(09-09-2024, 03:08 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (09-08-2024, 06:07 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]Engram 1 reception ??????
To me the defining stat of the game.
I dunno if it's a shift to feed all the WR or trying to make the game more vertical, or if the D particularly keyed on him, but he's been much more focal to our offense in the past, but I sure hope we find a way to involve him.
Last year he was targeted to replace the nonexistent running game. This week the running game was fine, so it makes sense he gets fewer targets.
(09-09-2024, 03:33 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 03:08 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]To me the defining stat of the game.
I dunno if it's a shift to feed all the WR or trying to make the game more vertical, or if the D particularly keyed on him, but he's been much more focal to our offense in the past, but I sure hope we find a way to involve him.
Last year he was targeted to replace the nonexistent running game. This week the running game was fine, so it makes sense he gets fewer targets.
Exactly. His receptions were high and his yards per catch were pretty low compared to other receiving TE's around the league last year because he was the recipient of a lot of our screens and other short passing game plays. In retrospect, we probably overachieved a bit at 8-3 last year as we were using scheme to overcome deficiencies until being exposed against SF which was then compounded by Trevor's injury not long after.
(09-09-2024, 03:33 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 03:08 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]To me the defining stat of the game.
I dunno if it's a shift to feed all the WR or trying to make the game more vertical, or if the D particularly keyed on him, but he's been much more focal to our offense in the past, but I sure hope we find a way to involve him.
Last year he was targeted to replace the nonexistent running game. This week the running game was fine, so it makes sense he gets fewer targets.
Hard for anybody to get more targets when your offense goes 2/10 on third downs and drops third down conversions.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
(09-09-2024, 06:18 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (09-08-2024, 11:03 PM)OG-JAGFAN Wrote: [ -> ]The offensive line overall played well in pass protection.
With only 21 pass attempts yesterday and 3 sacks surrendered?
I disagree. Trevor was still under a decent amount of pressure with the other attempts.
The self inflicted wounds also didn't make it any better on the offense.
Really getting tired of this same old [BLEEP] with Pederson and this offense though.
Flashes of brilliance with consistent flare up's of horse [BLEEP] on the field to make you forget about said flashes.
They have to consistently start playing like they have some sense, like they want to win these games and like they're in must win situations every week.
The easy sacks given up in obvious passing situations. The [BLEEP] turnovers within the redzone. The dropped passes.
It's year three folks. And it's the same old [BLEEP] again and again and again.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
Part of that was Lawrence holding the ball too long. Did they play perfect? No but they played well enough to win.
(09-09-2024, 04:28 PM)OG-JAGFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 06:18 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]With only 21 pass attempts yesterday and 3 sacks surrendered?
I disagree. Trevor was still under a decent amount of pressure with the other attempts.
The self inflicted wounds also didn't make it any better on the offense.
Really getting tired of this same old [BLEEP] with Pederson and this offense though.
Flashes of brilliance with consistent flare up's of horse [BLEEP] on the field to make you forget about said flashes.
They have to consistently start playing like they have some sense, like they want to win these games and like they're in must win situations every week.
The easy sacks given up in obvious passing situations. The [BLEEP] turnovers within the redzone. The dropped passes.
It's year three folks. And it's the same old [BLEEP] again and again and again.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
Part of that was Lawrence holding the ball too long. Did they play perfect? No but they played well enough to win.
I keep seeing this now and it makes little to no sense to me when you actually break the damn numbers down.
21 pass attempts.
12 completions.
3 sacks surrendered.
3 passes dropped on third downs.
On one sack, ONE, I'll say it was on Trevor for holding onto it too long. This occurred on the final series of the day where the DC introduced a new look secondary wise and everybody was covered. Everybody was blanketed.
So, again, I'll give you 1 out of 21 pass attempts as far as being on Trevor for not getting it out and taking the sack. Other than that? The rest of it is nonsense.
The team kept trying to run the football in the 2nd half like they did in the 1st half, and, it was pretty clear after ETN's fumble that the running game had lost it's mojo, because, the YPC dropped from 4 - 6 to 1 - 2. Probably due to being conservative not only in play calling but also in fear of turning it over again.
That's it. That's all it boils down to. Drive killers ultimately prevented this offense from enabling Lawrence to stack on more opportunities with his pass attempts. Period. The very first play of the game on offense was Harrison blowing his block on Campbell and Campbell asking Lawrence for a piggy back ride.
(09-09-2024, 04:36 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 04:28 PM)OG-JAGFAN Wrote: [ -> ]Part of that was Lawrence holding the ball too long. Did they play perfect? No but they played well enough to win.
I keep seeing this now and it makes little to no sense to me when you actually break the damn numbers down.
21 pass attempts.
12 completions.
3 sacks surrendered.
3 passes dropped on third downs.
On one sack, ONE, I'll say it was on Trevor for holding onto it too long. This occurred on the final series of the day where the DC introduced a new look secondary wise and everybody was covered. Everybody was blanketed.
So, again, I'll give you 1 out of 21 pass attempts as far as being on Trevor for not getting it out and taking the sack. Other than that? The rest of it is nonsense.
The team kept trying to run the football in the 2nd half like they did in the 1st half, and, it was pretty clear after ETN's fumble that the running game had lost it's mojo, because, the YPC dropped from 4 - 6 to 1 - 2. Probably due to being conservative not only in play calling but also in fear of turning it over again.
That's it. That's all it boils down to. Drive killers ultimately prevented this offense from enabling Lawrence to stack on more opportunities with his pass attempts. Period. The very first play of the game on offense was Harrison blowing his block on Campbell and Campbell asking Lawrence for a piggy back ride.
Yep. That was the only time during the game where I thought Trevor held the ball too long. That by itself does not create a narrative. And to be fair, if he throws the ball away and avoids the sack, does it change much? Probably not.
(09-09-2024, 04:59 PM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 04:36 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I keep seeing this now and it makes little to no sense to me when you actually break the damn numbers down.
21 pass attempts.
12 completions.
3 sacks surrendered.
3 passes dropped on third downs.
On one sack, ONE, I'll say it was on Trevor for holding onto it too long. This occurred on the final series of the day where the DC introduced a new look secondary wise and everybody was covered. Everybody was blanketed.
So, again, I'll give you 1 out of 21 pass attempts as far as being on Trevor for not getting it out and taking the sack. Other than that? The rest of it is nonsense.
The team kept trying to run the football in the 2nd half like they did in the 1st half, and, it was pretty clear after ETN's fumble that the running game had lost it's mojo, because, the YPC dropped from 4 - 6 to 1 - 2. Probably due to being conservative not only in play calling but also in fear of turning it over again.
That's it. That's all it boils down to. Drive killers ultimately prevented this offense from enabling Lawrence to stack on more opportunities with his pass attempts. Period. The very first play of the game on offense was Harrison blowing his block on Campbell and Campbell asking Lawrence for a piggy back ride.
Yep. That was the only time during the game where I thought Trevor held the ball too long. That by itself does not create a narrative. And to be fair, if he throws the ball away and avoids the sack, does it change much? Probably not.
It sure does. Throwing it away is always the correct play to make 9 out of 10 times
BTJ is special.
The fact that he's already caught on camera shaking his head is a concern...
But it's all good. We need to establish the run game as a priority, in a pass first league. That'll teach 'em as we go 0-2
How many times did we throw the ball in the 1st half? Remind me... cuz I forgot
I agree. BTJ has it. Let’s target him more
(09-14-2024, 11:41 AM)TDOSS Wrote: [ -> ] (09-09-2024, 04:59 PM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]Yep. That was the only time during the game where I thought Trevor held the ball too long. That by itself does not create a narrative. And to be fair, if he throws the ball away and avoids the sack, does it change much? Probably not.
It sure does. Throwing it away is always the correct play to make 9 out of 10 times
Well of course you'd prefer a throw away, but Trevor wasn't holding the ball too long all game against the phins. It was really just that 1 play. The point that was apparently lost on you is that a sack vs a throw away there doesn't materially affect the outcome of the game. It was a 3rd down sack. We were punting on 4th even if he were able to throw the ball away. The phins had their game winning FG drive right after.
Someone said the running game was fine...
(09-15-2024, 09:07 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]Someone said the running game was fine...
RBs averaged like 4 and a half yards a carry
(09-15-2024, 09:07 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]Someone said the running game was fine...
The running game was effective today, the line continues to suffer from overall weakness.
The running game was fine after we decided to actually try and throw the ball. The running game was trash in the 1st half.
I guess I just don't see the same as you guys do. But to me, it's obvious that you throw to run. But Doug and his fans want to run to throw. And it's obvious that the rest of the league isn't in your pervue
(09-15-2024, 10:22 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]The running game was fine after we decided to actually try and throw the ball. The running game was trash in the 1st half.
I guess I just don't see the same as you guys do. But to me, it's obvious that you throw to run. But Doug and his fans want to run to throw. And it's obvious that the rest of the league isn't in your pervue
I have no issues with saying they need to dial up the deep ball, but every time you do the weakness of the line will shine through.
So look at the first three series of the day and you'll see that all of the offense was the run, they threw the ball half the time and the pass wasn't working. The pass game isn't opening up the run, they just can't freaking get the two yards they need on short yardage plays.
Same issue last week. Run game looks good... on 1st and 10+. Run game looks like booty... on any short yardage situation really. Numbers don't lie.
Etienne in 2 games now:
1st down - YPC is 5.1
2nd down - YPC is 1.9
4th down - YPC is -2.0
Splits
1-3 yards to go - 6 attempts for -1 yards
Play caller needs to stop calling run plays in short yardage situations and cook something up that's more effective. That's where we're losing these football games. Here's the biggest, most overlooked stat in these games.
2/10 on third down's last week. 0/1 on fourth down attempts last week.
3/9 on third down's yesterday. 0 fourth down attempts taken.
All of that above? 5/19 on third down's in two games? That's your problem right there. Piss poor running concepts, run blocking and play calls on short yardage situations and ineffective on 3rd down's where most of the time you've set your QB up for failure by failing to establish the running game on those drives to enable more creative designs, play action, etc.
Disappointing to watch this offense. Once again, BTJ, targeted just 4 times and he delivers 2 big catches for damn near 100 yards. Meanwhile. MHJ goes off yesterday. He was targeted 8 times after only getting 3 targets in the opening loss to Buffalo in a one possession game. Imagine that though, you see an issue the week before in NOT targeting your prized possession of the NFL draft, you more than double his role in the offense? And ta-da! You get a big [BLEEP] win!
We kept the status quo with Thomas. 4 targets last week, 4 targets yesterday. THAT'S ON THE PLAY CALLER GUYS! THAT'S ON THE FILM STUDY! THE INSTALLMENT! AND, THAT WAS AFTER ENGRAM WAS A GAMEDAY SCRATCH. PERFECT OPPORTUNITY TO GET THE KID MORE TARGETS.
BUT, NOPE! FOUR! [BLEEP] FOUR!
No excuses folks. Sorry for the caps earlier. Hicken is on and he's yelling. My fingertips were possessed by the spirit of Hicken for a second. Anyway. Happy Monday guys!
(09-16-2024, 07:15 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Same issue last week. Run game looks good... on 1st and 10+. Run game looks like booty... on any short yardage situation really. Numbers don't lie.
Etienne in 2 games now:
1st down - YPC is 5.1
2nd down - YPC is 1.9
4th down - YPC is -2.0
Splits
1-3 yards to go - 6 attempts for -1 yards
Play caller needs to stop calling run plays in short yardage situations and cook something up that's more effective. That's where we're losing these football games. Here's the biggest, most overlooked stat in these games.
2/10 on third down's last week. 0/1 on fourth down attempts last week.
3/9 on third down's yesterday. 0 fourth down attempts taken.
All of that above? 5/19 on third down's in two games? That's your problem right there. Piss poor running concepts, run blocking and play calls on short yardage situations and ineffective on 3rd down's where most of the time you've set your QB up for failure by failing to establish the running game on those drives to enable more creative designs, play action, etc.
Disappointing to watch this offense. Once again, BTJ, targeted just 4 times and he delivers 2 big catches for damn near 100 yards. Meanwhile. MHJ goes off yesterday. He was targeted 8 times after only getting 3 targets in the opening loss to Buffalo in a one possession game. Imagine that though, you see an issue the week before in NOT targeting your prized possession of the NFL draft, you more than double his role in the offense? And ta-da! You get a big [BLEEP] win!
We kept the status quo with Thomas. 4 targets last week, 4 targets yesterday. THAT'S ON THE PLAY CALLER GUYS! THAT'S ON THE FILM STUDY! THE INSTALLMENT! AND, THAT WAS AFTER ENGRAM WAS A GAMEDAY SCRATCH. PERFECT OPPORTUNITY TO GET THE KID MORE TARGETS.
BUT, NOPE! FOUR! [BLEEP] FOUR!
No excuses folks. Sorry for the caps earlier. Hicken is on and he's yelling. My fingertips were possessed by the spirit of Hicken for a second. Anyway. Happy Monday guys!
The primary goal of a good play caller is getting the best players the ball. Thomas needs no less than 8+ targets a game. Good news for this season is we don't know what that looks like for the Jags yet and assuming they make that a priority it should pay dividends.
Thomas has the tools to be one of the best deep threats in the NFL and Trevor is one of the best deep ball throwers in the NFL. It's an ideal pair, maybe the jags coaches realize that going forward... Otherwise another coaching staff will next off-season
You guys act like the play call is such that only one guy can be targeted per play. That isn't how it works. Do you know how many times BTj was the first read and it wasn't there? I don't, so I'm not going to sit here and say "X player should be targeted Y times minimum" because that isn't how it works. If you'll open up the memory holes you'll remember that you guys were [BLEEP] up a storm about them overtargeting Agent Zero last year, so forcing the ball to a guy who isn't open isn't what you want either. You're just mad that the plays aren't working, and that's fine. But these "solutions" aren't solutions, they're just grousing.
(09-16-2024, 08:39 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]You guys act like the play call is such that only one guy can be targeted per play. That isn't how it works. Do you know how many times BTj was the first read and it wasn't there? I don't, so I'm not going to sit here and say "X player should be targeted Y times minimum" because that isn't how it works. If you'll open up the memory holes you'll remember that you guys were [BLEEP] up a storm about them overtargeting Agent Zero last year, so forcing the ball to a guy who isn't open isn't what you want either. You're just mad that the plays aren't working, and that's fine. But these "solutions" aren't solutions, they're just grousing.
I was on board with Ridley getting force fed last year. That's why they went out and traded for him and it was a gamble to begin with, pun intended. I was, however, disappointed with his inability to catch the tough passes and TD passes when we were in crunch time. The idea was correct. The concepts were correct. They just didn't execute enough and reasonably, look, we gave him a pass because of the two year lay off.
With that said. BTJ has to get more targets. Whether by design, whether it's the QB coach and WR coach along with Press and Doug saying "Hey, look [BLEEP] nut, he's your first read and last read moving forward for more than 50% of the time, if you go first read, not there yet? Then go second read and if it's blanketed? Ball needs to be a 50/50 to BTJ or thrown out of bounds".
That's where it seems like we're at now if we're going to keep stating the offensive line isn't giving him enough time. We don't have time for 1st, 2nd and 3rd reads. It's going to have to be 1 read, 1 read and a half, maybe 2nd read, or BAIL. That's it.