next week. 4-4 at the BYE and then anything can happen.
Thank you, some positivity, I'm not ready to rip this team apart on 3 games. Yes it's been bad, but this team can go on a run, we just need a win and it doesn't matter how ugly it is, but all we need is to get that arrow pointing the right way again. Fournette will be back.
And of course we could just give up, keep squabbling and destroying all the good we did last year. We will see what team we have, we will see who the guys that keep fighting for this team.
Just get to the bye, rest up, get players on the same page and go for it.
For me, it's not a matter of ripping the team apart.
It's a matter of stark reality.
Had Robinson not torn his ACL, and were only out another week or so, I could hold out some hope of turning the team around.
But our top two LTs are gone for the year. Even if Fournette can remain healthy for the remainder of the year, and Hyde is as good as we think, their effectiveness will be muted because we can't pass block.
(10-21-2018, 08:40 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:34 PM)Nashville.Dave Wrote: [ -> ]Ouch. Yeah them squeelers gonna be out for blood when you play em.
Will watch the jags game later, its on the dvr. So you say your offensive line is the weakness atm?
And isnt fournette due back pretty soon,? After the bye maybe?
Yes and no.
Bortles achieved last year because he had all of the pieces around him and wasn't asked to do too much. He wasn't put in too many bad positions, and he thrived because of it. Before last year, there were so many deficiencies around him he pressed and made killer mistake after killer mistake.
With the loss of our top two LTs, our top 2-3 TEs, #1 WR, #1 and #3 RB, too much is being placed on his shoulders again, and the errors are coming back. Fournette may be available after the bye, but for how long...who knows? But our LTs aren't coming back this year.
Yeah that sucks. Your injuries are worse than i thought. And i see what you mean about bortles. He needs help. Just like mary, cant have recievers dropping passes when he manages to make a great throw.
As bad as the past 3 games have been, jags are right there in it, just like the tacks. Hell the forgotten colts too. I can see all 4 teams ending up 8-8. Crazy
(10-21-2018, 08:40 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:34 PM)Nashville.Dave Wrote: [ -> ]Ouch. Yeah them squeelers gonna be out for blood when you play em.
Will watch the jags game later, its on the dvr. So you say your offensive line is the weakness atm?
And isnt fournette due back pretty soon,? After the bye maybe?
Yes and no.
Bortles achieved last year because he had all of the pieces around him and wasn't asked to do too much. He wasn't put in too many bad positions, and he thrived because of it. Before last year, there were so many deficiencies around him he pressed and made killer mistake after killer mistake.
With the loss of our top two LTs, our top 2-3 TEs, #1 WR, #1 and #3 RB, too much is being placed on his shoulders again, and the errors are coming back. Fournette may be available after the bye, but for how long...who knows? But our LTs aren't coming back this year.
(10-21-2018, 08:39 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Thank you, some positivity, I'm not ready to rip this team apart on 3 games. Yes it's been bad, but this team can go on a run, we just need a win and it doesn't matter how ugly it is, but all we need is to get that arrow pointing the right way again. Fournette will be back.
And of course we could just give up, keep squabbling and destroying all the good we did last year. We will see what team we have, we will see who the guys that keep fighting for this team.
Just get to the bye, rest up, get players on the same page and go for it.
For me, it's not a matter of ripping the team apart.
It's a matter of stark reality.
Had Robinson not torn his ACL, and were only out another week or so, I could hold out some hope of turning the team around.
But our top two LTs are gone for the year. Even if Fournette can remain healthy for the remainder of the year, and Hyde is as good as we think, their effectiveness will be muted because we can't pass block.
Your absolutely right about the O last year. It really worked and the Pittsburgh game in the playoffs was probably the best game it all clicked together. Blake isn't able to do, for example a Rodgers, giving him a new cast off ever decreasing talent and still make plays. This O was limited but effective.
And I can't fault you for your injury fears, basically all our injuries have been season ending this year and I admit, as of today it's more hope than what I'm seeing with my eyes that will can become a functioning football team again this season. I've said in a few other posts, look at Atlanta, a good team but a season ruined by let injuries.
(10-21-2018, 05:30 PM)HandsomeRob86 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 05:19 PM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]It is hard to live up to expectations. Much easier to sneak up on teams. Honestly I'm more mad at myself for having such high expectations. Warning signs aplenty on the offense even before the season got started. Bortles is tough as heck but he is awful throwing the ball. Give me a guy that can throw the ball next time.
If Gruden wants to dump Carr, I am willing to take a flyer at this point.
Jon Gruden gives the impression he wants to gut the vast majority of the Raiders team ( pre-2018 acquisitions. ). Derek Carr is likely available but the question is at what price? A 2nd Round pick might be enough for a team to trade for Carr.
(10-22-2018, 12:01 AM)D6 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 05:30 PM)HandsomeRob86 Wrote: [ -> ]If Gruden wants to dump Carr, I am willing to take a flyer at this point.
Jon Gruden gives the impression he wants to gut the vast majority of the Raiders team ( pre-2018 acquisitions. ). Derek Carr is likely available but the question is at what price? A 2nd Round pick might be enough for a team to trade for Carr.
Carr isn't any good. Stay away from him. Waste of draft picks and money if they tried to get him.
(10-22-2018, 12:08 AM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-22-2018, 12:01 AM)D6 Wrote: [ -> ]Jon Gruden gives the impression he wants to gut the vast majority of the Raiders team ( pre-2018 acquisitions. ). Derek Carr is likely available but the question is at what price? A 2nd Round pick might be enough for a team to trade for Carr.
Carr isn't any good. Stay away from him. Waste of draft picks and money if they tried to get him.
The Derek Carr of these last two seasons fits that description. But a couple of seasons ago, Carr looked like a long term solution. A question that I'm confident is being discussed amongst one or more NFL teams that have major problems at the starting QB position is can coaching realistically get Carr back to his 2016 level?
Carr's having an ok season. He isn't finishing drives (TDs and INTs both mid 80s rate+), but he is moving the ball at an above average clip and has an elite comp%. Not worth the money he's getting, but he's a functional QB.
(10-22-2018, 12:34 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]Carr's having an ok season. He isn't finishing drives (TDs and INTs both mid 80s rate+), but he is moving the ball at an above average clip and has an elite comp%. Not worth the money he's getting, but he's a functional QB.
The 7 TD / 8 Interception ratio is what jumps out negatively and it heavily relates to what you touched on regarding Derek Carr not finishing drives.
(10-22-2018, 12:01 AM)D6 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 05:30 PM)HandsomeRob86 Wrote: [ -> ]If Gruden wants to dump Carr, I am willing to take a flyer at this point.
Jon Gruden gives the impression he wants to gut the vast majority of the Raiders team ( pre-2018 acquisitions. ). Derek Carr is likely available but the question is at what price? A 2nd Round pick might be enough for a team to trade for Carr.
Carr isn't a real franchise QB either. I'll pass.
(10-21-2018, 05:00 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...fter-loss/
Not a good sign, but not indicative of a coach losing the locker room either. I think this defense has finally had it with an offense that can't make it past the first four downs.
Now, if Marrone goes right back to Bortles, then we'll see what it really looks like when a team quits on the coach.
(10-22-2018, 02:38 AM)TJBender Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 05:00 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...fter-loss/
Not a good sign, but not indicative of a coach losing the locker room either. I think this defense has finally had it with an offense that can't make it past the first four downs.
Now, if Marrone goes right back to Bortles, then we'll see what it really looks like when a team quits on the coach.
According to an article posted in another thread, the fighting had nothing to do with the offense but rather the defense is fighting among itself.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...atest-loss
Think about it. it doesn't make much sense for the defense to be angry at the other struggling side of the ball when they know they have been decimated by injuries while their healthy pro bowl laden side of the ball hasn't shown up for 3 weeks.
Here is a telling quote from Jackson earlier in the week, "Guys were trying to do too much," Jackson said. "Guys with a lot of accolades in the past, and they don't have the stats this year they want, they're out there trying to do too much and are stressing other guys out at other positions."
It sounds like some guys on the defense are getting frustrated with some of the perceived selfishness within their group.
Based on Jackson's comment about the problem being with guys with lots of accolades and Campbell holding Ngakoue back, unless Ngakoue was defending Campbell from other angry team mates, it makes me think their may be a rift between the DL and the secondary because Campbell and the CBs are the only players with lots of past accolades.
The individual stats happen when everyone on the field does their job... how can they not realize this?
(10-22-2018, 06:01 AM)JaguarJosh05 Wrote: [ -> ]The individual stats happen when everyone on the field does their job... how can they not realize this?
This is probably the exact thought going through the guys minds who are starting to get pissed.
(10-21-2018, 07:36 PM)Trunt8728 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 07:13 PM)DragonFury Wrote: [ -> ]Ah, the good old "lost the locker room" thread. I remember we had one of these back in 2008 when Del Rio and Mike Peterson had their little dustup. Everybody was so sure that would be the end for JDR but we all know how that turned out.
Haha. Didn’t del rio get fired after that season and mike Peterson cut?
Wow you look like an [BLEEP] right now.
Del Rio got fired after 2008? Then who was the head coach in 2009, 2010, and the first 11 games of 2011?
(10-21-2018, 08:26 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:10 PM)Krayz_Jville_D Wrote: [ -> ]You are one of the few OG posters here who has a clue, and I agree this doesnt prove he has lost the locker room
However, the product on the field and the things coming from Wash about the defense proves he has, and what ramsey alluded to after the game shows he has. This season quite literally blew up
Its over, and we HAVE to rebuild yet again because we have NO QB
So the season is over even though the Jags are 1 game back in the division? Cool.
They have 9 more games. 9. The offense can’t play any worse and they’ll be getting Hyde and Fournette back here shortly.
I’m not happy at all with what’s going on but I’d like to think a team that went to the AFCCG can somehow find a way to turn it around. Maybe it won’t happen. Maybe they get shelled every single game from here on out. But maybe rock bottom finally hit and they’ll shock everyone with a win against Philly next week. 4-4 at the BYE and then anything can happen.
we are effectively 2 games back, because we are winless in the division, oh and also, both losses in the division are HOME losses, this team has no QB, albeit we may start one who is slightly better than our former one but still
on top of that there is massive issues on the defensive side that I do not see being fixed. This is 3 weeks in a row of the defense looking FAR from elite
yes, I believe this season is over
(10-21-2018, 08:30 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:10 PM)Krayz_Jville_D Wrote: [ -> ]You are one of the few OG posters here who has a clue, and I agree this doesnt prove he has lost the locker room
However, the product on the field and the things coming from Wash about the defense proves he has, and what ramsey alluded to after the game shows he has. This season quite literally blew up
Its over, and we HAVE to rebuild yet again because we have NO QB
Now the season effectively being over is a different issue than whether Marrone has lost the locker room.
I believe the injuries are insurmountable at this stage. As I said in a different thread, any team with a good pass rusher can shut this entire offense down and have an adverse impact on the defense. Barring a trade that gets us a viable LT, or the completely unforeseen level of proficiency by Wells in a very short period of time, nothing will change. Even if Fournette returns to 100% health and stays there and the guy we just got from the Browns is a stud for us, our running game will still struggle because teams will know even more to stack the box.
But that dynamic is different than Marrone losing the team.
having our D coordinator admit to allowing players to go off script, having jackson talk about players wanting stats from last year so they are playing off script in order to try to make plays and get those stats, and having ramsey's comments after the game allude to either problems with the QB/offense or the coaches, idk man... that sounds like a locker room full of issues
either way, it doesnt really matter, lost locker room or not, this team is lost
What I took most from this article is that Yann managed to throw Campbell of him when he was holding him back. That’s impressive. He’s going to be one hell of a pass rusher CV is huge!
Jackson had told NFL.com earlier in the week his concerns with the defense.
"Guys were trying to do too much," Jackson said. "Guys with a lot of accolades in the past, and they don't have the stats this year they want, they're out there trying to do too much and are stressing other guys out at other positions."
(10-22-2018, 08:07 AM)Krayz_Jville_D Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2018, 08:26 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]So the season is over even though the Jags are 1 game back in the division? Cool.
They have 9 more games. 9. The offense can’t play any worse and they’ll be getting Hyde and Fournette back here shortly.
I’m not happy at all with what’s going on but I’d like to think a team that went to the AFCCG can somehow find a way to turn it around. Maybe it won’t happen. Maybe they get shelled every single game from here on out. But maybe rock bottom finally hit and they’ll shock everyone with a win against Philly next week. 4-4 at the BYE and then anything can happen.
we are effectively 2 games back, because we are winless in the division, oh and also, both losses in the division are HOME losses, this team has no QB, albeit we may start one who is slightly better than our former one but still
on top of that there is massive issues on the defensive side that I do not see being fixed. This is 3 weeks in a row of the defense looking FAR from elite
yes, I believe this season is over
(10-21-2018, 08:30 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Now the season effectively being over is a different issue than whether Marrone has lost the locker room.
I believe the injuries are insurmountable at this stage. As I said in a different thread, any team with a good pass rusher can shut this entire offense down and have an adverse impact on the defense. Barring a trade that gets us a viable LT, or the completely unforeseen level of proficiency by Wells in a very short period of time, nothing will change. Even if Fournette returns to 100% health and stays there and the guy we just got from the Browns is a stud for us, our running game will still struggle because teams will know even more to stack the box.
But that dynamic is different than Marrone losing the team.
having our D coordinator admit to allowing players to go off script, having jackson talk about players wanting stats from last year so they are playing off script in order to try to make plays and get those stats, and having ramsey's comments after the game allude to either problems with the QB/offense or the coaches, idk man... that sounds like a locker room full of issues
either way, it doesnt really matter, lost locker room or not, this team is lost
Sorry but the defense is not the issue. They have really had 1 bad game and that was against Dallas. They held the Chiefs offense to 23 (Chiefs had a defensive score). Yesterday, Blake turns it over twice which directly leads to 10 Texan points. Not to mention, the offense has put up ZERO FIRST HALF POINTS which means the defense is constantly on the field.
This is about the offense and the offense only.