Quote:I think the huge dropoff is right before him.
I believe there is a dropoff before him, but I don't consider it a big one at all. I just see Lamp and Feeney as special. I see Dawkins as a very good OG with a chance to be special. After him, the best interior linemen are what I would consider pure Centers (Elflein and Pocic), in a separate category from OG's.
Quote:I believe there is a dropoff before him, but I don't consider it a big one at all. I just see Lamp and Feeney as special. I see Dawkins as a very good OG with a chance to be special. After him, the best interior linemen are what I would consider pure Centers (Elflein and Pocic), in a separate category from OG's.
I can't see a scenario where Dawkins will be a top 10 or 15 player left on the board at 35.
The question really is, do we want to be a good team or do we just want to not be a bad team?
Good teams don't make reaches like Fournette at 4 or Dawkins at 35. Teams that are simply not wanting to be bad will shirk BAP to desperately fill needs.
Unfortunately at this point too many fans (and I fear even our front office) are simply content with not being bad.
Quote:I can't see a scenario where Dawkins will be a top 10 or 15 player left on the board at 35.
The question really is, do we want to be a good team or do we just want to not be a bad team?
Good teams don't make reaches like Fournette at 4 or Dawkins at 35. Teams that are simply not wanting to be bad will shirk BAP to desperately fill needs.
Unfortunately at this point too many fans (and I fear even our front office) are simply content with not being bad.
You are really low on Fournette. As everyone knows, I'd much rather have D'Onta Foreman as our RB, but I also really like Fournette,
as long as the O-Line gets addressed. As it stands now, drafting Fournette would be a disaster due to lack of run blocking, but if we address spots on the O-Line, I'm fine with Fournette and believe he can be a very good RB. I'd much rather trade down and draft an OG or a future LT, but if we stay at #4, I don't see any players that really stand out. We addressed the D-Line with Campbell, we addressed Safety with Church, we addressed cornerback with Bouye, so there is no need to draft a guy at those positions who would be sitting the bench or end up being a rotational guy. The QB's in this draft suck, so what other positions make sense? If we take a player at #4, I want a full-time starter, not someone to develop. Developmental players are for later rounds. I still say the move that makes the most sense is a trade down though.
Quote:Siragusa >>> Dawkins
I like Siragusa, but he's nowhere near as good as Dawkins. Siragusa is a 3rd rounder.
Quote:You are really low on Fournette. As everyone knows, I'd much rather have D'Onta Foreman as our RB, but I also really like Fournette, as long as the O-Line gets addressed. As it stands now, drafting Fournette would be a disaster due to lack of run blocking, but if we address spots on the O-Line, I'm fine with Fournette and believe he can be a very good RB. I'd much rather trade down and draft an OG or a future LT, but if we stay at #4, I don't see any players that really stand out. We addressed the D-Line with Campbell, we addressed Safety with Church, we addressed cornerback with Bouye, so there is no need to draft a guy at those positions who would be sitting the bench or end up being a rotational guy. The QB's in this draft suck, so what other positions make sense? If we take a player at #4, I want a full-time starter, not someone to develop. Developmental players are for later rounds. I still say the move that makes the most sense is a trade down though.
Good teams take players that will be rotational guys with first rounders. Like taking Umenyiora's and JPP's when you already have Kiwanuka's and Tuck's.
Again, passing on BAPs like Thomas/Lattimore etc to take a RB of all things would be indicative of a team there merely doesn't want to be bad.
I don't want to not be a bad franchise. I want to be a good franchise.
Quote:I like Siragusa, but he's nowhere near as good as Dawkins. Siragusa is a 3rd rounder.
Damn he does look pretty good. As a guard I'd still probably go with Siragusa though. Could do a ton for our run game.
I'd rather Moton than Dawkins in the 2nd and I'd rather Siragusa in the 3rd over Dawkins in the 2nd.
Quote:Good teams take players that will be rotational guys with first rounders. Like taking Umenyiora's and JPP's when you already have Kiwanuka's and Tuck's.
Again, passing on BAPs like Thomas/Lattimore etc to take a RB of all things would be indicative of a team there merely doesn't want to be bad.
I don't want to not be a bad franchise. I want to be a good franchise.
A. You have to already be a good team to have that drafting philosophy. When you have huge needs at certain positions, you have to fill them with the best possible players. When you are a team like the Patriots, you take the best available player at any position even if you have one or two guys ahead of him on the depth chart. They have that luxury. We'll never get to that point though if we don't fill our gaping holes.
B. I see nothing special about either Thomas or Lattimore. I believe there are about 4-5 CB's who could be taken first at that position. No one stands out there. As for Thomas, I just don't get the fascination with him. Personally, if I were gonna take a DE, I'd rather have Barnett.
C. None of us want to be a bad franchise, but until we fill major needs, we're gonna be.
Quote:Damn he does look pretty good. As a guard I'd still probably go with Siragusa though. Could do a ton for our run game.
Siragusa is a good player. He needs a power scheme to excel though. I don't know how well he'd do in a ZBS.
Quote:A. You have to already be a good team to have that drafting philosophy. When you have huge needs at certain positions, you have to fill them with the best possible players. When you are a team like the Patriots, you take the best available player at any position even if you have one or two guys ahead of him on the depth chart. They have that luxury. We'll never get to that point though if we don't fill our gaping holes.
B. I see nothing special about either Thomas or Lattimore. I believe there are about 4-5 CB's who could be taken first at that position. No one stands out there. As for Thomas, I just don't get the fascination with him. Personally, if I were gonna take a DE, I'd rather have Barnett.
C. None of us want to be a bad franchise, but until we fill major needs, we're gonna be.
A. We only have two gaping holes now. Fournette isn't an LG or TE though. I guess I'm already past debating Dawkins I really don't care. He wouldn't be as good as many of the players at 35 but it's not so bad that I would hate it. RB at 4 is the only thing that would be truly dumb.
B. We aren't going to get anywhere then cause I think they can both both special. Barnett over Thomas..yikes.
Quote:Siragusa is a good player. He needs a power scheme to excel though. I don't know how well he'd do in a ZBS.
He played in a zone blocking scheme my man
Quote:He played in a zone blocking scheme my man
I thought San Diego State played a power scheme. My bad.
Quote:Good teams take players that will be rotational guys with first rounders. Like taking Umenyiora's and JPP's when you already have Kiwanuka's and Tuck's.
Again, passing on BAPs like Thomas/Lattimore etc to take a RB of all things would be indicative of a team there merely doesn't want to be bad.
I don't want to not be a bad franchise. I want to be a good franchise.
Bro, we had (2) 100 yard games by our RBs last year. None of our RBs even rushed for 500 yards.
We absolutely have to address the running back position. Fournette is being compared to Bo friggin Jackson and has been said to run with better pad-level then Adrian friggin Peterson.
Fournette will touch the ball 25 times a game and will heavily impact our entire offense and take tons of pressure off Bortles.
No other player will impact or help Bortles as much as Fournette will. I have no idea why you are against the best RB in the draft.
If I told you he would rush for 1200 yards and score 8 TDs and help us keep the lead late in the 4th quarter, then you will take that every time. Not some DE or DT that is going to rotate in and out and possibly give us 7 or 8 sacks.
Wake up kid. Fournette is the best possible draft pick for this team. Heck even if we were picking #1 overall, he would still have the biggest impact on our aweful QB.
Quote:Bro, we had (2) 100 yard games by our RBs last year. None of our RBs even rushed for 500 yards.
We absolutely have to address the running back position. Fournette is being compared to Bo friggin Jackson and has been said to run with better pad-level then Adrian friggin Peterson.
Fournette will touch the ball 25 times a game and will heavily impact our entire offense and take tons of pressure off Bortles.
No other player will impact or help Bortles as much as Fournette will. I have no idea why you are against the best RB in the draft.
If I told you he would rush for 1200 yards and score 8 TDs and help us keep the lead late in the 4th quarter, then you will take that every time. Not some DE or DT that is going to rotate in and out and possibly give us 7 or 8 sacks.
Wake up kid. Fournette is the best possible draft pick for this team. Heck even if we were picking #1 overall, he would still have the biggest impact on our aweful QB.
I am not saying to ignore RB. Plenty of day 2 would help. I also don't think Fournette is the best RB in the draft, I think he absolutely behind Mixon and McCaffrey.
Even if he was though, I just don't take the position with the shortest career, shortest peak, most injuries, and longest injuries at 4. Especially not when he already has a chronic ankle issue that will need surgery at some point to begin with.
Fournette isnt Bo
Hes not even close to Bo
Not even in the same universe as Bo
Just stop bringing that up.
Quote:Fournette isnt Bo
Hes not even close to Bo
Not even in the same universe as Bo
Just stop bringing that up.
You're right. The RB I compare him to is Jerome Bettis, as long as he stays healthy.
Quote:I am not saying to ignore RB. Plenty of day 2 would help. I also don't think Fournette is the best RB in the draft, I think he absolutely behind Mixon and McCaffrey.
Even if he was though, I just don't take the position with the shortest career, shortest peak, most injuries, and longest injuries at 4. Especially not when he already has a chronic ankle issue that will need surgery at some point to begin with.
You could say the same thing about any position. We can find a DT in Day 2, or a DE.
And GlockBortles, it's not me comparing. It's the experts.
Quote:You are really low on Fournette. As everyone knows, I'd much rather have D'Onta Foreman as our RB, but I also really like Fournette, as long as the O-Line gets addressed. As it stands now, drafting Fournette would be a disaster due to lack of run blocking, but if we address spots on the O-Line, I'm fine with Fournette and believe he can be a very good RB. I'd much rather trade down and draft an OG or a future LT, but if we stay at #4, I don't see any players that really stand out. We addressed the D-Line with Campbell, we addressed Safety with Church, we addressed cornerback with Bouye, so there is no need to draft a guy at those positions who would be sitting the bench or end up being a rotational guy. The QB's in this draft suck, so what other positions make sense? If we take a player at #4, I want a full-time starter, not someone to develop. Developmental players are for later rounds. I still say the move that makes the most sense is a trade down though.
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I would point out that defenses play nickle defense most of the time, and that means 3 CBs. If we draft the best CB at #4, we would have possibly the best combination of 3 CBs in the league.
Also, we addressed the D-line with Campbell, but D-linemen rotate, and you need 8 of them to keep the pressure in the opposing offense, so we could just as well draft a D-lineman at #4.
In my mind, Fournette does not represent an absolute need. I also don't think he's one of the top 8 players in the draft.
I think we have an absolute need on the offensive line. So, I would be fine with drafting the best available player at #4, which would probably be a defensive player, and then going O-line in rounds 2 and 3.
But, all that said, I totally agree with you on the importance of upgrading our offensive line.