Makes me ill to defend a former dawg, but here goes.
Thing is one reason Walker was drafted over Hutchinson was his length. His arm length allowed him to impact the throw while still being engaged by his blocker.
In this case, he hit Ryan in the head and was flagged for roughing the passer. Had he tipped the ball or caused a fumble instead, he would be praised. He was trying to make a play.
(10-17-2022, 01:25 AM)Charlie Sheen Wrote: [ -> ] (10-16-2022, 04:33 PM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]I sure hope walker turns out to be a hit. Aiden Hutchinson is up to 5 sacks.
He has 3.
Yeah it's 3 sacks with 2 TFL's for Hutch. Walker is 1 sack with 2 TFL's an INT and 2 passes defensed.
Walker's drive extending penalty wasn't as bad this week as last week's even though the result of extending an opposing TD drive was the same. Last week even though he didn't hear a whistle, the way he threw Mills to the ground was gonna get a penalty regardless. This one he put his hand in the air to try to block or tip the pass while he was lunging toward Ryan with a blocker in his face and his follow thru had his hand land on the QB's neck/head area. It was a good effort by him with an unfortunate result. It happens. You want his hand in the air when the pass is thrown right over his head. You're not going to coach that any differently. This forum never ceases to amaze with misinformation and severe overreaction. Bench him? Good lord.
(10-17-2022, 01:25 AM)Charlie Sheen Wrote: [ -> ] (10-16-2022, 04:33 PM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]I sure hope walker turns out to be a hit. Aiden Hutchinson is up to 5 sacks.
He has 3.
And they were all in one half of one game, against Wash which was also Walker's best game. It's not like he's been the model of consistency either.
Hutch: 9 total tackles, 3 sacks, 2 TFLs
Walker: 12 total tackles, 1 sack, 2 TFLs, 1 INT
It's not like either one is running away with anything
(10-17-2022, 08:41 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 01:25 AM)Charlie Sheen Wrote: [ -> ]He has 3.
Yeah it's 3 sacks with 2 TFL's for Hutch. Walker is 1 sack with 2 TFL's an INT and 2 passes defensed.
Walker's drive extending penalty wasn't as bad this week as last week's even though the result of extending an opposing TD drive was the same. Last week even though he didn't hear a whistle, the way he threw Mills to the ground was gonna get a penalty regardless. This one he put his hand in the air to try to block or tip the pass while he was lunging toward Ryan with a blocker in his face and his follow thru had his hand land on the QB's neck/head area. It was a good effort by him with an unfortunate result. It happens. You want his hand in the air when the pass is thrown right over his head. You're not going to coach that any differently. This forum never ceases to amaze with misinformation and severe overreaction. Bench him? Good lord.
Completely agree. If anything he was so strong bull rushing the lineman with one hand he had too much forward momentum when he went to tip the pass.
It is actually a learning moment. He is still new to being a pass rusher as his main job.
He has to understand when he facing a quick game offense, like this he has to disengage and stop his forward momentum when going up to tip/bat the pass. He is is maintaining the pocket collapse while trying to bat the ball, he is more likely to have his arm hit the QB with less control of where it will go.
Other thing he is needs a few games without a penalty so that he doesn't start having a reputation as a guy who regularly roughs the passer. Don't want officials having a reason to be twitchy.
(10-17-2022, 08:47 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 01:25 AM)Charlie Sheen Wrote: [ -> ]He has 3.
And they were all in one half of one game, against Wash which was also Walker's best game. It's not like he's been the model of consistency either.
Hutch: 9 total tackles, 3 sacks, 2 TFLs
Walker: 12 total tackles, 1 sack, 2 TFLs, 1 INT
It's not like either one is running away with anything
Wonder how many stupid personal foul penalties Hutch has on 3rd and long during key periods of the 2nd half. Travon has 2 which were total momentum killers vs the Texans and Colts.
After rewatching the play, I agree it's not nearly as egregious as the one against the tinhorns. He does need to learn to be more careful, those penalties changed both games.
In Walker's defense, at least he is in a position to get called for roughing the passer. Chaisson was benched because he couldn't get anywhere near the qb.
He's overdue for a big game. At some point this year he'll get hot and probably land 2 - 3 sacks in one game. Could very well be this weekend against Daniel Jones. Daniel has been pretty decent this year with Daboll but he's one of those guys that will also tend to drift and bail out to one side of the line and his awareness can breakdown. Could see Walker getting a big hit on him early and a shoe string sack late to get them off the field at some point.
It's just growing pains guys. We've all been there and done that at some point in our lives.
(10-16-2022, 10:57 PM)Firesky Wrote: [ -> ] (10-16-2022, 04:14 PM)SamusAranX Wrote: [ -> ]Walker needs some serious discipline instilled.
Two weeks in a row he’s blown the game
I didn't see the 2nd half of the game. Did he get another roughing the passer call? Or allow a TD on a blown assignment? I see that everyone is furious with him and probably rightly so, I just wish I could see the play
He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
(10-17-2022, 08:47 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 01:25 AM)Charlie Sheen Wrote: [ -> ]He has 3.
And they were all in one half of one game, against Wash which was also Walker's best game. It's not like he's been the model of consistency either.
Hutch: 9 total tackles, 3 sacks, 2 TFLs
Walker: 12 total tackles, 1 sack, 2 TFLs, 1 INT
It's not like either one is running away with anything
Anyone praising Hutch also needs to watch the video of those sacks. One sack was a case where another defender got good pressure on the QB who ran away and straight into Hutch's arms. Another "sack" was a scrambling QB who was tackled inches behind the line of scrimmage. Losing an inch doesn't have the same impact as most sacks where you lose a bunch of yards. Going further, the video makes it look like the QB was actually passed the line of scrimmage and it likely should have been counted as a tackle instead of a sack. However, the refs don't do official review of calls for a player's statistical purposes.
(10-17-2022, 09:21 AM)nejagsfan Wrote: [ -> ] (10-16-2022, 10:57 PM)Firesky Wrote: [ -> ]I didn't see the 2nd half of the game. Did he get another roughing the passer call? Or allow a TD on a blown assignment? I see that everyone is furious with him and probably rightly so, I just wish I could see the play
He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
Nah, his hand pushed Ryan’s head back in what appeared to be an obvious and uncomfortable looking way. It was more than his hand coming down and hitting the top of the helmet. It was a clear penalty if you go back and watch it. It’s just excusable in my opinion given the circumstances of the play.
Also, it was a key play in the 2nd half, but it wasn’t the biggest single reason we lost. The one against the tinhorns was the biggest single play reason we lost given gameflow and timing. Walker will be fine though.
(10-17-2022, 09:36 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 09:21 AM)nejagsfan Wrote: [ -> ]He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
Nah, his hand pushed Ryan’s head back in what appeared to be an obvious and uncomfortable looking way. It was more than his hand coming down and hitting the top of the helmet. It was a clear penalty if you go back and watch it. It’s just excusable in my opinion given the circumstances of the play.
Also, it was a key play in the 2nd half, but it wasn’t the biggest single reason we lost. The one against the tinhorns was the biggest single play reason we lost given gameflow and timing. Walker will be fine though.
Exactly, we took the lead again AFTER this play
(10-16-2022, 03:14 PM)jagman Wrote: [ -> ]I don't care how good he is supposed to be I would bench him until he understands the importance of being disciplined.
you do that, chief.
(10-17-2022, 09:21 AM)nejagsfan Wrote: [ -> ] (10-16-2022, 10:57 PM)Firesky Wrote: [ -> ]I didn't see the 2nd half of the game. Did he get another roughing the passer call? Or allow a TD on a blown assignment? I see that everyone is furious with him and probably rightly so, I just wish I could see the play
He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
Lol, I would love to see you put on a helmet and get hit in the head by Walker. He collapsed Ryan to the ground with that swing. He's still raw, but no one can deny his power.
(10-17-2022, 09:36 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 09:21 AM)nejagsfan Wrote: [ -> ]He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
Nah, his hand pushed Ryan’s head back in what appeared to be an obvious and uncomfortable looking way. It was more than his hand coming down and hitting the top of the helmet. It was a clear penalty if you go back and watch it. It’s just excusable in my opinion given the circumstances of the play.
Also, it was a key play in the 2nd half, but it wasn’t the biggest single reason we lost. The one against the tinhorns was the biggest single play reason we lost given gameflow and timing. Walker will be fine though.
Yeah, this one was an effort play. Unfortunate, but I'm not faulting him for this one. In fact, given the way the day had gone, Ryan probably completes that pass if Walker isn't in his face.
So I have faith Walker can develop eventually. It is pretty natural for DE/pass rushers to take a few years to develop especially toolsy guys that don't have any moves. But he is not there yet now, and during the busy course of a season it is difficult to learn that kind of stuff.
So my question is, are reps where Walker is rushing with bad technique on the edge helpful? Would it make more sense say on 3rd downs/obvious pass plays to move him inside and have Key on the edge?
(10-17-2022, 04:25 PM)rpr52121 Wrote: [ -> ]So I have faith Walker can develop eventually. It is pretty natural for DE/pass rushers to take a few years to develop especially toolsy guys that don't have any moves. But he is not there yet now, and during the busy course of a season it is difficult to learn that kind of stuff.
So my question is, are reps where Walker is rushing with bad technique on the edge helpful? Would it make more sense say on 3rd downs/obvious pass plays to move him inside and have Key on the edge?
Yes. I think it needs to be heavily considered. Was not impressed yesterday by him nor Allen in their one-on-one's. That's supposed to be a beat up offensive line they played against yesterday as well. Put your strength guys inside and over the Guard/Center a bit more and let them figure out who to block.
I don't see enough change up with these two. Caldwell needs to figure this [BLEEP] out fast. Been very disappointed in how they've looked the last two weeks. You can't really say it's strength Vs. strength as well. Because the tinhorns ran it up our [BLEEP] when they needed to. Now the secondary gets dismantled.
Now opponents can start being picky and choosey with their approach.
(10-17-2022, 12:15 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 09:21 AM)nejagsfan Wrote: [ -> ]He came in and got his hands up to SWAT down the ball... his hand came down on the quarterbacks helmet... It wasn't intentional.... It's a penalty but it's a stupid [BLEEP] rule in the NFL a hand hitting the top of the quarterback's head is harmless and isn't going to cause an injury
Lol, I would love to see you put on a helmet and get hit in the head by Walker. He collapsed Ryan to the ground with that swing. He's still raw, but no one can deny his power.
I've seen some posting on here where, hand to god, I'd swear that's exactly what must've happened to some of these people.
Is this a serious thread.... The guy has literally only played six NFL games.... Good grief
(10-17-2022, 05:03 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2022, 12:15 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Lol, I would love to see you put on a helmet and get hit in the head by Walker. He collapsed Ryan to the ground with that swing. He's still raw, but no one can deny his power.
I've seen some posting on here where, hand to god, I'd swear that's exactly what must've happened to some of these people.
My point is players get lit up literally all game long and a hand to the quarterback helmet is just a ridiculous league rule...
(10-17-2022, 04:25 PM)rpr52121 Wrote: [ -> ]So I have faith Walker can develop eventually. It is pretty natural for DE/pass rushers to take a few years to develop especially toolsy guys that don't have any moves. But he is not there yet now, and during the busy course of a season it is difficult to learn that kind of stuff.
So my question is, are reps where Walker is rushing with bad technique on the edge helpful? Would it make more sense say on 3rd downs/obvious pass plays to move him inside and have Key on the edge?
He needs to learn what moves are countering his, and how to beat those. You don't learn that by not doing at all.
I don't know that technique is bad as much as he just doesn't have a refined set of moves to call on when he's challenged. Every DE can bull rush. He's gotta learn from OT hand placement when a swim, spin or punch is the better option, and keep doing it until he doesn't even think about it.