In the interest of full disclosure, let me say that I have had a historic bias against Indiana players. Now there have been Hoosiers in recent drafts who have done reasonably well. But historically, Indiana has not been a school that has produced a lot of great NFL players, and that colors my view of their players. That said, I hasten to add that I like what I have seen and heard about Feeney and I view him favorably. Furthermore, this post isn't going to offer too much in the way of evaluating him as a player. For the purposes of this discussion, I defer to the general consensus that Feeney will be a late first-early second round talent. But there will be some limited evaluation of him
Having dispensed with that, I know Feeney is a popular choice for Jaguars fans for us at the top of the second round, with some advocating we even trade up back into the bottom of the first round to go get him, if not Lamp. That aside, I think there are two reasons I don't think Feeney will be a Jaguar by May. Mainly, I don't think he will be on the board when we pick, and, assuming TC is calling the shots on draft day, I don't think he fits TC's mold for OLs.
First, I don't think Feeney will be on the board when we pick. The bottom of the first round and top of the 2nd round is as follows:
25) Houston
26) Seattle
27) Kansas City
28) Dallas
29) Green Bay
30) Pittsburgh
31) Atlanta
32) New Orleans (From NE)
2nd round
33) Cleveland
34) San Francisco
35) Jacksonville
Of these teams, Houston, Seattle, Green Bay, and Atlanta all have needs along the OL. Now arguably, Seattle, looking to replicate the power running attack of their Super Bowl years, may likely go for Robinson, if he's still on the board, or another power guy. But generally, I think he would be a good fit in Houston, Green Bay and Atlanta. Given Green Bay's free agency losses along the OL, they have the biggest need in OL outside of Jacksonville, it would be tough to expect the Packers to pass him up. Perhaps if he and Lamp are on the board when Green Bay picks at 29, maybe they take Lamp over him, but there's a lot of teams there where need meets value to expect Feeney to be there at 35, and this analysis doesn't even address the possibility of a team trading ahead of us to land him.
But if he somehow makes it past Atlanta, he will likely make it to us. Cleveland invested heavily in the OL this offseason, and are solid now at G with Bitonio and Zeitler. San Francisco just drafted Joshua Garnett last year, and while I have not followed Beadles since he left here, based upon everything I have read, his play did not induce projectile vomiting there like it did here. Their line seems okay. So why wouldn't we take him? Simply put, because he is a pure G. An examination of TCs OL acquisitions shows he likes his OLs to be versatile. He signed Leon Searcy as a free agent. Searcy played G in Pittsburgh and T here in Jacksonville. He acquired Ben Coleman from waivers. Coleman played G for us primarily, but stepped in admirably for Boselli when Boselli was injured. In New York, he drafted Justin Pugh, a T who many felt projected inside to G. Pugh has played both with the Giants. Weston Richburg was a 2nd round pick who has played G and C. Feeney has only played the right side. I think if TC does go after an OL in the 2nd round, Dawkins, who played LT in college but projects inside or to RT in the NFL, may be more to TC's liking.
Correction edit: Feeney played some RT in 2016...about 4 games.
Dawkins at 35 should turn out to be adequate value if a highly rated player doesn't fall and prove too tempting.
I'd love if Taylor Moton was there for our #35 pick. He's a day 1 starter at guard or right tackle imo. Whatever way it shakes down I think its highly likely at least 1 of Dan Feeney, Taylor Moton or Dion Dawkins will be there.
I think I was hating on him a few months ago (sorry JagsFanJay) but I'm starting to like Pat Elfein from Ohio state too. Was a second team all american at guard in 2015 and a first team all american at center in 2016. Team captain , former wrestler, very intelligent etc etc can play all 3 interior spots at a high level. He reminds me of a shorter version of Linder after watching a few of his games blocking for Zeke last year and Samuel this year.
Quote:I'd love if Taylor Moton was there for our #35 pick. He's a day 1 starter at guard or right tackle imo. Whatever way it shakes down I think its highly likely at least 1 of Dan Feeney, Taylor Moton or Dion Dawkins will be there.
I think I was hating on him a few months ago (sorry JagsFanJay) but I'm starting to like Pat Elfein from Ohio state too. Was a second team all american at guard in 2015 and a first team all american at center in 2016. Team captain , former wrestler, very intelligent etc etc can play all 3 interior spots at a high level. He reminds me of a shorter version of Linder after watching a few of his games blocking for Zeke last year and Samuel this year.
I'm pretty high on elfein. Draft him and put him and wherever you think you get the most out of each.
Quote:Dawkins at 35 should turn out to be adequate value if a highly rated player doesn't fall and prove too tempting.
He seems to be the guy I believe will be drafted by the Jaguars in round 2. There is a dropoff from Lamp and Feeney to him, but there is a much bigger dropoff after Dawkins. I'd be fine with him, but I still really want Lamp or Feeney.
Quote:I'd love if Taylor Moton was there for our #35 pick. He's a day 1 starter at guard or right tackle imo. Whatever way it shakes down I think its highly likely at least 1 of Dan Feeney, Taylor Moton or Dion Dawkins will be there.
I think I was hating on him a few months ago (sorry JagsFanJay) but I'm starting to like Pat Elfein from Ohio state too. Was a second team all american at guard in 2015 and a first team all american at center in 2016. Team captain , former wrestler, very intelligent etc etc can play all 3 interior spots at a high level. He reminds me of a shorter version of Linder after watching a few of his games blocking for Zeke last year and Samuel this year.
Moton is such a dominant RT, I wouldn't want to move him inside. If we wanna draft him to replace Parnell, I'm all for it. Moton is the best RT prospect in the draft IMO and I believe he would be a big upgrade at RT. Moving him inside to OG would be too much of an experiment. As for Elfein, as I said he's by far the best Center in the draft and I view him as the best Center prospect since Travis Fredrick. I stand by that statement. I also view the Center position as the 2nd most important position on the O-Line, behind LT. With that said, I believe it would be a real waste to move such a talented Center to OG, but I think there is little to no chance the Jags would move Linder from Center. He's really seemed to find his calling at that position. Elfein is one of the best interior run blockers I've seen in a long, long time. He needs to be a Center in the NFL and I see him as a pro bowler several times over. So, that pretty much eliminates him from contention. To me at this point, we either get Lamp, Feeney, Dawkins or we have failed miserably.
Interesting theory on Feeney, but I think that if he is clearly the best guard available when we pick at 35 then we'll take him.
Another thought on Elflein though (and I probably agree that Linder is stuck at center now, unfortunately), how about moving Elflein back to his original position of guard? - it was where he played before being moved to center last season (just like Linder I suppose) and it sounds like he was pretty good at the position.
Quote:Interesting theory on Feeney, but I think that if he is clearly the best guard available when we pick at 35 then we'll take him.
Another thought on Elflein though (and I probably agree that Linder is stuck at center now, unfortunately), how about moving Elflein back to his original position of guard? - it was where he played before being moved to center last season (just like Linder I suppose) and it sounds like he was pretty good at the position.
Yeah I'd pick him to play guard too.
Quote:Moton is such a dominant RT, I wouldn't want to move him inside. If we wanna draft him to replace Parnell, I'm all for it. Moton is the best RT prospect in the draft IMO and I believe he would be a big upgrade at RT. Moving him inside to OG would be too much of an experiment. As for Elfein, as I said he's by far the best Center in the draft and I view him as the best Center prospect since Travis Fredrick. I stand by that statement. I also view the Center position as the 2nd most important position on the O-Line, behind LT. With that said, I believe it would be a real waste to move such a talented Center to OG, but I think there is little to no chance the Jags would move Linder from Center. He's really seemed to find his calling at that position. Elfein is one of the best interior run blockers I've seen in a long, long time. He needs to be a Center in the NFL and I see him as a pro bowler several times over. So, that pretty much eliminates him from contention. To me at this point, we either get Lamp, Feeney, Dawkins or we have failed miserably.
Yeah he could easily start day 1 at either spot. His game is perfectly suited to play guard or tackle in the NFL.
Elfein would be grand playing guard in the NFL also.
Quote:Yeah he could easily start day 1 at either spot. His game is perfectly suited to play guard or tackle in the NFL.
Elfein would be grand playing guard in the NFL also.
I just think moving a fantastic Center like Elflein to OG would be like putting custom chrome spinning rims on a 2002 Ford Taurus. Yeah, you can do it, but it's kind of a waste.
There were also plenty of reasons to believe that Marqise Lee and Myles Jack would not have fallen to the Jaguars.
Quote:There were also plenty of reasons to believe that Marqise Lee and Myles Jack would not have fallen to the Jaguars.
Agreed completely. Every year, there are players that fall beyond where they are expected to go.
Quote:There were also plenty of reasons to believe that Marqise Lee and Myles Jack would not have fallen to the Jaguars.
Quote:Agreed completely. Every year, there are players that fall beyond where they are expected to go.
Yep. It's why I made that caveat in the post concerning Dawkins at #35. I think there's a good chance that there is a player available at that pick that is rated much higher than the best available guard and the Jags may benefit.
Some of you know that I give more deference to "need" than some of the purists out there when talking about Jags drafting. So, this draft is a little tough for me since there are several scenarios in which the Jags could land good value at #4 that isn't a glaring need, and land great value at #35 that isn't a glaring need.
It makes the roster better - so obviously I can't complain about it going down that way - I just REALLY hope they are able to draft a plug and play upgrade at guard in round 3 or 4 if they pass on one in the second.
Quote:Yep. It's why I made that caveat in the post concerning Dawkins at #35. I think there's a good chance that there is a player available at that pick that is rated much higher than the best available guard and the Jags may benefit.
Some of you know that I give more deference to "need" than some of the purists out there when talking about Jags drafting. So, this draft is a little tough for me since there are several scenarios in which the Jags could land good value at #4 that isn't a glaring need, and land great value at #35 that isn't a glaring need.
It makes the roster better - so obviously I can't complain about it going down that way - I just REALLY hope they are able to draft a plug and play upgrade at guard in round 3 or 4 if they pass on one in the second.
I think this is spot on.
Fortunately, from a historical perspective, guards can be found in the 3rd round.
On the other hand, OL is such an important need, what I don't want to happen is for there to be a run on the OL before our pick in the 3rd like there was at 2nd round CB in 1998.
There is a part of me that wants to secure at least a good guard in the 2nd, and I would be open to a T and then G or vice versa in 2nd and 3rd round picks.
Quote:Moton is such a dominant RT, I wouldn't want to move him inside. If we wanna draft him to replace Parnell, I'm all for it. Moton is the best RT prospect in the draft IMO and I believe he would be a big upgrade at RT. Moving him inside to OG would be too much of an experiment. As for Elfein, as I said he's by far the best Center in the draft and I view him as the best Center prospect since Travis Fredrick. I stand by that statement. I also view the Center position as the 2nd most important position on the O-Line, behind LT. With that said, I believe it would be a real waste to move such a talented Center to OG, but I think there is little to no chance the Jags would move Linder from Center. He's really seemed to find his calling at that position. Elfein is one of the best interior run blockers I've seen in a long, long time. He needs to be a Center in the NFL and I see him as a pro bowler several times over. So, that pretty much eliminates him from contention. To me at this point, we either get Lamp, Feeney, Dawkins or we have failed miserably.
As for the point in bold, I disagree to an extent.
I think with a tackle, if he has the feet and the frame to play tackle, you can always slide him inside and move him outside later.
Ogden, Ben Coleman, and Leon Searcy are three examples of guys who were inside initially who eventually moved outside and did well.
But even if you were not inclined to move a guy like Moton inside, I would still be okay with taking him as a RT in the second and coming back to take a 3rd round G.
Of course, an OL builder's dream would be to trade down in the first and pick up another late first (i.e. from New Orleans) or a high second (i.e. Cleveland) and just go to work from there-two at the top of the second and maybe even in the 3rd, or maybe even Ramczyk in the first if you were convinced he could play LT.
I cant remember what I ate for dinner last night, and Bullseye remembers there being a run on CBs in the 2nd round of the 1998 draft.
I'm in trouble folks.
Fwiw, I'm hoping we trade down and get our lineman in the first, that way we can pick whoever happens to drop to our spot, regardless of what position they play.
Quote:I cant remember what I ate for dinner last night, and Bullseye remembers there being a run on CBs in the 2nd round of the 1998 draft.
I'm in trouble folks.
Fwiw, I'm hoping we trade down and get our lineman in the first, that way we can pick whoever happens to drop to our spot, regardless of what position they play.
That draft sticks out to me because that's where all of the value was in that round. That was the Dre Bly, Brian Kelly, Samari Rolle draft.
I wanted Bly or Rolle here, and I would have loved to have either with our pick at the bottom of the first.
I was happy with the DD choice, but I immediately wanted to trade up in the second to get Rolle or Bly.
Rolle wound up a tack. Bly wound up a Ram. We wound up with Cordell Taylor.
The rest is history.
I don't want that to happen to us again.
(Tangential thought: Does Tennessee beat us in 1999 if we wound up with Samari Rolle, or at least if Tennessee does not end up with him?)
Quote:That draft sticks out to me because that's where all of the value was in that round. That was the Dre Bly, Brian Kelly, Samari Rolle draft.
I wanted Bly or Rolle here, and I would have loved to have either with our pick at the bottom of the first.
I was happy with the DD choice, but I immediately wanted to trade up in the second to get Rolle or Bly.
Rolle wound up a tack. Bly wound up a Ram. We wound up with Cordell Taylor.
The rest is history.
I don't want that to happen to us again.
(Tangential thought: Does Tennessee beat us in 1999 if we wound up with Samari Rolle, or at least if Tennessee does not end up with him?)
I was a younger guy then, so I appreciate the relishing. I was at both of those home games in 99, and the one against the dolphins.
To think we had a shot at Samari Rolle...man that's an eye opener. He sealed our fate in both of the home losses to them that year. Hindsight is 20/20, but it appears it would've meant everything to us had we indeed traded up to nab him.
Sore thoughts for sure, and I agree in hoping we can avoid them in the future. I kinda want to continue beefing up the secondary now.