Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:Kobes prime was during a time when NBA stars could still create their own shots without needing 5 picks set.


The good old days!

No reply to earlier posts????

Quote:No reply to earlier posts????

 

What was there to reply to? I don't agree that Shaq was better than Kobe.

Quote:What was there to reply to? I don't agree that Shaq was better than Kobe.

 

I can't stand Bryant...but there's no way in hell that Shaq was a better basketball player.

Quote:I can't stand Bryant...but there's no way in hell that Shaq was a better basketball player.

The argument is 1999-2002 Shaq or 1999-2002 Kobe. Who was the better player?

Quote:The argument is 1999-2002 Shaq or 1999-2002 Kobe. Who was the better player?

 

I posted my answer.

 

I don't give a crap what years you want to cherry-pick.

Quote:I posted my answer.


I don't give a crap what years you want to cherry-pick.

Well that's how the discussion came about.

Prime Shaq> Prime Kobe for me.

Quote:Kobes prime was during a time when NBA stars could still create their own shots without needing 5 picks set.

The good old days!

Real basketball, days of posting up in the box and dominating the paint or driving to the basket and dunking on people. Todays basketball is like watching womens basketball. Sissy ball. lol

Quote:The argument is 1999-2002 Shaq or 1999-2002 Kobe. Who was the better player?

 

Your post #49 said Shaq was better. It wasn't until I disagreed with your opinion that your selected years with playoff stats that supported your opinion. 

 

If you poll 30 GM's who are starting a team from scratch with prime Kobe and Shaq available with the 1st pick, 25 GM's are picking Kobe. Not taking away anything from Shaq, as he was the most dominant big man in NBA history IMO, but Kobe's position is far more premium than center.

Quote:Your post #49 said Shaq was better. It wasn't until I disagreed with your opinion that your selected years with playoff stats that supported your opinion.


If you poll 30 GM's who are starting a team from scratch with prime Kobe and Shaq available with the 1st pick, 25 GM's are picking Kobe. Not taking away anything from Shaq, as he was the most dominant big man in NBA history IMO, but Kobe's position is far more premium than center.

Good attempt at a strawman but actually you said Kobe was the best player on the Lakers, and I said Shaq was,you then used PPG stats to state why Kobe was better and I replied with Shaqs finals stats to which you didn't reply.


I rather have Kobe in this era to build a team from scratch with,for his leadership.Thats not what we were discussing though.Kobe's poisiton is far more premium now but not back then. Which is why I say again if we go back in time to 1999 and tell 30 GMs to repeat the Lakers 3 peat but you can only pick Shaq or Kobe,90% of them would pick Shaq.

Quote:Your post #49 said Shaq was better. It wasn't until I disagreed with your opinion that your selected years with playoff stats that supported your opinion. 

 

If you poll 30 GM's who are starting a team from scratch with prime Kobe and Shaq available with the 1st pick, 25 GM's are picking Kobe. Not taking away anything from Shaq, as he was the most dominant big man in NBA history IMO, but Kobe's position is far more premium than center.

 

15-20 years ago, Center was a premium position.

Quote:I can't stand Bryant...but there's no way in hell that Shaq was a better basketball player.

 

Prime Shaq was possibly the post dominant player of all time. It's at least debatable.

Taking their careers side by side I think its fairly easy to see Kobe had the better one.

Quote:Prime Shaq was possibly the post dominant player of all time. It's at least debatable.

 

I don't think anybody is debating Shaq's dominance at the center position. 

 

All I am saying is Kobe won 2 rings without Shaq after he left being the alpha on his team and Shaq rode Wade's coattails to his 4th ring in Miami. My point is, Kobe would have had success with or without Shaq.

Quote:I don't think anybody is debating Shaq's dominance at the center position. 

 

All I am saying is Kobe won 2 rings without Shaq after he left being the alpha on his team and Shaq rode Wade's coattails to his 4th ring in Miami. My point is, Kobe would have had success with or without Shaq.

 

It's a stupid comparison because Shaq was 32 and out of his prime by the time he left Miami while Kobe was 26.

Quote:Epitome of a one-dimensional player.

 

Rico calls Kobe the epitome of a one dimensional player but then say there is no way Shaq was better than Kobe?

 

This guy is pretty slow, eh?

Quote:Your post #49 said Shaq was better. It wasn't until I disagreed with your opinion that your selected years with playoff stats that supported your opinion. 

 

If you poll 30 GM's who are starting a team from scratch with prime Kobe and Shaq available with the 1st pick, 25 GM's are picking Kobe. Not taking away anything from Shaq, as he was the most dominant big man in NBA history IMO, but Kobe's position is far more premium than center.

 

Yeah, that's not exactly how it went.

 

Vicbow Rules

"I think the major argument is that for 3 of Kobe's 5 championships he wasn't even the best player on his team.  That has been the main argument I have heard about Kobe's 5 rings. "

 

You replied to that statement by saying:

"Also, Kobe WAS the best player on the Lakers."

 

 

Considering the context, that would mean you are telling Vicbow that Kobe was the best player on those championship teams.

 

 

 

THAT is when JackCity responded and said Shaq was (which, in context, is focusing on those 3 championship years with Shaq that Vicbow originally mentioned).

Quote:Yeah, that's not exactly how it went.

 

Vicbow Rules

"I think the major argument is that for 3 of Kobe's 5 championships he wasn't even the best player on his team.  That has been the main argument I have heard about Kobe's 5 rings. "

 

You replied to that statement by saying:

"Also, Kobe WAS the best player on the Lakers."

 

 

Considering the context, that would mean you are telling Vicbow that Kobe was the best player on those championship teams.

 

 

 

THAT is when JackCity responded and said Shaq was (which, in context, is focusing on those 3 championship years with Shaq that Vicbow originally mentioned).

 

I haven't changed my opinion that Kobe was the best player on the championship teams. I didn't even like Kobe when he played, but appreciate his greatness. I have no dog in the fight.

Quote:I haven't changed my opinion that Kobe was the best player on the championship teams. I didn't even like Kobe when he played, but appreciate his greatness. I have no dog in the fight.

 

I didn't think you did, but stop twisting the facts by saying stuff like "your post #49 said Shaq was better. It wasn't until I disagreed with your opinion that your selected years with playoff stats that supported your opinion."

 

 

I have no dog in the fight, either. I'm a Pistons fan from Michigan. In fact, you could go back and find me supporting Kobe on this forum. I just happen to be a really big NBA fan and can objectively concede that prime Shaq, especially during a those title years, was possibly the most dominant player ever. Citing that 32 year old Shaq was the 2nd option to Wade years later is stupid because we aren't comparing 32 year old Shaq to prime Kobe. You've done so twice, as if it has any relevance.

Quote:Prime Shaq was possibly the post dominant player of all time. It's at least debatable.

 

You call me slow and you make a STUPID statement like this.  Like REALLY, REALLY, stupid.

Quote:You call me slow and you make a STUPID statement like this.  Like REALLY, REALLY, stupid.

 

Not nearly as stupid as calling Kobe a one dimensional player. When you said that, you immediately gave up any NBA credibility you might have had. Define "one dimensional".