I much prefer it doesn't happen at all, but I actually think the snippet about moving two teams to London (one in Wembley one in Tottenham stadium) so they have a natural rivalry is a really good idea if they're going to make the commitment to London. Us and the Chargers are easy choices.

I don't think people realize how little a natural fanbase either would have or how small a blip they'd be in the London sports market

You could say the same about LA but it's not really about the nature of the fanbase these days. It's everything else.

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I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

I don't think people realize how little a natural fanbase either would have or how small a blip they'd be in the London sports market

You could say the same about LA but it's not really about the nature of the fanbase these days. It's everything else.

You send two teams to London and you'll destroy the already small potential of an organic fanbase for one of them while also being a blip in the national sporting scene. That's a recipe for disaster. 

Not comparable to the Rams in LA

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I miss the days of the Sharks, the Firebirds, the Express, etc., when we used to pay $5 on a warm night and go down to the old Gator Bowl and pick any seat that was available.   No one worried about relocation, in fact we didn't even worry that much if we won or lost.  It was a good time.

Being a football fan is supposed to be fun.  All the losing, and never ending talk of relocation, are sapping the fun from being a Jags fan.  Club seats for $390!  For one game.   Good God.

My dad mentioned that awhile back. We had the Bulls too right? At any rate. I hope the XFL has success. Wouldn't mind seeing them expand over here in our market. Would be a decent fit. I watched most of their games this past weekend. It wasn't all that bad. Some of the games were exciting. Some of the games were lopsided. No different than what you see on box scores or sports tickers with the NFL and NCAA on a weekly basis.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

You could say the same about LA but it's not really about the nature of the fanbase these days. It's everything else.

You send two teams to London and you'll destroy the already small potential of an organic fanbase for one of them while also being a blip in the national sporting scene. That's a recipe for disaster. 

Not comparable to the Rams in LA

I'm sure the multi-billion dollar NFL industry will have done plenty of analysis before a move is ever truly contemplated.

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I miss the days of the Sharks, the Firebirds, the Express, etc., when we used to pay $5 on a warm night and go down to the old Gator Bowl and pick any seat that was available.   No one worried about relocation, in fact we didn't even worry that much if we won or lost.  It was a good time.

Being a football fan is supposed to be fun.  All the losing, and never ending talk of relocation, are sapping the fun from being a Jags fan.  Club seats for $390!  For one game.   Good God.

My dad mentioned that awhile back. We had the Bulls too right? At any rate. I hope the XFL has success. Wouldn't mind seeing them expand over here in our market. Would be a decent fit. I watched most of their games this past weekend. It wasn't all that bad. Some of the games were exciting. Some of the games were lopsided. No different than what you see on box scores or sports tickers with the NFL and NCAA on a weekly basis.

Meh, it was OK at best.  It's minor-league football.  I guess I forced myself to watch a total of a couple of quarters while switching channels.  It's nothing that I could go out of the way to watch, whereas the NFL I am glued to the TV from 12:30ish (unless there is a home game) until 7:30 on Sundays.  Maybe it's because I was brought up around pro sports for 30+ years, I have trouble watching anything else.  It's kinda like the Jumbo Shrimp/Suns...it's OK to watch as a novelty or something to do for a night but I just can't get myself to follow it. 

The problem, as I see it, with the XFL and every other new professional football league since the USFL is that with 32 teams the player pool of truly star players just isn't there.  That, and viewership is already down in the NFL.  I just don't see how a new league is going to sustain itself.  I guess the answer will be evident enough and soon enough.  But the XFL has a steep uphill battle to stay in existence.  The NFL and AFL were able to pull off a merger in 1966 because there were only 14 NFL teams, and the league has expanded several times since.  I just don't see success happening.  We'll see.

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My dad mentioned that awhile back. We had the Bulls too right? At any rate. I hope the XFL has success. Wouldn't mind seeing them expand over here in our market. Would be a decent fit. I watched most of their games this past weekend. It wasn't all that bad. Some of the games were exciting. Some of the games were lopsided. No different than what you see on box scores or sports tickers with the NFL and NCAA on a weekly basis.

Meh, it was OK at best.  It's minor-league football.  I guess I forced myself to watch a total of a couple of quarters while switching channels.  It's nothing that I could go out of the way to watch, whereas the NFL I am glued to the TV from 12:30ish (unless there is a home game) until 7:30 on Sundays.  Maybe it's because I was brought up around pro sports for 30+ years, I have trouble watching anything else.  It's kinda like the Jumbo Shrimp/Suns...it's OK to watch as a novelty or something to do for a night but I just can't get myself to follow it. 

The problem, as I see it, with the XFL and every other new professional football league since the USFL is that with 32 teams the player pool of truly star players just isn't there.  That, and viewership is already down in the NFL.  I just don't see how a new league is going to sustain itself.  I guess the answer will be evident enough and soon enough.  But the XFL has a steep uphill battle to stay in existence.  The NFL and AFL were able to pull off a merger in 1966 because there were only 14 NFL teams, and the league has expanded several times since.  I just don't see success happening.  We'll see.

According to this article, viewership has gone up the last 2 years.  

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/31/nfl-tele...eason.html

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Meh, it was OK at best.  It's minor-league football.  I guess I forced myself to watch a total of a couple of quarters while switching channels.  It's nothing that I could go out of the way to watch, whereas the NFL I am glued to the TV from 12:30ish (unless there is a home game) until 7:30 on Sundays.  Maybe it's because I was brought up around pro sports for 30+ years, I have trouble watching anything else.  It's kinda like the Jumbo Shrimp/Suns...it's OK to watch as a novelty or something to do for a night but I just can't get myself to follow it. 

The problem, as I see it, with the XFL and every other new professional football league since the USFL is that with 32 teams the player pool of truly star players just isn't there.  That, and viewership is already down in the NFL.  I just don't see how a new league is going to sustain itself.  I guess the answer will be evident enough and soon enough.  But the XFL has a steep uphill battle to stay in existence.  The NFL and AFL were able to pull off a merger in 1966 because there were only 14 NFL teams, and the league has expanded several times since.  I just don't see success happening.  We'll see.

According to this article, viewership has gone up the last 2 years.  

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/31/nfl-tele...eason.html

Sorry, I meant ticket sales.  My bad on the wording.

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According to this article, viewership has gone up the last 2 years.  

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/31/nfl-tele...eason.html

Sorry, I meant ticket sales.  My bad on the wording.

Yes, ticket sales have to be down, because it seems like I see huge swaths of empty seats at most of the games I see on TV.  In my opinion, it's because of ticket prices.  I used to have club seats to the Jags games, but I will not pay the current price, which is I think around $390 PER GAME for a club seat.

You know, at some point, an NFL team changes from being a nice toy for the community to enjoy and becomes a blood-sucking parasite.  I know that analogy is a little over the top, but it's starting to feel that way a little bit.

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Welp, after giving it some thought I'm going to retain my season tickets.  It's going to be a whole different experience.  My entire tailgating group has disbanded.  So I'm going to go to the games with my wife again.  She hadn't gone for the last ten years or so because she didn't like the long day with the tailgating.  It's kind of depressing...not the going with my wife part, but my group of 20+ year tailgaiters breaking up...but I'm going to go anyway.  It's going to be sad going into the stadium and seeing how empty it is from game to game...and it will be empty(er).  And I'm not even going to pretend "I'm doing my part".  I just like being at the games.  Let's see how I feel after a year of this type of game experience.  I'm not making any threats...I'm just not sure how fun the overall experience is going to be without the tailgating part.

Reluctant support is still support.

Empty stadia will do nothing to keep the team in town, nor will it ever be a convincing argument to be awarded another franchise ever again.

I hope you and your wife have a blast every Sunday and probably that one Thursday.

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Shade the stadium and get a winning team on the field and all will be well. And by winning team, one that can be expected to at least break .500 instead of the perennial disasters this club fields. Is that too much to ask?

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Shade the stadium and get a winning team on the field and all will be well. And by winning team, one that can be expected to at least break .500 instead of the perennial disasters this club fields. Is that too much to ask?

One draft or player can change the fortunes of a franchise. Unfortunately it might be too late for us

I am going to make the trek up for one home game this season as I always do from Tampa, reluctantly this time. 

It’s actually ironic, being only 6 games at home this year, makes it feasible for me to be a STH from afar. It’s hard to budget money (tickets, gas, and food) and time for 8 weeks living 4 hours away. But 6 just might be doable.

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Welp, after giving it some thought I'm going to retain my season tickets.  It's going to be a whole different experience.  My entire tailgating group has disbanded.  So I'm going to go to the games with my wife again.  She hadn't gone for the last ten years or so because she didn't like the long day with the tailgating.  It's kind of depressing...not the going with my wife part, but my group of 20+ year tailgaiters breaking up...but I'm going to go anyway.  It's going to be sad going into the stadium and seeing how empty it is from game to game...and it will be empty(er).  And I'm not even going to pretend "I'm doing my part".  I just like being at the games.  Let's see how I feel after a year of this type of game experience.  I'm not making any threats...I'm just not sure how fun the overall experience is going to be without the tailgating part.

Reluctant support is still support.

Empty stadia will do nothing to keep the team in town, nor will it ever be a convincing argument to be awarded another franchise ever again.

I hope you and your wife have a blast every Sunday and probably that one Thursday.

Agreed.  Rico's story isn't too unusual right now.  I know that every person I know who has stuck it out with the team after owning season tickets from the beginning or for at least 20+ years is trying to rationalize their renewals for the upcoming season.  They're doing it, but they're doing so begrudgingly.  We've all seen large tailgating groups evaporate in recent years to the point where they don't even tailgate any longer.  I know that's my situation.  I don't tailgate any longer.  I head to the stadium about 2 hours in advance of the games, get to my parking spot and I'm in the stadium about an hour before kickoff.  

I've got friends in my row who have been in my section almost as long as me, and at the last home game last year, as we were walking out at the end of the game, he and his wife both said they were not sure if they were going to renew this season.  In talking to other friends, one who has owned 8 tickets for 25 years, he's planning on continuing to support the team "until it's not here anymore."  This particular friend goes to at least one or two away games with his family every year.  This guy is an inaugural season ticket holder, and a passionate Jags fan, but when we talk now about the team, he's at the point where he's convinced the team is leaving the market regardless of what they do locally.  

If we're all looking at the situation objectively, it certainly feels like we're looking at the beginning of the end with the JACKSONVILLE Jaguars.  Maybe I'm wrong, and this whole Lot J/Shipyards development will be the saving grace for the team.  Color me skeptical.  I guess we'll see.  I certainly hope I'm wrong, as do my friends who have been supporting the team from the start.  We'll continue to show up for whatever number of home games we'll get, but all of this uncertainty certainly does suck some of the joy out of the experience, especially when you've got an owner and front office saying that priority #1 is building a winning product on the field, and we see the hot pile of steaming garbage they've tossed us over the past few years.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Shade the stadium and get a winning team on the field and all will be well. And by winning team, one that can be expected to at least break .500 instead of the perennial disasters this club fields. Is that too much to ask?

I remember at the darkest moments when Wayne Weaver had Winn Dixie giving away free tickets to games, we couldn't fill the stadium.  They held numerous fan forums around the area, including a big one at the stadium where Weaver was in attendance and was talking to the fans directly about the situation.  You had people saying they'd buy season tickets if they replaced the water fountains in the stadium because the ones that were installed at the time didn't dispence chilled water.  That's how petty the fan base can be in this town.  The same people complaining about the sun being too hot in September, are the ones that wanted chilled water at the water fountains 20 years ago.  Khan could accommodate every request and they still would find an excuse for not buying tickets.  

To be fair, the London games have little to do with fan support, or game attendance.  That's really a relatively small piece of the revenue pie in the grand scheme of things.  It's a visual representation that provides the optics to national media hacks to say the fans don't support the team, but the truth is, it's the overall bottom line for the team.  Not just ticket revenue.  Should Khan eventually move the team to London, he'll discover that it's not quite as profitable to play all of his home games there as it was for one game. I don't think there's quite as much fan passion for JAGUARS football in London as they seem to think. Most of the expats over there are fans of pretty much every other team. There's certainly a Jags fan base over there, but it's nowhere even remotely close to what we have here. If they're stuck with a team full time, it won't draw as well as the league seems to think. Especially if it's a team relocating from a US city.

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Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Shad doesn't want you to renew. He wants this team to fail. Its clear as day. Take the hit in the interim to justify moving to London. Hes forcing your hand by removing home games. Jags are being major league, simple as.

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Shade the stadium and get a winning team on the field and all will be well. And by winning team, one that can be expected to at least break .500 instead of the perennial disasters this club fields. Is that too much to ask?

I remember at the darkest moments when Wayne Weaver had Winn Dixie giving away free tickets to games, we couldn't fill the stadium.  They held numerous fan forums around the area, including a big one at the stadium where Weaver was in attendance and was talking to the fans directly about the situation.  You had people saying they'd buy season tickets if they replaced the water fountains in the stadium because the ones that were installed at the time didn't dispence chilled water.  That's how petty the fan base can be in this town.  The same people complaining about the sun being too hot in September, are the ones that wanted chilled water at the water fountains 20 years ago.  Khan could accommodate every request and they still would find an excuse for not buying tickets.  

To be fair, the London games have little to do with fan support, or game attendance.  That's really a relatively small piece of the revenue pie in the grand scheme of things.  It's a visual representation that provides the optics to national media hacks to say the fans don't support the team, but the truth is, it's the overall bottom line for the team.  Not just ticket revenue.  Should Khan eventually move the team to London, he'll discover that it's not quite as profitable to play all of his home games there as it was for one game.  I don't think there's quite as much fan passion for JAGUARS football in London as they seem to think.  Most of the expats over there are fans of pretty much every other team.  There's certainly a Jags fan base over there, but it's nowhere even remotely close to what we have here.  If they're stuck with a team full time, it won't draw as well as the league seems to think.  Especially if it's a team relocating from a US city.

I agree with you. Especially the last few sentences in bold. The Jaguars are really forced into London households over there when it's football season. And roughly every game that I have seen in that stadium is dotted with multiple different colors of various teams in the stands. I don't think it's something they're really ready to out right gamble on just yet. 

That's why they'll keep taking home games away from us and trying them out over there. I just don't think it'll ever amount to them going full tilt and all in with eight across the pond. 

I still think it'll be a logistical nightmare for any team to be holed up across the pond as a home location for the NFL. This isn't going to be like Las Vegas. Where you'll consistently be able to draw in outside interest from time to time because it's Las Vegas. Asking teams to constantly fly across the pond is challenging enough.  

Soccer was and always will be Europe's "football" to them. They can keep trying to fit 15 pounds of [BLEEP] in a 10 pound bag though if they want. It'll bottom out eventually. Just like the NFLE did.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I'm getting weary of Mr Khan and his obsession with London.
At first it was OK ....then became not so much .....and now to quote Cheech and Chong .....
"I'm sick up and fed" with it.

Since Jax got the team went from always trying to attend at least 2 games a season, later buying game six packs and then season tickets a few years. Had to go back to picking and choosing a couple tickets a year because of finances.  ...for 2020, maybe just one.....depends on how they draft or free agents.
GMII is the only thing makes them worth watching .....live or on TV.

My heart just isn't in this team and what they're doing anymore.
To quote another famous guy ...Lewis Grizzard....
"They tore out my heart out stomped that sucker flat"

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"Stay tight, stay close. Great things are going to continue to happen for this football team."  - Doug Peterson

Shade the stadium and get a winning team on the field and all will be well. And by winning team, one that can be expected to at least break .500 instead of the perennial disasters this club fields. Is that too much to ask?

I remember at the darkest moments when Wayne Weaver had Winn Dixie giving away free tickets to games, we couldn't fill the stadium.  They held numerous fan forums around the area, including a big one at the stadium where Weaver was in attendance and was talking to the fans directly about the situation.  You had people saying they'd buy season tickets if they replaced the water fountains in the stadium because the ones that were installed at the time didn't dispence chilled water.  That's how petty the fan base can be in this town.  The same people complaining about the sun being too hot in September, are the ones that wanted chilled water at the water fountains 20 years ago.  Khan could accommodate every request and they still would find an excuse for not buying tickets.  

To be fair, the London games have little to do with fan support, or game attendance.  That's really a relatively small piece of the revenue pie in the grand scheme of things.  It's a visual representation that provides the optics to national media hacks to say the fans don't support the team, but the truth is, it's the overall bottom line for the team.  Not just ticket revenue.  Should Khan eventually move the team to London, he'll discover that it's not quite as profitable to play all of his home games there as it was for one game.  I don't think there's quite as much fan passion for JAGUARS football in London as they seem to think.  Most of the expats over there are fans of pretty much every other team.  There's certainly a Jags fan base over there, but it's nowhere even remotely close to what we have here.  If they're stuck with a team full time, it won't draw as well as the league seems to think.  Especially if it's a team relocating from a US city.

Exactly

I really doubt this team (or one like it) can fill the stadium every home game in London. One thing is to fill the stadium because you only have 1 or 2 games per season, but to actually have a team there I don't think there are enough fans there (or any time in the near future). Much less if this team continues to be garbage.

British dudes are crazy for soccer, football? not so much.

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You guys are heavily underestimating the XFL.

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You guys are heavily underestimating the XFL.

Nah not really.  One thing that was interesting was seeing who was attending the games.  I saw a lot of families in the stands.  They aren't going to do anything but help out the NFL by giving guys who fall through the cracks additional roster shots.

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The Khan Years

Patience, Persistence, and Piss Poor General Managers.

They just set a new flight record from London to NYC so it will only get faster in the future so don't count out a London team.

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