(12-06-2020, 11:14 PM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2020, 08:55 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I feel the opposite. I'm actually surprised how competitive this team is after releasing or losing many of our quality players. I think Dave could get talent. I think we'll regret firing Caldwell. I'd like to be wrong here.
I too believe that firing Caldwell was the incorrect move, he's one hell of a talent evaluator especially in the UDFA category. He built this team that was knocking on the SB door, in came Coughlin (control of player personnel) and down went Frazier for those of us that understands that phrase. The talent defected and or were traded, ie Coughlin.
Caldwell did a wonderful job of cleaning up the mess albeit jettisoning vets only to set up the next GM w/the best salary cap and one hell-of-a draft situation.
Nonetheless Caldwell was fired when the team was mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. Khan's mind was made up. Mark my words, he will be missed.
Time will Tell.
NH3...
I guess your okay with your team being competitive for 1 year out of 8 with him at the helm?
(12-06-2020, 11:14 PM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2020, 08:55 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I feel the opposite. I'm actually surprised how competitive this team is after releasing or losing many of our quality players. I think Dave could get talent. I think we'll regret firing Caldwell. I'd like to be wrong here.
I too believe that firing Caldwell was the incorrect move, he's one hell of a talent evaluator especially in the UDFA category. He built this team that was knocking on the SB door, in came Coughlin (control of player personnel) and down went Frazier for those of us that understands that phrase. The talent defected and or were traded, ie Coughlin.
Caldwell did a wonderful job of cleaning up the mess albeit jettisoning vets only to set up the next GM w/the best salary cap and one hell-of-a draft situation.
Nonetheless Caldwell was fired when the team was mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. Khan's mind was made up. Mark my words, he will be missed.
Time will Tell.
NH3...
Talk about Battered Spouse Syndrome. This team has been trash for the majority of his time here. Why was Coughlin hired in the first place? It was because Caldwell was struggling with his job. The guy is trash.
Don’t fee bad for these guys. They have made millions of dollars. Let’s just let it be. Have to have hope for the future
(12-06-2020, 11:14 PM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2020, 08:55 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I feel the opposite. I'm actually surprised how competitive this team is after releasing or losing many of our quality players. I think Dave could get talent. I think we'll regret firing Caldwell. I'd like to be wrong here.
I too believe that firing Caldwell was the incorrect move, he's one hell of a talent evaluator especially in the UDFA category. He built this team that was knocking on the SB door, in came Coughlin (control of player personnel) and down went Frazier for those of us that understands that phrase. The talent defected and or were traded, ie Coughlin.
Caldwell did a wonderful job of cleaning up the mess albeit jettisoning vets only to set up the next GM w/the best salary cap and one hell-of-a draft situation.
Nonetheless Caldwell was fired when the team was mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. Khan's mind was made up. Mark my words, he will be missed.
Time will Tell.
NH3...
How... "naive" one must be to really think that. I guess there is always one person like that.
BTW, he didn't build the 2017 roster, a lot of key pieces were brought by TC, delusional Caldwell fans just love to ignore that.
Wow I thought for sure everyone was off the Caldwell bus guess not?
(12-06-2020, 08:55 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I feel the opposite. I'm actually surprised how competitive this team is after releasing or losing many of our quality players. I think Dave could get talent. I think we'll regret firing Caldwell. I'd like to be wrong here.
I agree with this, but if we roll with Trent Baalke the drop off won’t be much in talent acquisition. He was always good at finding talent.
Offensively competitive yes, the team has been that for the majority of the year. As for defensively? We've given up so many 30 point games its crazy. The fact he was unwilling to fire Wash even tho the team was suffering is enough for me to fire him regardless. Doesn't matter how good your players are if the person running the scheme is pure garbage. The only time Wash looked good in a season is when our defense was absolutely stacked.
David Caldwell failed to find us a franchise quarterback in his 8 YEAR tenure as General Manager, which included SEVEN picks inside the TOP 10, with 5 of those being inside the TOP 5.
If you are still defending David Caldwell or implying we made a bad decision firing him, you are insane.
(12-06-2020, 08:35 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Our talent level is a bigger issue than coaching imo. It falls on Dave
....unless you consider that a lot of the best guys Dave brought in jumped ship because the coaches either scared them off or failed to address the issues that made things so toxic here....
Not saying Dave is without fault, but a better coach probably handled a lot of our ills in a better way, and we still have a lot more talent rostered.
Marone doesnt not do muc. Blah Hes a nice figure head
(12-06-2020, 08:12 PM)JAGFAN88 Wrote: [ -> ]I give him credit for chasing all the good talent away and leading this team to so many losing seasons. its all this moron of a hc
You should give more credit to Coughlin for chasing the talent away.
Marrone really isn't a bad coach. But I think we can do better, and more than that we need new blood.
I always thought Marrone was a good coach.
Obviously Jalen Ramsey had that hissy fit against Doug, but Doug made the right call there, and later Jalen said that he didn't have a problem with Doug, and Doug said that he did not have a problem with Jalen. Obviously Jalen's actual problem was either with Coughlin or Caldwell.
So just looking at that one incident as a microcosm of all the Jaguars' problems, it makes sense that Doug is the last survivor.
That said, it's time to clean house. If the new GM is okay with keeping some of the junior guys who had no real say over anything, that's fine, but everyone at the leadership level has to go.
Doug has done a good enough job here to earn a chance somewhere else. But not good enough to continue.
Maybe he'll be the next coach of the Jets! I wish him the best.
(12-07-2020, 10:32 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2020, 08:35 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Our talent level is a bigger issue than coaching imo. It falls on Dave
....unless you consider that a lot of the best guys Dave brought in jumped ship because the coaches either scared them off or failed to address the issues that made things so toxic here....
Not saying Dave is without fault, but a better coach probably handled a lot of our ills in a better way, and we still have a lot more talent rostered.
You can't coach talent. Maybe the guys were not good enough. I know Bortles had a team of different people trying to mold him. Talent has to be there.
(12-07-2020, 02:05 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]I always thought Marrone was a good coach.
Obviously Jalen Ramsey had that hissy fit against Doug, but Doug made the right call there, and later Jalen said that he didn't have a problem with Doug, and Doug said that he did not have a problem with Jalen. Obviously Jalen's actual problem was either with Coughlin or Caldwell.
So just looking at that one incident as a microcosm of all the Jaguars' problems, it makes sense that Doug is the last survivor.
That said, it's time to clean house. If the new GM is okay with keeping some of the junior guys who had no real say over anything, that's fine, but everyone at the leadership level has to go.
Doug has done a good enough job here to earn a chance somewhere else. But not good enough to continue.
Maybe he'll be the next coach of the Jets! I wish him the best.
There is zero doubt as to who he had an issue with in the FO... Coughlin.
Both sides screwed it up for us Jags at the end of the day.
(12-07-2020, 07:38 PM)enigma Wrote: [ -> ] (12-07-2020, 02:05 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]I always thought Marrone was a good coach.
Obviously Jalen Ramsey had that hissy fit against Doug, but Doug made the right call there, and later Jalen said that he didn't have a problem with Doug, and Doug said that he did not have a problem with Jalen. Obviously Jalen's actual problem was either with Coughlin or Caldwell.
So just looking at that one incident as a microcosm of all the Jaguars' problems, it makes sense that Doug is the last survivor.
That said, it's time to clean house. If the new GM is okay with keeping some of the junior guys who had no real say over anything, that's fine, but everyone at the leadership level has to go.
Doug has done a good enough job here to earn a chance somewhere else. But not good enough to continue.
Maybe he'll be the next coach of the Jets! I wish him the best.
There is zero doubt as to who he had an issue with in the FO... Coughlin.
Both sides screwed it up for us Jags at the end of the day.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the second run with Coughlin was a worse hire than Gene Smith for this franchise.
(12-08-2020, 09:30 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (12-07-2020, 07:38 PM)enigma Wrote: [ -> ]There is zero doubt as to who he had an issue with in the FO... Coughlin.
Both sides screwed it up for us Jags at the end of the day.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the second run with Coughlin was a worse hire than Gene Smith for this franchise.
When TC was hired I expressed my concern about his overreaching control freak tendencies.
Then he wanted to "win lunch" and I slowly started to come around to thinking maybe this was the discipline the young roster needed.
Should have stuck with my gut instinct.
He set this team back 3 years (or more) in roster development.
(12-07-2020, 12:07 AM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2020, 11:14 PM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ]I too believe that firing Caldwell was the incorrect move, he's one hell of a talent evaluator especially in the UDFA category. He built this team that was knocking on the SB door, in came Coughlin (control of player personnel) and down went Frazier for those of us that understands that phrase. The talent defected and or were traded, ie Coughlin.
Caldwell did a wonderful job of cleaning up the mess albeit jettisoning vets only to set up the next GM w/the best salary cap and one hell-of-a draft situation.
Nonetheless Caldwell was fired when the team was mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. Khan's mind was made up. Mark my words, he will be missed.
Time will Tell.
NH3...
Talk about Battered Spouse Syndrome. This team has been trash for the majority of his time here. Why was Coughlin hired in the first place? It was because Caldwell was struggling with his job. The guy is trash.
Coughlin was brought in because Gus Bradley failed. How much of that failure (and how long it went on) is on Caldwell vs Khan remains unknown. Personally I think Khan brought TC in because he figured out that he needed someone to tell him (Khan) when he's not taking needed action like firing Bobblehead after his 3rd season when any other owner would've. I really like the approach DC used to build this team, he just missed on the first coach (a good choice at the time that didn't pan out) and the franchise QB and then held onto both mistakes for too long.