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Investing on defense earlier than I thought.

#1
(This post was last modified: 04-02-2019, 07:38 AM by irontrooper83.)

When signing Foles became an option one of the things I liked about the situation was that going with Foles we could basically invest the first 3 rounds picks solely on offense to give him more weapons.
As we get closer to the draft I find myself quite changing philosphy with it and thinking that investing picks on defense early could/should be more valuable.

I love TJ Hockenson and I would be happy with him being the pick at 7 but here's some of my thoughts on overall draft philosphy based on the current roster:

-As much as an hopefully healthier and more talented offense will definitely help if we'll be in the mix to compete for a championship it'll be mainly because of our defense. An injury to one of Calais/Yannick would be devastating on that side of the ball. 
Adding a potentially elite DL in the first to help with the rotation (Smoot, who if healthy I hope makes a big improvement, is our third down rusher at the moment and while we could do worse than him we could definitely improve) would help a lot.

-Kind of same reasoning about the safety position. I really like Harrison and he is an improvement over Church, I like what Wilson has shown in limited time but I think it would be important to take a talented safety to minimize risks: would we feel comfortable eventually going with Cody Davis or a CJ Reavis as the starter in case of an injury or if Wilson doesn't show the consistency needed on a starter role?
I'm not saying we should spend the first 2 picks on defense (DL&S) but maybe the early 3rd or trading back into the second round eventually? I'm not sure there's much talent after round 3-4 in this class at that position but if someone has any names in mind I'd love to get more info about them.

-Offense needs help at starting RT, depth and absolutely at TE. (I would add RG but Cann is here to stay) Like I said I love Hockenson, I really like Fant but there are really a lot of guys (Sternberger, Knox, Moreau, Irvin Smith JR etc) that can be taken in late second or in the third that can help. 
Hockenson is probably on another level and can help immediately and that's why I'd be happy with him at 7 but I think "securing" better depth and talent on Dline in case of injuries and to add to the rotation is at the moment more important for the win now situation we are in. 
Taylor at 7 would be the worst option among them all to me probably.

-WR could need help as well but I prioritize solidifying OL, improving TE and making sure the defense has more talent and depth in case of injuries at key positions is more important to me. So no WR (unless someone falls massively) until the 4th round to me (unless we trade down and we have multiple picks)
In my opinion our success on offense will rely more on healthy and functioning OL and TE rather than inveting early picks on WRs.

-Obviously we took Ngakoue in the 3rd and in a draft so loaded with defensive talent there will probably be some edge rusher/DL available later. I haven't digged that deep with the scouting of defensive players, any names that could really provide a spark in rushing the passer in round 2-3-4?

My favourite scenario at the moment is still trading down and getting more picks. I doubt it happens but if it does an additional 2nd/3rd round pick (maybe a 5th as well if it's a 3rd rouner) would help massively as it would allow us to trade back into the first and in the second if we needed to.


I just think a potentially elite DL talent in the first, with OL in the second, safety and TE in the third (or trading back into the second for the guy you really like at those positions) is a better way to help the team than a great Hockenson in the first and a lesser DL talent later in the draft. (you can always find a Ngakoue later but you know what I mean).

Is anyone else steering towards thinking we should invest more and earlier than we thought on defense compared to what we maybe thought a couple of months ago?
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#2
(This post was last modified: 04-02-2019, 08:11 AM by flgatorsandjags.)

I'd be good with Jaylon Ferguson in the 2nd if we draft Taylor in the 1st

If we could bring Parnell back going defense in the 1st would be a lot easier
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#3

(04-02-2019, 07:37 AM)irontrooper83 Wrote: When signing Foles became an option one of the things I liked about the situation was that going with Foles we could basically invest the first 3 rounds picks solely on offense to give him more weapons.
As we get closer to the draft I find myself quite changing philosphy with it and thinking that investing picks on defense early could/should be more valuable.

I love TJ Hockenson and I would be happy with him being the pick at 7 but here's some of my thoughts on overall draft philosphy based on the current roster:

-As much as an hopefully healthier and more talented offense will definitely help if we'll be in the mix to compete for a championship it'll be mainly because of our defense. An injury to one of Calais/Yannick would be devastating on that side of the ball. 
Adding a potentially elite DL in the first to help with the rotation (Smoot, who if healthy I hope makes a big improvement, is our third down rusher at the moment and while we could do worse than him we could definitely improve) would help a lot.

-Kind of same reasoning about the safety position. I really like Harrison and he is an improvement over Church, I like what Wilson has shown in limited time but I think it would be important to take a talented safety to minimize risks: would we feel comfortable eventually going with Cody Davis or a CJ Reavis as the starter in case of an injury or if Wilson doesn't show the consistency needed on a starter role?
I'm not saying we should spend the first 2 picks on defense (DL&S) but maybe the early 3rd or trading back into the second round eventually? I'm not sure there's much talent after round 3-4 in this class at that position but if someone has any names in mind I'd love to get more info about them.

-Offense needs help at starting RT, depth and absolutely at TE. (I would add RG but Cann is here to stay) Like I said I love Hockenson, I really like Fant but there are really a lot of guys (Sternberger, Knox, Moreau, Irvin Smith JR etc) that can be taken in late second or in the third that can help. 
Hockenson is probably on another level and can help immediately and that's why I'd be happy with him at 7 but I think "securing" better depth and talent on Dline in case of injuries and to add to the rotation is at the moment more important for the win now situation we are in. 
Taylor at 7 would be the worst option among them all to me probably.

-WR could need help as well but I prioritize solidifying OL, improving TE and making sure the defense has more talent and depth in case of injuries at key positions is more important to me. So no WR (unless someone falls massively) until the 4th round to me (unless we trade down and we have multiple picks)
In my opinion our success on offense will rely more on healthy and functioning OL and TE rather than inveting early picks on WRs.

-Obviously we took Ngakoue in the 3rd and in a draft so loaded with defensive talent there will probably be some edge rusher/DL available later. I haven't digged that deep with the scouting of defensive players, any names that could really provide a spark in rushing the passer in round 2-3-4?

My favourite scenario at the moment is still trading down and getting more picks. I doubt it happens but if it does an additional 2nd/3rd round pick (maybe a 5th as well if it's a 3rd rouner) would help massively as it would allow us to trade back into the first and in the second if we needed to.


I just think a potentially elite DL talent in the first, with OL in the second, safety and TE in the third (or trading back into the second for the guy you really like at those positions) is a better way to help the team than a great Hockenson in the first and a lesser DL talent later in the draft. (you can always find a Ngakoue later but you know what I mean).

Is anyone else steering towards thinking we should invest more and earlier than we thought on defense compared to what we maybe thought a couple of months ago?

Great post, and I'm pretty much with you on everything. If they think that someone like Oliver or Sweat will be a perrennial pro bowler then they have to take them if they are there. I would have no problems with that at all now. I know many would though. In the next few years both Campbell and Dareus will be gone, if we have a chance to get an elite interior or edge pass rusher we shouldn't pass it up...

As for your comment that I have put in bold, I'm gonna assume you meant to say 'can't' instead of 'can', right?
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#4

I have a feeling we will go defense eith our first pick. I am thinking DT or DE. Depending on who falls to us.
[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSIM9bZmkezB9B4qD2qAtT...IGQHCZIPuA]
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#5

Along these lines of thinking, I just did this draft on fanspeak.

7: R1P7
DL QUINNEN WILLIAMS
ALABAMA
38: R2P6
EDGE CHASE WINOVICH
MICHIGAN
69: R3P5
S CHAUNCEY GARDNER-JOHNSON
FLORIDA
98: R3P34
OT BOBBY EVANS
OKLAHOMA
109: R4P7
TE JACE STERNBERGER
TEXAS A&M
178: R6P5
WR MILES BOYKIN
NOTRE DAME
236: R7P22
RB JAMES WILLIAMS
WASHINGTON ST.

Which is all very nice and all if you ignore the fact that the probability of Sternberger and Boykin being there at those picks is less than 5%...
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#6

(04-02-2019, 07:37 AM)irontrooper83 Wrote: When signing Foles became an option one of the things I liked about the situation was that going with Foles we could basically invest the first 3 rounds picks solely on offense to give him more weapons.
As we get closer to the draft I find myself quite changing philosphy with it and thinking that investing picks on defense early could/should be more valuable.

I love TJ Hockenson and I would be happy with him being the pick at 7 but here's some of my thoughts on overall draft philosphy based on the current roster:

-As much as an hopefully healthier and more talented offense will definitely help if we'll be in the mix to compete for a championship it'll be mainly because of our defense. An injury to one of Calais/Yannick would be devastating on that side of the ball. 
Adding a potentially elite DL in the first to help with the rotation (Smoot, who if healthy I hope makes a big improvement, is our third down rusher at the moment and while we could do worse than him we could definitely improve) would help a lot.

-Kind of same reasoning about the safety position. I really like Harrison and he is an improvement over Church, I like what Wilson has shown in limited time but I think it would be important to take a talented safety to minimize risks: would we feel comfortable eventually going with Cody Davis or a CJ Reavis as the starter in case of an injury or if Wilson doesn't show the consistency needed on a starter role?
I'm not saying we should spend the first 2 picks on defense (DL&S) but maybe the early 3rd or trading back into the second round eventually? I'm not sure there's much talent after round 3-4 in this class at that position but if someone has any names in mind I'd love to get more info about them.

-Offense needs help at starting RT, depth and absolutely at TE. (I would add RG but Cann is here to stay) Like I said I love Hockenson, I really like Fant but there are really a lot of guys (Sternberger, Knox, Moreau, Irvin Smith JR etc) that can be taken in late second or in the third that can help. 
Hockenson is probably on another level and can help immediately and that's why I'd be happy with him at 7 but I think "securing" better depth and talent on Dline in case of injuries and to add to the rotation is at the moment more important for the win now situation we are in. 
Taylor at 7 would be the worst option among them all to me probably.

-WR could need help as well but I prioritize solidifying OL, improving TE and making sure the defense has more talent and depth in case of injuries at key positions is more important to me. So no WR (unless someone falls massively) until the 4th round to me (unless we trade down and we have multiple picks)
In my opinion our success on offense will rely more on healthy and functioning OL and TE rather than inveting early picks on WRs.

-Obviously we took Ngakoue in the 3rd and in a draft so loaded with defensive talent there will probably be some edge rusher/DL available later. I haven't digged that deep with the scouting of defensive players, any names that could really provide a spark in rushing the passer in round 2-3-4?

My favourite scenario at the moment is still trading down and getting more picks. I doubt it happens but if it does an additional 2nd/3rd round pick (maybe a 5th as well if it's a 3rd rouner) would help massively as it would allow us to trade back into the first and in the second if we needed to.


I just think a potentially elite DL talent in the first, with OL in the second, safety and TE in the third (or trading back into the second for the guy you really like at those positions) is a better way to help the team than a great Hockenson in the first and a lesser DL talent later in the draft. (you can always find a Ngakoue later but you know what I mean).

Is anyone else steering towards thinking we should invest more and earlier than we thought on defense compared to what we maybe thought a couple of months ago?

Not in the slightest. I wouldn't touch defense until the late 3rd or early 4th round.
Reply

#7

Winovich is not getting nearly enough love, I'd be very happy with him at 38 if we go Hock/OL at 7. He's the only pass rusher I like after the top of the first round ones. He was way better than Gary in college, and tested almost as athletic as him too.
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#8

(04-02-2019, 12:20 PM)Upper Wrote: Winovich is not getting nearly enough love, I'd be very happy with him at 38 if we go Hock/OL at 7. He's the only pass rusher I like after the top of the first round ones. He was way better than Gary in college, and tested almost as athletic as him too.

We completely agree on this one.
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#9

Yeah you having him in that mock is what reminded me he was worth mentioning. There has been a bunch of talk about DL at 7, but very little about DL on day 2.
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