I love how, of all the things this board could possibly have universal agreement on, it's that we all think student loan repayment is a bad idea. Maybe we should send this thread link to AOC.

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So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

Irrelevant, it's your Country and your government that ows the debt.

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I love how, of all the things this board could possibly have universal agreement on, it's that we all think student loan repayment is a bad idea. Maybe we should send this thread link to AOC.

I'm not opposed completely,  I just think that we have to fix it with more than just forgiveness.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

If kids quit going to these expensive liberal arts colleges and getting degrees that have no application in the real job world, we wouldn't even be discussing this.

Like me. I have a Bachelor's degree in Creative Writing from Miami University (OH). I got a scholarship though. I ended up graduating and working at a casino.

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So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

Reparations for slavery would've been a good idea.......... if it was addressed 150 years ago. Now, it's pointless. All those effected by slavery are long since dead. Besides, if anyone deserves reparations, it's Native Americans. We stole their land, raped their women, killed them in masses and sent them to live on reservations in places we had no use for, (until we find it rich in natural resources and in that case, we do what we want and to Hell with them.) They have been treated worse than ANY group of people in American history and I see no one pleading for them to get reparations.

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People with degrees likely earn more and pay more tax anyway.

Also since when was tax a pick and choose which bits you pay for system?

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People with degrees likely earn more and pay more tax anyway.

Also since when was tax a pick and choose which bits you pay for system?

Since AOC, mostly.

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My husband paid his way through college by working his butt off. He took out no loans and had no scholarships. He has a degree in business management and one in architecture. It can be done. 

As for these lunatics wanting to forgive all of this debt? They are setting a bad example on so many levels. Instead of forgiving loans they need to go after the universities and colleges who charge far above what's really necessary, but they won't. Jackholes.

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In my opinion, there is a crisis, and there are two types of people behaving badly that create and perpetuate the crisis.

I've heard of students taking out the maximum loan amount every semester even though they needed far less, and spending the difference on pub crawls and fraternity dues and other non-essentials.

And we all know that colleges and universities, especially private for profit ones, are charging tuition that is way out of line to the value of the education. Charging tens of thousands of dollars for licensing in fields like dental hygienist and radiology tech - stuff the community college down the road can train you for, for much less money.

I think we can tackle both bad behaviors with a simple, elegant change:
1) student loans get repaid based on income for a pre-determined number of years
2) if there is still money owed after the years are over, the college or the university pays the lender that amount.

Colleges will be more careful about who they admit, and how much they charge, with these two simple changes.
And the taxpayer won't need to be on the hook as much.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

In my opinion, there is a crisis, and there are two types of people behaving badly that create and perpetuate the crisis.

I've heard of students taking out the maximum loan amount every semester even though they needed far less, and spending the difference on pub crawls and fraternity dues and other non-essentials.

And we all know that colleges and universities, especially private for profit ones, are charging tuition that is way out of line to the value of the education.  Charging tens of thousands of dollars for licensing in fields like dental hygienist and radiology tech - stuff the community college down the road can train you for, for much less money.

I think we can tackle both bad behaviors with a simple, elegant change:
1) student loans get repaid based on income for a pre-determined number of years
2) if there is still money owed after the years are over, the college or the university pays the lender that amount.

Colleges will be more careful about who they admit, and how much they charge, with these two simple changes.
And the taxpayer won't need to be on the hook as much.

I have a much more elegant solution.  Get the government out of the student loan business.   If we do that, then lenders will be much more careful whom they lend to, and for what courses.  Colleges will be forced to control their expenses and tuition rates, or they won't have any students.

---

So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

You are preaching to the choir.  I have no idea how people would prove they have a slave ancestor.  I suppose they could do like Elizabeth Warren and take a DNA test, but they would have to start with a database of slave DNA, and I don't think it's possible to gather all the slave DNA or even prove that some long buried skeleton was a slave.  

I watched the hearings on reparations, and there was no discussion of the practicalities involved in such a program.  It was all just a listing of grievances.  Nothing about how such a program of reparations would actually work.  How much money, who gets paid, how do we figure out who gets paid, etc etc.  

I think a lot of these Democratic candidates are so hell-bent on winning the primary that they are willing to sacrifice the general election.  You can't run that far to the left and still win the general election.

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So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

Wouldn't putting a price on your ancestors suffering be almost as morally wrong as their suffering itself?

What is the price? $1000? $2000? $20000? What price makes the sin go away?

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Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

Wouldn't putting a price on your ancestors suffering be almost as morally wrong as their suffering itself?

What is the price? $1000? $2000? $20000? What price makes the sin go away?

That's another legitimate question.  If we pay off the descendants of slaves, what do we get for our money?  Forgiveness?  Will we all love each other and stop screaming at each other?  Can all the rape and murder and theft of our ancestors be made right with a payoff?  

The whole idea is obscene on so many levels.

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If we're being honest. The votes that the Dems are chasing with this scheme aren't going to be from the ones that have the mental ability to attend college. On a more technical note, it's another targeted tax that won't pass the constitutional sniff test.

Actually, if you look at who is supporting this, they're either currently attending or up to their necks in debt after graduating from liberal arts colleges. They bought into the narrative that you have to have a college degree to succeed in life, and if you can't afford it, the government will happily loan you whatever you need.

Bernie and the other dems proposing this (aside from AOC who is just regurgitating whatever her handlers tell her to say) know perfectly well that it won't pass the constitutional test.  It's not about actually doing it.  It's about hoodwinking the ignorant masses into voting for you because you've promised them free stuff.

So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

You missed one.  Pokahonkey Warren proposed reparations for homosexuals this week.  Seriously.  

So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

It's an impossible proposal.  It's just another pandering point that these candidates know plays well in polling, but they also know there's no way that the country could afford to do this, and they know the federal government would screw up managing the process.

There are exceptions to every scenario and I would consider this one not unheard of. Higher education has become very left leaning especially in the arts and sciences concentrations. These same people are the ones screaming about the National Debt. Always some kind of weird contradiction in beliefs or supports.

Anyways. This sums things up pretty well...

https://twitter.com/DanCrenshawTX/status...0914884608

Dan Crenshaw, future POTUS.

From your lips to God's ears. The guy is just phenomenal.

Regarding the part in bold.  How would it be determined which black people are descendants of slaves and which are descendants of black people who actually owned slaves?  What about those of us taxpayers that have no family history of ever owning slaves?

Reparations for slavery would've been a good idea.......... if it was addressed 150 years ago. Now, it's pointless. All those effected by slavery are long since dead. Besides, if anyone deserves reparations, it's Native Americans. We stole their land, raped their women, killed them in masses and sent them to live on reservations in places we had no use for, (until we find it rich in natural resources and in that case, we do what we want and to Hell with them.) They have been treated worse than ANY group of people in American history and I see no one pleading for them to get reparations.

Hey now. Indians got the casinos, and you got a job at one of the casinos, so be careful here.

In my opinion, there is a crisis, and there are two types of people behaving badly that create and perpetuate the crisis.

I've heard of students taking out the maximum loan amount every semester even though they needed far less, and spending the difference on pub crawls and fraternity dues and other non-essentials.

And we all know that colleges and universities, especially private for profit ones, are charging tuition that is way out of line to the value of the education.  Charging tens of thousands of dollars for licensing in fields like dental hygienist and radiology tech - stuff the community college down the road can train you for, for much less money.

I think we can tackle both bad behaviors with a simple, elegant change:
1) student loans get repaid based on income for a pre-determined number of years
2) if there is still money owed after the years are over, the college or the university pays the lender that amount.

Colleges will be more careful about who they admit, and how much they charge, with these two simple changes.
And the taxpayer won't need to be on the hook as much.

I have a much more elegant solution.  Get the government out of the student loan business.   If we do that, then lenders will be much more careful whom they lend to, and for what courses.  Colleges will be forced to control their expenses and tuition rates, or they won't have any students.

BINGO!!

The perception today since Obama took over the student loan system is that there are unlimited funds for students to borrow.  Since everything is backed by the federal government, banks will give loans out for whatever amount to just about anyone.  College tuitions have been steadily increasing for decades, but the acceleration since the feds took over the student loan process is ridiculous.  

What's really irritating is how these colleges that raise their rates the most constantly poor mouth and say it's necessary despite the fact that most of the elite schools in the country including state run universities have endowments in the trillions.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

If we're being honest. The votes that the Dems are chasing with this scheme aren't going to be from the ones that have the mental ability to attend college. On a more technical note, it's another targeted tax that won't pass the constitutional sniff test.

Actually, if you look at who is supporting this, they're either currently attending or up to their necks in debt after graduating from liberal arts colleges.  They bought into the narrative that you have to have a college degree to succeed in life, and if you can't afford it, the government will happily loan you whatever you need.

Bernie and the other dems proposing this (aside from AOC who is just regurgitating whatever her handlers tell her to say) know perfectly well that it won't pass the constitutional test.  It's not about actually doing it.  It's about hoodwinking the ignorant masses into voting for you because you've promised them free stuff.

So far the Democratic candidates have proposed:  

Reparations for slavery.
Forgive all student debt.  
Make college free.
Let everyone in prison vote.
Open borders.  Don't believe me?  Read this-  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth...e90da46c88
Raising taxes.  

What's next?  Forgive all mortgages?  Give everyone a million dollars?

Forgiving student loans will add another TRILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS to the federal debt.  
Oh, you already paid your loan?  Screw you.  You get nothing.

We have a MORON in the White House, but we have NO ALTERNATIVE.  The Democrats have lost their minds.

You missed one.  Pokahonkey Warren proposed reparations for homosexuals this week.  Seriously.  

Link? I don't doubt you, I've just gotta see that one for myself. If she ever becomes President, we are all so screwed beyond belief.

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Actually, if you look at who is supporting this, they're either currently attending or up to their necks in debt after graduating from liberal arts colleges.  They bought into the narrative that you have to have a college degree to succeed in life, and if you can't afford it, the government will happily loan you whatever you need.

Bernie and the other dems proposing this (aside from AOC who is just regurgitating whatever her handlers tell her to say) know perfectly well that it won't pass the constitutional test.  It's not about actually doing it.  It's about hoodwinking the ignorant masses into voting for you because you've promised them free stuff.


You missed one.  Pokahonkey Warren proposed reparations for homosexuals this week.  Seriously.  

Link? I don't doubt you, I've just gotta see that one for myself. If she ever becomes President, we are all so screwed beyond belief.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-cong...xt?r=1&s=1

The bill permits legally-married same sex couples to amend previous tax returns to Married instead of filing individually.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

If we're being honest. The votes that the Dems are chasing with this scheme aren't going to be from the ones that have the mental ability to attend college. On a more technical note, it's another targeted tax that won't pass the constitutional sniff test.

Actually, if you look at who is supporting this, they're either currently attending or up to their necks in debt after graduating from liberal arts colleges.  They bought into the narrative that you have to have a college degree to succeed in life, and if you can't afford it, the government will happily loan you whatever you need.

Bernie and the other dems proposing this (aside from AOC who is just regurgitating whatever her handlers tell her to say) know perfectly well that it won't pass the constitutional test.  It's not about actually doing it.  It's about hoodwinking the ignorant masses into voting for you because you've promised them free stuff.

I have a much more elegant solution.  Get the government out of the student loan business.   If we do that, then lenders will be much more careful whom they lend to, and for what courses.  Colleges will be forced to control their expenses and tuition rates, or they won't have any students.

BINGO!!

The perception today since Obama took over the student loan system is that there are unlimited funds for students to borrow.  Since everything is backed by the federal government, banks will give loans out for whatever amount to just about anyone.  College tuitions have been steadily increasing for decades, but the acceleration since the feds took over the student loan process is ridiculous.  

What's really irritating is how these colleges that raise their rates the most constantly poor mouth and say it's necessary despite the fact that most of the elite schools in the country including state run universities have endowments in the trillions.

Regarding your first response.  As I have said before, it's nothing more than a "vote buying" scheme.

As far as your second response and what TRM said, I agee 100%.  What is eventually going to happen is a burst bubble much like the housing bubble/market crash in 2008.  Many student loans aren't worth the paper that they are printed on.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Link? I don't doubt you, I've just gotta see that one for myself. If she ever becomes President, we are all so screwed beyond belief.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-cong...xt?r=1&s=1

The bill permits legally-married same sex couples to amend previous tax returns to Married instead of filing individually.

Ok, there's a big difference between allowing tax returns to be amended and reparations. Reparations are, "Hey, sorry we took advantage of you/your family." Amended tax returns are, "You qualified for the marriage credit in 2015, 2016 and 2017 and didn't get it." That's no different than going to H&R Block and paying them $150 to tell you that you missed out on a $100 credit last year and can amend to claim it.

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https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-cong...xt?r=1&s=1

The bill permits legally-married same sex couples to amend previous tax returns to Married instead of filing individually.

Ok, there's a big difference between allowing tax returns to be amended and reparations. Reparations are, "Hey, sorry we took advantage of you/your family." Amended tax returns are, "You qualified for the marriage credit in 2015, 2016 and 2017 and didn't get it." That's no different than going to H&R Block and paying them $150 to tell you that you missed out on a $100 credit last year and can amend to claim it.

I'm not sure if you know what reparations means.

The bill that Pocahontas introduced implies that "married" gay individuals were somehow "wronged" via the income tax system outside the statute of limitations.

Much like the student loan debt forgiveness scheme it's nothing more than pandering and vote-buying.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Ok, there's a big difference between allowing tax returns to be amended and reparations. Reparations are, "Hey, sorry we took advantage of you/your family." Amended tax returns are, "You qualified for the marriage credit in 2015, 2016 and 2017 and didn't get it." That's no different than going to H&R Block and paying them $150 to tell you that you missed out on a $100 credit last year and can amend to claim it.

I'm not sure if you know what reparations means.

The bill that Pocahontas introduced implies that "married" gay individuals were somehow "wronged" via the income tax system outside the statute of limitations.

Much like the student loan debt forgiveness scheme it's nothing more than pandering and vote-buying.

And here we come back to the philosophical impasse between us. I don't care who you sleep with, and government shouldn't have gotten involved in the first place. You...well...do.

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I'm not sure if you know what reparations means.

The bill that Pocahontas introduced implies that "married" gay individuals were somehow "wronged" via the income tax system outside the statute of limitations.

Much like the student loan debt forgiveness scheme it's nothing more than pandering and vote-buying.

And here we come back to the philosophical impasse between us. I don't care who you sleep with, and government shouldn't have gotten involved in the first place. You...well...do.

I want reparations for the 20 years I filed taxes before I had kids and got the child tax credit. Where are my reparations TJ???

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