(06-29-2023, 08:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 07:57 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Hopefully he does. Need all hands on deck for the championship run
If you cut Cam we open up 16 million in his salary less the 5 million accelerated signing bonus in cap space this year. That's 11 million more dollars that could be used to sign Engram, a vet pass rusher and even a couple guys in needed spots (looking at you LG) when they become available during camp. Several veteran players in exchange for Cam Robinson should be a no brainer if it's really about a championship run this year.
I would suggest Cam's not getting cut this year. Unless, they have someone in mind they trust to replace him.
First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
(06-30-2023, 05:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
Pretty sure Cam didn’t tear his ACL. It was a meniscus.
First 5 weeks (since Jags will be in London and not sure they’ll want to bring Cam back for that).
Little Bartch Fortner Scherff Harrison
Week 6:
Cam Little Fortner Scherff Harrison
Just my guess.
(06-29-2023, 04:37 PM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 04:24 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Wish it was more, would make it easier to cut him outright.
I think with the guarantees being voided he can be cut right now. There's still $10 million of unaccounted for signing bonus so that's his dead cap number. But I think if they wanted to part ways and avoid paying him the $16+ million this year, that door is wide open right now.
I think you'd try to trade him first though if you had already decided he wasn't in the plans for a roster spot this year.
Just what do you think we could garner in trade for a guy coming back from injury and facing a 4-game vacation to begin the year? I think teams are going to want to see he's able to play before they start dialing our number.
Our best bet is if some contender has a tackle go down with injury early in the season, we may be able to feast on their desperation.
(06-29-2023, 05:32 PM)JagsFansince1995 Wrote: [ -> ]I know we didn't spend a 1st rounder on a non immediate starter or mid season starter at least. I mean I hope the gm is not that inept
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He was what, three picks away from the second round? Get outta here with that mindset. Would you have preferred that we leave a vacuum at RT until the 3rd? That's where the quality starters are just waiting to be plucked, right?
We took the guy where we did because we envision him to be the one capable of replacing the dude(s) we got on the roster at present, a pretty sure sign that we are looking to move on from said dude(s). Plain and simple.
You draft a guy for the duration of his first contract, not just the first 17 weeks of the deal.
(06-29-2023, 05:38 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]The logistics of the 4 week suspension is strange. The Jags are scheduled to play the Falcons in London on Week 4 and then stay in London for Week 5 matchup vs the Bills so Cam will miss the 1st London game but play the 2nd one.
~potentially~
Is the suspension all-inclusive? If the dude ain't practicing with the team or unable to participate in preseason, I dunno that I'd be expecting him to drop in immediately. But I did notice the same curiosity when the time frame was announced.
(06-29-2023, 09:30 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 05:48 PM)JagsFansince1995 Wrote: [ -> ]You are absolutely right. Forgot that quick that cam chased the money an went to KC. Can't wait for wk 2. Although it would be us that he actually plays elite against "because jags" lol. I like the pick but cam is not worth what he got extended for and we need to fix the oline. We FINALLY have a decent te since Mercedes Lewis thank God. Oh and he can catch and has speed lol. If we can solidify the trenches and sure up the backend of the defense we can dominate for years to come.
Dude must be rich playing under a long term contract in KC while also playing under the franchise tag in Jacksonville.
when you can master multiple dimensional travel, you can set your own price tag.
(06-29-2023, 11:53 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 08:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]If you cut Cam we open up 16 million in his salary less the 5 million accelerated signing bonus in cap space this year. That's 11 million more dollars that could be used to sign Engram, a vet pass rusher and even a couple guys in needed spots (looking at you LG) when they become available during camp. Several veteran players in exchange for Cam Robinson should be a no brainer if it's really about a championship run this year.
I would suggest Cam's not getting cut this year. Unless, they have someone in mind they trust to replace him.
This, if we see this as a runnable year, why not kick Little (or Harrison, if RT is a struggle) inside for the interim and roll your best lineup week to week on the line? If it bolsters your franchise QB while he is cheap, the $11M is well worth the temporary expense.
(06-29-2023, 04:23 PM)It JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]Told y’all boys Harrison will be the LT and Little the RT.
So, despite the team saying "he'll be playing RT for us" and his listing as RT on the team's roster, and the fact he's taken all his offseason snaps so far at RT, you think they are changing their minds suddenly? Why?
(06-29-2023, 11:12 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 09:30 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]Dude must be rich playing under a long term contract in KC while also playing under the franchise tag in Jacksonville.
Does the suspension in Duval also cost him his KC paychecks or nah?
I think this is an NFL ban but I think he could still opt to join 2 MBL teams in the September playoff run during his time off.
(06-30-2023, 05:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
He shouldn't be the starter, he's an average to below average guy making more money than he's worth. If we could exchange Cam for Dalton Risner, Justin Houston, and some warm body like George Fant or Eric Fisher to be the replacement bench tackle we should do it. Little and Harrison are the tackles, we shouldn't go backwards. This suspension is a gift to get out of a bad contract, we shouldn't let it pass.
(06-30-2023, 12:04 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-30-2023, 05:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
He shouldn't be the starter, he's an average to below average guy making more money than he's worth. If we could exchange Cam for Dalton Risner, Justin Houston, and some warm body like George Fant or Eric Fisher to be the replacement bench tackle we should do it. Little and Harrison are the tackles, we shouldn't go backwards. This suspension is a gift to get out of a bad contract, we shouldn't let it pass.
This……trade him, not worth the money.
(06-30-2023, 12:04 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-30-2023, 05:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
He shouldn't be the starter, he's an average to below average guy making more money than he's worth. If we could exchange Cam for Dalton Risner, Justin Houston, and some warm body like George Fant or Eric Fisher to be the replacement bench tackle we should do it. Little and Harrison are the tackles, we shouldn't go backwards. This suspension is a gift to get out of a bad contract, we shouldn't let it pass.
I tend to agree with your take on this. Robinson is a slightly above average left tackle who is unlikely to be on the Jaguars in 2024. If they could somehow trade him, that would be the best option since that would free up cap room as well as likely adding a mid-round draft pick. I don't see that happening, however, since he'll miss the first 4 games and is coming off an injury. Releasing him would certainly be risky due to the uncertainties at both left and right tackle. The Jaguars would need to feel pretty certain that Little and Harrison will be at least average to begin the season and one of the reserves (Blake Hance or Josh Wells) could fill in adequately if a starter gets injured.
The combination of Risner and Justin Houston, in my opinion, would benefit the Jaguars more than having Robinson for the last 13 or 14 games of this season. Risner would be a nice upgrade at guard and he is also capable of filling in at tackle. Houston would be a short-timer, but he has proven to remain effective if given less snaps. I believe guys like Abdullah, Walker and even Devin Lloyd could learn alot from a savvy veteran like Houston. One other possible addition would be a nickel to compete with Herndon and Braswell. Why is Bryce Callahan still unsigned? Unless he has a setback from last season's injury, he'd be the perfect addition to our secondary and wouldn't be expensive.
(06-30-2023, 12:04 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-30-2023, 05:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]First of all, I would not cut a starting offensive lineman. I don't see any compelling reason to do that, even if we think we have two other starting quality tackles. Injuries do occur sometimes, and absent an injury, one of them can move to guard and give us a pretty good offensive line.
Secondly, I wonder if this isn't a blessing in disguise, with Cam rehabbing from an ACL tear. It gives him a few extra weeks to get ready to play.
He shouldn't be the starter, he's an average to below average guy making more money than he's worth. If we could exchange Cam for Dalton Risner, Justin Houston, and some warm body like George Fant or Eric Fisher to be the replacement bench tackle we should do it. Little and Harrison are the tackles, we shouldn't go backwards. This suspension is a gift to get out of a bad contract, we shouldn't let it pass.
Yep. This makes a [BLEEP] ton of sense. We'll see what happens I guess.
(06-30-2023, 01:24 PM)jaglou53 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-30-2023, 12:04 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]He shouldn't be the starter, he's an average to below average guy making more money than he's worth. If we could exchange Cam for Dalton Risner, Justin Houston, and some warm body like George Fant or Eric Fisher to be the replacement bench tackle we should do it. Little and Harrison are the tackles, we shouldn't go backwards. This suspension is a gift to get out of a bad contract, we shouldn't let it pass.
I tend to agree with your take on this. Robinson is a slightly above average left tackle who is unlikely to be on the Jaguars in 2024. If they could somehow trade him, that would be the best option since that would free up cap room as well as likely adding a mid-round draft pick. I don't see that happening, however, since he'll miss the first 4 games and is coming off an injury. Releasing him would certainly be risky due to the uncertainties at both left and right tackle. The Jaguars would need to feel pretty certain that Little and Harrison will be at least average to begin the season and one of the reserves (Blake Hance or Josh Wells) could fill in adequately if a starter gets injured.
The combination of Risner and Justin Houston, in my opinion, would benefit the Jaguars more than having Robinson for the last 13 or 14 games of this season. Risner would be a nice upgrade at guard and he is also capable of filling in at tackle. Houston would be a short-timer, but he has proven to remain effective if given less snaps. I believe guys like Abdullah, Walker and even Devin Lloyd could learn alot from a savvy veteran like Houston. One other possible addition would be a nickel to compete with Herndon and Braswell. Why is Bryce Callahan still unsigned? Unless he has a setback from last season's injury, he'd be the perfect addition to our secondary and wouldn't be expensive.
That last part in bold. Exactly. We need a quality guard and Risner has swing tackle ability as well. We still have too many question marks regarding the pass rush currently on defense. Houston put up good numbers last year. He would be a nice insurance policy to have for one season.
(06-29-2023, 08:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 07:57 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Hopefully he does. Need all hands on deck for the championship run
If you cut Cam we open up 16 million in his salary less the 5 million accelerated signing bonus in cap space this year. That's 11 million more dollars that could be used to sign Engram, a vet pass rusher and even a couple guys in needed spots (looking at you LG) when they become available during camp. Several veteran players in exchange for Cam Robinson should be a no brainer if it's really about a championship run this year.
Engram is tagged is he will be on the team this year. What happens when Little or Harrison go down? You feel comfortable with someone else on this roster filling in a T spot if we are making a run for a championship. Cam is average but average tackles dont grow on trees. If they wanted to upgrade the LG spot they would of done it in the draft. They had arguably the best G prospect in the draft sitting there when we were picking in the 2nd. Before I even trade Cam im waiting to see how Little and Harrison plays the first 4 weeks then if both are playing well id think about trading him for a 2nd or 3rd. The tackle depth he brings for this 1 year is more important than the 11 mil imo. We could still sign one of the veteran pass rushers without cutting Cam. Id also rather keep Cam and put him at LG than cut Cam and sign Risner.
(07-01-2023, 07:28 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (06-29-2023, 08:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]If you cut Cam we open up 16 million in his salary less the 5 million accelerated signing bonus in cap space this year. That's 11 million more dollars that could be used to sign Engram, a vet pass rusher and even a couple guys in needed spots (looking at you LG) when they become available during camp. Several veteran players in exchange for Cam Robinson should be a no brainer if it's really about a championship run this year.
Engram is tagged is he will be on the team this year. What happens when Little or Harrison go down? You feel comfortable with someone else on this roster filling in a T spot if we are making a run for a championship. Cam is average but average tackles dont grow on trees. If they wanted to upgrade the LG spot they would of done it in the draft. They had arguably the best G prospect in the draft sitting there when we were picking in the 2nd. Before I even trade Cam im waiting to see how Little and Harrison plays the first 4 weeks then if both are playing well id think about trading him for a 2nd or 3rd. The tackle depth he brings for this 1 year is more important than the 11 mil imo. We could still sign one of the veteran pass rushers without cutting Cam. Id also rather keep Cam and put him at LG than cut Cam and sign Risner.
Cam is not average, he's rated in the low 50s among pass blockers, ie most teams already have two tackles better than him. You aren't trading him anywhere with his history and contract. And you'd rather play him at a position he's never played than sign a guy who not only plays there naturally but also plays tackle as well as Cam? Nah, poor value.
Some people are way underestimating cam. That’s all.
(07-01-2023, 01:51 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Some people are way underestimating cam. That’s all.
Nah, he is what he is; an average overpaid player. Edit: With a history of PED offense now as well.
(07-02-2023, 07:30 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (07-01-2023, 09:06 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]
Cam is not average, he's rated in the low 50s among pass blockers, ie most teams already have two tackles better than him. You aren't trading him anywhere with his history and contract. And you'd rather play him at a position he's never played than sign a guy who not only plays there naturally but also plays tackle as well as Cam? Nah, poor value.
(07-01-2023, 04:15 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]
Nah, he is what he is; an average overpaid player. Edit: With a history of PED offense now as well.
Lol, typical from you!!
Yes, correct as is typical of me. I'm sorry it's too complicated for you to understand the nuance of "among pass blockers" in a post.
Regardless of which adjectives you associate when Cam Robinson, he got paid and then turned in less than a full season of play incongruent with his new salary.
He followed that up by getting himself suspended.
That FORCED the team to alter draft strategy and redirect capital.
ALL of these things add up to an unlikelihood for Cam to be a Jag after 2023.
(07-02-2023, 07:51 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Regardless of which adjectives you associate when Cam Robinson, he got paid and then turned in less than a full season of play incongruent with his new salary.
He followed that up by getting himself suspended.
That FORCED the team to alter draft strategy and redirect capital.
ALL of these things add up to an unlikelihood for Cam to be a Jag after 2023.
I have a better chance with Sophia Vegara than Cam does of being on the Jags after this season.