Now that the draft is over, are there any positions that still are in dire need of improvement going into the season? To me, left tackle would be the obvious choice. Bartch is more likely to stick as an interior lineman and I can't see any of the current reserves satisfactorily filling in for Robinson in the case of injury. Hopefully they will add a veteran left tackle sometime before their first game of the 2020-21 season. There are other position that could use an upgrade, but finding another left tackle is the most urgent need.
(04-27-2020, 11:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]General Manager.
I think Caldwell is one of the better drafters. His coach-selection skills are horrible, but I think Marrone needs to be the first scapegoat. Bring in Bienemy or promote Gruden if the offense is promising but the defense falls apart under Wash/Marrone.
(04-27-2020, 11:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LT, RG, maybe FS, CB2
I'd agree with this, the players we have at those spots are definitely in the 'average on a good day' class. Still all relatively young though, so the team will be hoping for improvement.
I think the biggest weakness for our team next year will still be our secondary, even after using #9 on a CB. Henderson will need time to learn the ropes, whoever starts at CB2 will theoretically be one of the lower-end starters in the league. Wilson is meh at FS and Harrison has not exactly proved himself to be anything more than average either yet. Teams could have a lot of success against us in the passing game.
(04-27-2020, 11:42 AM)TheDogCatcher Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 11:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]General Manager.
I think Caldwell is one of the better drafters. His coach-selection skills are horrible, but I think Marrone needs to be the first scapegoat. Bring in Bienemy or promote Gruden if the offense is promising but the defense falls apart under Wash/Marrone.
The first scapegoat was Jedd Fisch. Then it was Bob Babich. Then Greg Olson. Then Gus Bradley. Then Hackett. Then Coughlin and DiFilippo. Next Marrone. There are going to be history books written about Caldwell's unnatural ability to survive despite hideous results in a cut throat multi billion dollar industry.
Development. Because this season is entirely dependent on year 2 jumps and 3rd/4th year players living up to potential.
(04-27-2020, 11:42 AM)TheDogCatcher Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 11:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]General Manager.
I think Caldwell is one of the better drafters. His coach-selection skills are horrible, but I think Marrone needs to be the first scapegoat. Bring in Bienemy or promote Gruden if the offense is promising but the defense falls apart under Wash/Marrone.
I agree. Caldwell is a decent drafter. Also, regarding the 2nd part of your comment, in December 2019 we actually played defense with 7 undrafted free agents on defense as a result of Telvin quitting, Jalen quitting, Miles Jack hurt, and Darius hurt.
The Jags always have a coach in waiting going back over the past 10 years it seems.
RB (3rd down) ...my biggest surprise from the draft was DC not selecting a change of pace/3rd down back for Gruden's offense. I still think they will find one in free agency or camp cuts.
QB (backup) ...team is one snap away from Dobbs or Luton being the starter.
(04-27-2020, 11:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LT, RG, maybe FS, CB2
LT for sure. Bartch may be the answer at RG, but we don't know. Competent vets at the other two would be welcome. Not sure of our ability to go get 3 or 4 starters with our current salary cap.
(04-27-2020, 12:26 PM)ATLjag Wrote: [ -> ]RB (3rd down) ...my biggest surprise from the draft was DC not selecting a change of pace/3rd down back for Gruden's offense. I still think they will find one in free agency or camp cuts.
QB (backup) ...team is one snap away from Dobbs or Luton being the starter.
3rd down back may already be solved with Shenault.
The only vet I'm interested in at this point is Dalton. And I don't think the salary cap would permit it.
RB and more offensive depth along the line. Again, the draft was pretty good up until about that later half of the 4th - 5th RD. Felt like we missed an opportunity there to gain a starter like Biadasz who could play Center in a pinch if Linder were to get injured (which seems pretty common track record wise) or at the minimum he pushes Cann for RG. Bartch being a smaller school prospect to me could be an issue. Physically he has the size and feet for the position but at this level you can't just bull doze guys over on every snap.
Veterans are going to use more technique on a guy like that. And the fact that we didn't draft a single RB with the reports about Fournette being on the trading block with at least Buffalo and Miami reportedly interested in taking him off our hands was a concern. Not confident in Armstead. He didn't really see much action last year. So I don't know what to expect out of him in year two. I would really like to see them go after Devonta Freeman ASAP just because he has some experience and abilities as a RB. He would be a good fit in Gruden's system. He was pretty much 50/50 last year in Atlanta with rushing and receiving.
(04-27-2020, 12:02 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 11:42 AM)TheDogCatcher Wrote: [ -> ]I think Caldwell is one of the better drafters. His coach-selection skills are horrible, but I think Marrone needs to be the first scapegoat. Bring in Bienemy or promote Gruden if the offense is promising but the defense falls apart under Wash/Marrone.
The first scapegoat was Jedd Fisch. Then it was Bob Babich. Then Greg Olson. Then Gus Bradley. Then Hackett. Then Coughlin and DiFilippo. Next Marrone. There are going to be history books written about Caldwell's unnatural ability to survive despite hideous results in a cut throat multi billion dollar industry.
Babich was the worst DC in the NFL, one of the worst in league history. He was also terrible in Chicago. Not a "scapegoat" but guilty as charged.
Bradley was a real problem too. He created a culture of not caring which bled into every area of the team. Caldwell picked Bradley so there is some blame. At the time Bradley was a hot name for a head coaching position, and with no previous HC experience it was a blind guess. The pickings in 2013 were Andy Reid and meh (including Marrone). The Jags blew it in 2012 by not hiring Bruce Arians who was the guy I wanted. The other problem was that Bradley wasn't fired sooner. I have no hard proof but logic says that Khan (probably, but maybe Caldwell) promised him a full 4 years and wasn't going to go back on his word. That makes sense since the 2013 roster was essentially empty of any talent.
Coughlin was hired by Khan and fired by Khan which implies he was also guilty as charged. Seeing him on the field coaching during practice, the bad cap management, and the Fournette pick which had Coughlin's MO all over it is pretty much a smoking gun that he was micromanaging rather than just managing as he was hired to do.
I'm not sure about the OC's. None of them struck me as terrible. DeFillipo was clearly hired for Foles and fired as part of getting rid of Foles. The rest were probably fired for a failure to develop Bortles (as if that were possible).
Caldwell's draft picks have been good. He isn't much at trading picks, but his player trades have been better than I expected.
(04-27-2020, 10:57 AM)jaglou53 Wrote: [ -> ]Now that the draft is over, are there any positions that still are in dire need of improvement going into the season? To me, left tackle would be the obvious choice. Bartch is more likely to stick as an interior lineman and I can't see any of the current reserves satisfactorily filling in for Robinson in the case of injury. Hopefully they will add a veteran left tackle sometime before their first game of the 2020-21 season. There are other position that could use an upgrade, but finding another left tackle is the most urgent need.
(04-27-2020, 11:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LT, RG, maybe FS, CB2
My order would be RG, FS, LT, CB2 but I agree with these. Cann isn't going to improve, but Robinson might with another year back from his ACL. From what I've read Bartch might turn out to be be a very good LT, and I wouldn't write him off as just a backup or Cann replacement.
We're stuck with Wash another year. Maybe he'll improve with experience. I was hoping the Jags replaced him with Wade Phillips.
Minshew is still a bit of uncertainty. I'm hoping Minshew shows all of his doubters how wrong they were. Having a franchise QB who also had a fun personality is a great bonus. But if he fails miserably we'll probably have Lawrence in 2021.
I don't think there are gaping holes. Every starter should be competent. Just don't have much elite talent anywhere, especially on offense. As others have stated my biggest concern is oline. Robinson-Norwell-Linder-Cann-Taylor is okay. Hopefully Robinson improves now being two years off injury. Don't have high hopes cuz even Boselli who usually talks glowingly of the lineman said that Robinson didnt improve upon the thing he should have unrelated to injury. footwork, etc... Taylor hopefully takes a big step. First three off the bench in the event of injury are Shatley, Richardson, and Bartch. There was that brief glimmer last year that Richardson had elevated his game and would become a clear starter but that never materialized. Shatley is a nice swing backup but that is his ceiling. No idea with Bartch. On paper sounds like he has a lot of potential and there are legit reasons to think he could be a solid player(footwork, attitude, etc..), but relying on high potential midrounder as key backup and future starter isnt what I would call overly promising. The oline is average at best in my opinion and one or two injuries away from real problem.
I think TE is another concern. Just too many unknowns. Eifert could be a very solid to good player if healthy. Oliver we have no idea and have to hope he is healthy. Offense felt like it took a dip when Shaughnessey went out but I wouldnt call him a real threat. Jones sounds like a great blocker. And the rookie is a total project. Seems like a project worth developing but nonetheless a total project. If Eifert is healthy and Oliver lives up to his receiving potential, this could be a pretty solid unit. But it's also a nagging injury or two away from becoming a gaping hole like last year.
I dont love the RB situation. Fournette is just a guy and totally dependent on the blocking in front of him. I hope we dont force feed him the ball like we did last year. He doesnt do enough with the touches that he gets so why give him more. Armstead and Ozigbe don't scream elite but seem competent as backups. Would like to see them get more touches than last year. One of the biggest disappointments in the draft though is that we didnt come away with a mid round RB. Would love to have seen us get true change of pace RB we could swing out of the backfield.
Even without Yannick, I think this defense could be better than last year. Obviously we invested a ton. Safety could be a potential hole but otherwise feel like we should have a middle of the pack defense at worst. Run defense should be better. Think our pass rush will improve with Allen getting more snaps and Chaisson on the other side.
(04-27-2020, 11:59 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 11:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LT, RG, maybe FS, CB2
I'd agree with this, the players we have at those spots are definitely in the 'average on a good day' class. Still all relatively young though, so the team will be hoping for improvement.
I think the biggest weakness for our team next year will still be our secondary, even after using #9 on a CB. Henderson will need time to learn the ropes, whoever starts at CB2 will theoretically be one of the lower-end starters in the league. Wilson is meh at FS and Harrison has not exactly proved himself to be anything more than average either yet. Teams could have a lot of success against us in the passing game.
That same secondary with bouye instead of Henderson held up pretty well. Even with trash wingard in there for a bit. I think they’ll be better this year more experience for Herndon Wilson and Harrison. People are underrating Herndon he balled out last year statistically one of the best corners in the league last year
(04-27-2020, 01:00 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 12:02 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]The first scapegoat was Jedd Fisch. Then it was Bob Babich. Then Greg Olson. Then Gus Bradley. Then Hackett. Then Coughlin and DiFilippo. Next Marrone. There are going to be history books written about Caldwell's unnatural ability to survive despite hideous results in a cut throat multi billion dollar industry.
Babich was the worst DC in the NFL, one of the worst in league history. He was also terrible in Chicago. Not a "scapegoat" but guilty as charged.
Bradley was a real problem too. He created a culture of not caring which bled into every area of the team. Caldwell picked Bradley so there is some blame. At the time Bradley was a hot name for a head coaching position, and with no previous HC experience it was a blind guess. The pickings in 2013 were Andy Reid and meh (including Marrone). The Jags blew it in 2012 by not hiring Bruce Arians who was the guy I wanted. The other problem was that Bradley wasn't fired sooner. I have no hard proof but logic says that Khan (probably, but maybe Caldwell) promised him a full 4 years and wasn't going to go back on his word. That makes sense since the 2013 roster was essentially empty of any talent.
Coughlin was hired by Khan and fired by Khan which implies he was also guilty as charged. Seeing him on the field coaching during practice, the bad cap management, and the Fournette pick which had Coughlin's MO all over it is pretty much a smoking gun that he was micromanaging rather than just managing as he was hired to do.
I'm not sure about the OC's. None of them struck me as terrible. DeFillipo was clearly hired for Foles and fired as part of getting rid of Foles. The rest were probably fired for a failure to develop Bortles (as if that were possible).
Caldwell's draft picks have been good. He isn't much at trading picks, but his player trades have been better than I expected.
Caldwell didn't pick Bradley. The Khans did.
RG-Considering we didn't get one in the draft this has to be priority number one.
RB- With Fournette put on blast, you'd figure this position gets addressed rather quickly.
CB2- As the roster stands, it's Herndon and Hayden vying for CB2. There's something very unsettling about that.
OC- Linder is not getting any younger, his best days are behind him.
LT- Only because I want to see how Cam looks post injury. Could be number one.
TE- It made sense not to address this position in the draft. I definitely see them trimming the fat here next offseason, make or break season for all the TEs rostered.
FS- Historically this franchise has been weak at this position. Upgrade would be great but not really necessary.
OT- Swing tackle just in case of a major injury. If one of the tackles goes down it's 2018 all over.
What are the repercussions of just flat out cutting Myles Jack next offseason? 17mil seems like a lot to pay a weakside LB?
how soon can we get Bartch in there at right guard?
(04-27-2020, 02:25 PM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]how soon can we get Bartch in there at right guard?
He's not a RG
(04-27-2020, 01:34 PM)PAJag Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 11:59 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]I'd agree with this, the players we have at those spots are definitely in the 'average on a good day' class. Still all relatively young though, so the team will be hoping for improvement.
I think the biggest weakness for our team next year will still be our secondary, even after using #9 on a CB. Henderson will need time to learn the ropes, whoever starts at CB2 will theoretically be one of the lower-end starters in the league. Wilson is meh at FS and Harrison has not exactly proved himself to be anything more than average either yet. Teams could have a lot of success against us in the passing game.
That same secondary with bouye instead of Henderson held up pretty well. Even with trash wingard in there for a bit. I think they’ll be better this year more experience for Herndon Wilson and Harrison. People are underrating Herndon he balled out last year statistically one of the best corners in the league last year
Hopefully you're right, it's another young position group with room to grow.
I just feel like we will see a different dynamic next season. I think we will be much tougher against the run with the new players and a focus put on it. But last year we were so bad against the run teams rarely had to open up the passing game against us. I think we will struggle when they do this year.
Still, the roster now has at least servicable players at all starting spots, and some good depth in key areas. Me revised expectations is somewhere around 6 wins.
(04-27-2020, 02:30 PM)JaG4LyFe Wrote: [ -> ] (04-27-2020, 02:25 PM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]how soon can we get Bartch in there at right guard?
He's not a RG
He could well move inside, many experts had him pegged for an interior role at the pro level.
Either way, I wouldn't expect anything soon from him. He needs a few seasons to develop in all areas of the game. Very high ceiling, could well be looking at an impact player on the line when he does put it all together.