(06-24-2021, 08:08 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Getting paid to get laid. I bet most of you all would flip if your daughter did it. Getting hooked on such drugs, can lead to stealing and having sex for money. These aren't good things. As far as drugs, some of the hard core drugs really do destroy a family. I've seen where a mom didn't care about her kids anymore and ditched them. You have to think about how these harder drugs are destroying families.
It is their body, not yours. They should be able to do whatever they want with it as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others. Why should it matter to you if someone wants to be a sex worker for a living. What about alcohol? Do you think we should be able to consume alcohol? Doesn't alcohol destroy families? I have seen alcohol lead to people doing some terrible things. I saw alcohol make me do things I said I would never do. I said if I ever drank even one drink, I would never drive. I drove many a times after I had a drink. Thankfully the one time I know I drove drunk, I didn't get in an accident or even hurt someone. Thankfully I was able to get help and I have been sober for over 4 years now.
(06-24-2021, 09:18 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 08:08 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Getting paid to get laid. I bet most of you all would flip if your daughter did it. Getting hooked on such drugs, can lead to stealing and having sex for money. These aren't good things. As far as drugs, some of the hard core drugs really do destroy a family. I've seen where a mom didn't care about her kids anymore and ditched them. You have to think about how these harder drugs are destroying families.
Years ago in California I read a story in the Fresno Bee about a woman found dead in a local flea bag motel. Turns out she was once a beauty queen and college student who had the world at her feet. She became an addict and started hustling. It was reported the night she died a group of about 10 guys passed her around and then finished her off with a hot-shot. She was still in her 20s.
That is unfortunate but it is still a victimless crime. It would have been no different had she died from alcohol poisoning.
(06-24-2021, 09:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 08:08 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Getting paid to get laid. I bet most of you all would flip if your daughter did it. Getting hooked on such drugs, can lead to stealing and having sex for money. These aren't good things. As far as drugs, some of the hard core drugs really do destroy a family. I've seen where a mom didn't care about her kids anymore and ditched them. You have to think about how these harder drugs are destroying families.
It is their body, not yours. They should be able to do whatever they want with it as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others. Why should it matter to you if someone wants to be a sex worker for a living. What about alcohol? Do you think we should be able to consume alcohol? Doesn't alcohol destroy families? I have seen alcohol lead to people doing some terrible things. I saw alcohol make me do things I said I would never do. I said if I ever drank even one drink, I would never drive. I drove many a times after I had a drink. Thankfully the one time I know I drove drunk, I didn't get in an accident or even hurt someone. Thankfully I was able to get help and I have been sober for over 4 years now.
(06-24-2021, 09:18 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Years ago in California I read a story in the Fresno Bee about a woman found dead in a local flea bag motel. Turns out she was once a beauty queen and college student who had the world at her feet. She became an addict and started hustling. It was reported the night she died a group of about 10 guys passed her around and then finished her off with a hot-shot. She was still in her 20s.
That is unfortunate but it is still a victimless crime. It would have been no different had she died from alcohol poisoning.
I'm not a lawyer, but the fact they intentionally injected her with a lethal dose of drugs probably makes her a victim of crime.
(06-24-2021, 10:36 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 09:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]It is their body, not yours. They should be able to do whatever they want with it as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others. Why should it matter to you if someone wants to be a sex worker for a living. What about alcohol? Do you think we should be able to consume alcohol? Doesn't alcohol destroy families? I have seen alcohol lead to people doing some terrible things. I saw alcohol make me do things I said I would never do. I said if I ever drank even one drink, I would never drive. I drove many a times after I had a drink. Thankfully the one time I know I drove drunk, I didn't get in an accident or even hurt someone. Thankfully I was able to get help and I have been sober for over 4 years now.
That is unfortunate but it is still a victimless crime. It would have been no different had she died from alcohol poisoning.
I'm not a lawyer, but the fact they intentionally injected her with a lethal dose of drugs probably makes her a victim of crime.
Sorry, didn't realize what happened. Don't know all the lingo. And yes, in this instance, it would not be a victimless crime, because this would be murder. But if she had overdosed on her own, it would not have been.
When a mother turns into a meth or, pills, or heroin zombie and her kids miss her, it's not a victimless crime. Sometimes you do have to try to save people
(06-24-2021, 11:40 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]When a mother turns into a meth or, pills, or heroin zombie and her kids miss her, it's not a victimless crime. Sometimes you do have to try to save people
Would you say the same about alcohol? Because it isn't illegal to consume alcohol.
(06-24-2021, 11:40 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]When a mother turns into a meth or, pills, or heroin zombie and her kids miss her, it's not a victimless crime. Sometimes you do have to try to save people
It's none of your business.
(06-24-2021, 11:00 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 10:36 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not a lawyer, but the fact they intentionally injected her with a lethal dose of drugs probably makes her a victim of crime.
Sorry, didn't realize what happened. Don't know all the lingo. And yes, in this instance, it would not be a victimless crime, because this would be murder. But if she had overdosed on her own, it would not have been.
Murder is murder regardless of the mechanism. They intentionally conflate the drugs because they know their position is weak and immoral.
(06-24-2021, 09:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 08:08 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Getting paid to get laid. I bet most of you all would flip if your daughter did it. Getting hooked on such drugs, can lead to stealing and having sex for money. These aren't good things. As far as drugs, some of the hard core drugs really do destroy a family. I've seen where a mom didn't care about her kids anymore and ditched them. You have to think about how these harder drugs are destroying families.
It is their body, not yours. They should be able to do whatever they want with it as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others. Why should it matter to you if someone wants to be a sex worker for a living. What about alcohol? Do you think we should be able to consume alcohol? Doesn't alcohol destroy families? I have seen alcohol lead to people doing some terrible things. I saw alcohol make me do things I said I would never do. I said if I ever drank even one drink, I would never drive. I drove many a times after I had a drink. Thankfully the one time I know I drove drunk, I didn't get in an accident or even hurt someone. Thankfully I was able to get help and I have been sober for over 4 years now.
(06-24-2021, 09:18 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Years ago in California I read a story in the Fresno Bee about a woman found dead in a local flea bag motel. Turns out she was once a beauty queen and college student who had the world at her feet. She became an addict and started hustling. It was reported the night she died a group of about 10 guys passed her around and then finished her off with a hot-shot. She was still in her 20s.
That is unfortunate but it is still a victimless crime. It would have been no different had she died from alcohol poisoning.
So I have a question for you in regards to "victimless crimes." Would it be okay with you if someone drove 180 MPH down the street that runs past your house, as long as they don't hit any kids?
(06-25-2021, 10:40 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 09:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]It is their body, not yours. They should be able to do whatever they want with it as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others. Why should it matter to you if someone wants to be a sex worker for a living. What about alcohol? Do you think we should be able to consume alcohol? Doesn't alcohol destroy families? I have seen alcohol lead to people doing some terrible things. I saw alcohol make me do things I said I would never do. I said if I ever drank even one drink, I would never drive. I drove many a times after I had a drink. Thankfully the one time I know I drove drunk, I didn't get in an accident or even hurt someone. Thankfully I was able to get help and I have been sober for over 4 years now.
That is unfortunate but it is still a victimless crime. It would have been no different had she died from alcohol poisoning.
So I have a question for you in regards to "victimless crimes." Would it be okay with you if someone drove 180 MPH down the street that runs past your house, as long as they don't hit any kids?
Would there be a victim? I am for less laws, not more. Now if that person was driving reckless and hit kid then it would not be a victimless crime, if they don't hit a kid, then it would be a "victim" less crime. Because there would be no victim. Now lets say you were having an issue with speeders, then you could do something about it like putting up a speed bump/table and now cars that drive that fast, will pay for it with damage to their car or truck.
(06-25-2021, 11:12 AM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 10:40 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]So I have a question for you in regards to "victimless crimes." Would it be okay with you if someone drove 180 MPH down the street that runs past your house, as long as they don't hit any kids?
Would there be a victim? I am for less laws, not more. Now if that person was driving reckless and hit kid then it would not be a victimless crime, if they don't hit a kid, then it would be a "victim" less crime. Because there would be no victim. Now lets say you were having an issue with speeders, then you could do something about it like putting up a speed bump/table and now cars that drive that fast, will pay for it with damage to their car or truck.
So, do you think there should be any traffic laws, since if no one gets injured, those are victimless crimes?
Here's the thing: When we jail people for drug offenses, we aren't addressing any issues. That family still loses a mother or father and still has their life ruined.
I have a great many addicts in my family. My cousin and uncle have both done time and lose their kids due to heroin and meth, and they just do more heroin and meth. My older sister spent over a decade addicted to meth, but got clean because she worked her [BLEEP] off and didn't want to lose her kid.
The point is, you can't legally mandate that people don't mess up their lives. You go on and on about victimless crimes, but drugs are illegal and people...still do them. At the very least, weed should 100% be legal as it's substantially less dangerous than alcohol. It's ludicrous that people are serving jail time for it.
(06-25-2021, 12:09 PM)JaguarKick Wrote: [ -> ]Here's the thing: When we jail people for drug offenses, we aren't addressing any issues. That family still loses a mother or father and still has their life ruined.
I have a great many addicts in my family. My cousin and uncle have both done time and lose their kids due to heroin and meth, and they just do more heroin and meth. My older sister spent over a decade addicted to meth, but got clean because she worked her [BLEEP] off and didn't want to lose her kid.
The point is, you can't legally mandate that people don't mess up their lives. You go on and on about victimless crimes, but drugs are illegal and people...still do them. At the very least, weed should 100% be legal as it's substantially less dangerous than alcohol. It's ludicrous that people are serving jail time for it.
I agree. All victimless crimes should be legal. All drugs should be legal. What you do with your own body is your business. Not anyone else's.
(06-25-2021, 12:22 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 12:09 PM)JaguarKick Wrote: [ -> ]Here's the thing: When we jail people for drug offenses, we aren't addressing any issues. That family still loses a mother or father and still has their life ruined.
I have a great many addicts in my family. My cousin and uncle have both done time and lose their kids due to heroin and meth, and they just do more heroin and meth. My older sister spent over a decade addicted to meth, but got clean because she worked her [BLEEP] off and didn't want to lose her kid.
The point is, you can't legally mandate that people don't mess up their lives. You go on and on about victimless crimes, but drugs are illegal and people...still do them. At the very least, weed should 100% be legal as it's substantially less dangerous than alcohol. It's ludicrous that people are serving jail time for it.
I agree. All victimless crimes should be legal. All drugs should be legal. What you do with your own body is your business. Not anyone else's.
Should drunk driving be illegal?
(06-25-2021, 01:04 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 12:22 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]I agree. All victimless crimes should be legal. All drugs should be legal. What you do with your own body is your business. Not anyone else's.
Should drunk driving be illegal?
That has nothing to do with if alcohol or any other mind altering drugs should be illegal or not. If you drink and you cause harm to someone else, it is no longer victimless. So as long as there is no victim, there is no crime, no matter what you choose to do. You want to create your own insulin for personal use because you can't afford it at it's current rate, go for it. You want to collect water so you don't have to use water ran by the city, then go for it. You want to cut hair and not have to get a license, go for it. You want to sell lemonade without a permit or creating an LLC, have at it. You want to fish to feed your family and not have to get a license to do it, sure why not. All these things are illegal and don't have victims, so they should not be a crime.
(06-25-2021, 02:03 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 01:04 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Should drunk driving be illegal?
That has nothing to do with if alcohol or any other mind altering drugs should be illegal or not. If you drink and you cause harm to someone else, it is no longer victimless. So as long as there is no victim, there is no crime, no matter what you choose to do. You want to create your own insulin for personal use because you can't afford it at it's current rate, go for it. You want to collect water so you don't have to use water ran by the city, then go for it. You want to cut hair and not have to get a license, go for it. You want to sell lemonade without a permit or creating an LLC, have at it. You want to fish to feed your family and not have to get a license to do it, sure why not. All these things are illegal and don't have victims, so they should not be a crime.
So, just to be clear, you are saying that if an action does not have a victim, it should not be illegal. Therefore, you are saying drunk driving should not be illegal, unless you hit somebody. Right?
(06-25-2021, 02:03 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 01:04 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Should drunk driving be illegal?
That has nothing to do with if alcohol or any other mind altering drugs should be illegal or not. If you drink and you cause harm to someone else, it is no longer victimless. So as long as there is no victim, there is no crime, no matter what you choose to do. You want to create your own insulin for personal use because you can't afford it at it's current rate, go for it. You want to collect water so you don't have to use water ran by the city, then go for it. You want to cut hair and not have to get a license, go for it. You want to sell lemonade without a permit or creating an LLC, have at it. You want to fish to feed your family and not have to get a license to do it, sure why not. All these things are illegal and don't have victims, so they should not be a crime.
Are you a communist?
I'm asking because you seem to think there is such a thing as a utopian society.... so are you a communist?
I mean obviously you are delusional - I just wanna know if that has spread to your ideology as well.
(06-25-2021, 02:35 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2021, 02:03 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]That has nothing to do with if alcohol or any other mind altering drugs should be illegal or not. If you drink and you cause harm to someone else, it is no longer victimless. So as long as there is no victim, there is no crime, no matter what you choose to do. You want to create your own insulin for personal use because you can't afford it at it's current rate, go for it. You want to collect water so you don't have to use water ran by the city, then go for it. You want to cut hair and not have to get a license, go for it. You want to sell lemonade without a permit or creating an LLC, have at it. You want to fish to feed your family and not have to get a license to do it, sure why not. All these things are illegal and don't have victims, so they should not be a crime.
So, just to be clear, you are saying that if an action does not have a victim, it should not be illegal. Therefore, you are saying drunk driving should not be illegal, unless you hit somebody. Right?
Yes, and then only as ancillary to the actual damages you caused.
Here is a flow chart to help you guys understand victimless crimes.
![[Image: 204534509_4202593939806634_7948910102590...e=60DAE40A]](https://scontent-mia3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/204534509_4202593939806634_7948910102590805926_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=110474&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=P40H3eDoCAEAX_QG9YP&_nc_ht=scontent-mia3-1.xx&tp=14&oh=f356a1c7e84c950ee8beed8c9a98e9f2&oe=60DAE40A)
(06-24-2021, 04:14 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 02:37 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]What's a victimless crime?
Any crime where there is no victim. I.E. doing or selling drugs, prostitution, collecting rain water, you know those type of things.
Are you serious? Are you [BLEEP] serious?! Selling drugs and prostitution are not victimless crimes? Tell that to the woman who is being prostituted in a human trafficking ring, or to the kid whose dad is a meth addict because I'm 1000% sure they are not aware that these are victimless crimes. In fact, they're not victims at all, they asked for it! They need to toughen up and embrace the suck of their reality.
I'm not one to name call, but you are truly a moron if you believe these are victimless crimes.
(06-25-2021, 04:08 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-24-2021, 04:14 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]Any crime where there is no victim. I.E. doing or selling drugs, prostitution, collecting rain water, you know those type of things.
Are you serious? Are you [BLEEP] serious?! Selling drugs and prostitution are not victimless crimes? Tell that to the woman who is being prostituted in a human trafficking ring, or to the kid whose dad is a meth addict because I'm 1000% sure they are not aware that these are victimless crimes. In fact, they're not victims at all, they asked for it! They need to toughen up and embrace the suck of their reality.
I'm not one to name call, but you are truly a moron if you believe these are victimless crimes.
Read the flow chart above. Then get back with me.