Funny a few still think we should of made Yawn a top 3 highest paid DE lol

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Funny a few still think we should of made Yawn a top 3 highest paid DE lol

FTR, I think this team should do a much better job retaining its most productive players, considering we've had so few of them over the years.

That's what teams who don't have the worst record in the league in back to back years tend to do.

That's what teams that want to accumulate talent, and not draft/build on a treadmill tend to do.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Funny a few still think we should of made Yawn a top 3 highest paid DE lol

FTR, I think this team should do a much better job retaining its most productive players, considering we've had so few of them over the years.

That's what teams who don't have the worst record in the league in back to back years tend to do.

That's what teams that want to accumulate talent, and not draft/build on a treadmill tend to do.

Teams who draft the worst are the ones that's the worst in the league.  That was us under Dave Caldwell.  It has nothing to do with way overpaying for a guy that's not a 3 down player especially when the guy is worst in the league at his position at defending the run in the division with the 2 best run offenses in the league. The good the about this regime is we are drafting good character guys along with being good football players. I don't think we will have a problem resigning these guys from the last few drafts. Much better culture and character along with good football players. I would bet 30 other GMs could of made that Ramsey trade look great as well when JJ was there and we needed a WR along with the other 1st and 4th and didn't have to give up the big contract. Khan even said though he would of made Ramsey the highest paid he just had very skin like a female

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FTR, I think this team should do a much better job retaining its most productive players, considering we've had so few of them over the years.

That's what teams who don't have the worst record in the league in back to back years tend to do.

That's what teams that want to accumulate talent, and not draft/build on a treadmill tend to do.

Teams who draft the worst are the ones that's the worst in the league.  That was us under Dave Caldwell.  It has nothing to do with way overpaying for a guy that's not a 3 down player especially when the guy is worst in the league at his position at defending the run in the division with the 2 best run offenses in the league

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

Suppose, instead of Chaissing after Yan's replacement, we drafted Justin Jefferson. Would we have had to spend up to $84 million on kirk?!? What if instead of trying to show Ramsey how replaceable he is by drafting Henderson, what if we drafted Tristan Wirfs or your guy Becton?

What if, instead of still trying to make up for getting rid of Yan, we didn't draft Walker #1 overall? Would we have picked #1 overall? Wat if we focused more on the offensive line to protect Trevor Lawrence, or was able to trade back (even at a lower price) and land one of the numerous WRs available?

Nope. Trading away talented players has absolutely NOTHING to do with poor drafting.

Shaking my head in dismay.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Teams who draft the worst are the ones that's the worst in the league.  That was us under Dave Caldwell.  It has nothing to do with way overpaying for a guy that's not a 3 down player especially when the guy is worst in the league at his position at defending the run in the division with the 2 best run offenses in the league

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

If they were trying to replace Yawn they would find the worst DE against the run they could find, a liability.  I don't think that was their plan and they did the opposite

---

When you pay a DE 20+ mil he needs to be a 2 way player and not a liability in either aspect of the game.

---

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

If they were trying to replace Yawn they would find the worst DE against the run they could find, a liability.  I don't think that was there plan and they did the opposite

That's EXACTLY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft decisions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

If they were trying to replace Yawn they would find the worst DE against the run they could find, a liability.  I don't think that was there plan and they did the opposite

That's EXACTKY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft positions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

Bullseye, you can't have any meaningful discourse with someone who is willfully disingenuous in an attempt to "not be wrong." 

He's just gonna' keep spouting the same garbage even if he knows it's not accurate.

---

Teams who draft the worst are the ones that's the worst in the league.  That was us under Dave Caldwell.  It has nothing to do with way overpaying for a guy that's not a 3 down player especially when the guy is worst in the league at his position at defending the run in the division with the 2 best run offenses in the league

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

Suppose, instead of Chaissing after Yan's replacement, we drafted Justin Jefferson.  Would we have had to spend up to $84 million on kirk?!?  What if instead of trying to show Ramsey how replaceable he is by drafting Henderson, what if we drafted Tristan Wirfs or your guy Becton?

What if, instead of still trying to make up for getting rid of Yan, we didn't draft Walker #1 overall?  Would we have picked #1 overall?  Wat if we focused more on the offensive line to protect Trevor Lawrence, or was able to trade back (even at a lower price) and land one of the numerous WRs available?

Nope.  Trading away talented players has absolutely NOTHING to do with poor drafting.

Shaking my head in dismay.

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

That's EXACTKY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft positions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

Bullseye, you can't have any meaningful discourse with someone who is willfully disingenuous in an attempt to "not be wrong." 

He's just gonna' keep spouting the same garbage even if he knows it's not accurate.

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

If they were trying to replace Yawn they would find the worst DE against the run they could find, a liability.  I don't think that was there plan and they did the opposite

That's EXACTKY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft decisions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time. Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

---

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

Suppose, instead of Chaissing after Yan's replacement, we drafted Justin Jefferson.  Would we have had to spend up to $84 million on kirk?!?  What if instead of trying to show Ramsey how replaceable he is by drafting Henderson, what if we drafted Tristan Wirfs or your guy Becton?

What if, instead of still trying to make up for getting rid of Yan, we didn't draft Walker #1 overall?  Would we have picked #1 overall?  Wat if we focused more on the offensive line to protect Trevor Lawrence, or was able to trade back (even at a lower price) and land one of the numerous WRs available?

Nope.  Trading away talented players has absolutely NOTHING to do with poor drafting.

Shaking my head in dismay.

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

Bullseye, you can't have any meaningful discourse with someone who is willfully disingenuous in an attempt to "not be wrong." 

He's just gonna' keep spouting the same garbage even if he knows it's not accurate.

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

That's EXACTKY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft decisions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time.  Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

Everybody drafts for need with some of their picks.  Dave just couldn't stop himself from reaching too far to do it. 
Drafting for need is not an issue if you aren't reaching too far down your board to fill the need. 

I bet 30 teams this year passed on higher rated prospects at some point in the first three rounds to take a player they needed. 
Hell, the Jags pretty clearly did it with Walker, Fortner and Snoop Conner.

The larger issue for this topic is Caldwell's (and eventually Coughlin's) inability to retain draft picks they hit on. 
The work isn't done when you land the talent. Players, despite their ego, personality, or misguided agents and advisors, have to be MANAGED. Negotiating their retention can be screwed up a million different ways. We witnessed it with Ngakoue and Ramsey.
Both players were alienated in some way and despite much of (probably most of) the blame falling on those players, the front office failed to get the job done at the end of the day. They share the blame. 

Whatever your wacky takes on the players might be. The team suffered when they walked. Significantly.

---

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time.  Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

Everybody drafts for need with some of their picks.  Dave just couldn't stop himself from reaching too far to do it. 
Drafting for need is not an issue if you aren't reaching too far down your board to fill the need. 

I bet 30 teams this year passed on higher rated prospects at some point in the first three rounds to take a player they needed. 
Hell, the Jags pretty clearly did it with Walker, Fortner and Snoop Conner.

The larger issue for this topic is Caldwell's (and eventually Coughlin's) inability to retain draft picks they hit on. 
The work isn't done when you land the talent. Players, despite their ego, personality, or misguided agents and advisors, have to be MANAGED. Negotiating their retention can be screwed up a million different ways. We witnessed it with Ngakoue and Ramsey.
Both players were alienated in some way and despite much of (probably most of) the blame falling on those players, the front office failed to get the job done at the end of the day. They share the blame. 

Whatever your wacky takes on the players might be. The team suffered when they walked. Significantly.

Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

---

Everybody drafts for need with some of their picks.  Dave just couldn't stop himself from reaching too far to do it. 
Drafting for need is not an issue if you aren't reaching too far down your board to fill the need. 

I bet 30 teams this year passed on higher rated prospects at some point in the first three rounds to take a player they needed. 
Hell, the Jags pretty clearly did it with Walker, Fortner and Snoop Conner.

The larger issue for this topic is Caldwell's (and eventually Coughlin's) inability to retain draft picks they hit on. 
The work isn't done when you land the talent. Players, despite their ego, personality, or misguided agents and advisors, have to be MANAGED. Negotiating their retention can be screwed up a million different ways. We witnessed it with Ngakoue and Ramsey.
Both players were alienated in some way and despite much of (probably most of) the blame falling on those players, the front office failed to get the job done at the end of the day. They share the blame. 

Whatever your wacky takes on the players might be. The team suffered when they walked. Significantly.

Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

Muma is probably the ONLY example of BAP selection in the Jags 2022 draft. 
And even that can be viewed as a need since our new DC wants to employ the $LB position and we didn't have a clear candidate on the roster.

The Jags traded up twice for, drum roll please...   NEED. 

You believe in fairy tales all you want, pal. 

Teams draft for need just as often as they select a straight up BAP pick.

---

It has everything to do with the guy when you already have him on the roster and he was producing, you foolishly trade him away for picks to prove to him just how replaceable he is, and you wind up with K'Lavon Chaisson=who, BTW-is super motivated now that the team drafted yet another guy to replace Yannick.

That's what...two top 20 picks since 2020 in the attempt to replace Yan?

Nahh.  No relation to Yann's departure what so ever.  Nope.  Absolutely none!

How much better and more balanced would this team be if it spent picks on another position and still had a guy who consistently put up 8-10 sacks a year?

Suppose, instead of Chaissing after Yan's replacement, we drafted Justin Jefferson.  Would we have had to spend up to $84 million on kirk?!?  What if instead of trying to show Ramsey how replaceable he is by drafting Henderson, what if we drafted Tristan Wirfs or your guy Becton?

What if, instead of still trying to make up for getting rid of Yan, we didn't draft Walker #1 overall?  Would we have picked #1 overall?  Wat if we focused more on the offensive line to protect Trevor Lawrence, or was able to trade back (even at a lower price) and land one of the numerous WRs available?

Nope.  Trading away talented players has absolutely NOTHING to do with poor drafting.

Shaking my head in dismay.

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

Bullseye, you can't have any meaningful discourse with someone who is willfully disingenuous in an attempt to "not be wrong." 

He's just gonna' keep spouting the same garbage even if he knows it's not accurate.

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

That's EXACTLY what they did!  They drafted the WORST they could find in Chaisson.  They got 2 sacks out of him in 2 seasons...nowhere CLOSE to Yan's productivity, even if you think Ngakoue is the absolute worst run defender in the league.  Then this year they spent the #1 overall pick on a guy who hasn't played edge rusher, and who had less than 10 career sacks on an absolutely loaded Georgia team.

But you're going to tell me getting rid of Yan had nothing to do with poor draft decisions and the team having the worst record in the league for two years running?!?

Seriously?!?

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time.  Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

If Dave was drafting for position or need, don't you think artificially creating the need by letting those players walk didn't provide temptation/extra incentive to do just that?!?  You said there was no link between letting guys like Yan and Ramsey go and poor drafting, and then you say you never draft for need.  The Jaguars created their own needs by getting rid of productive players, then drafted to fill those needs they needlessly created. 

They let CB Jalen Ramsey leave, and followed that decision up by drafting CB CJ Henderson 9th overall, signing Griffin to a free agent deal, then drafting Campbell at the top of the 2md round.

I've already discussed the foolish efforts to replace Yan.

They cut Fournette and wound up spending a first round pick on Etienne.

That's three insstances of cutting or trading productive players that contributed to the last winning team we had, then drafting almost immediately in the first round the following draft to try to fill the vacuum created by those transactions. 

How in the hell can you deny the link between those transactions and the subsequent draft picks?!?

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Everybody drafts for need with some of their picks.  Dave just couldn't stop himself from reaching too far to do it. 
Drafting for need is not an issue if you aren't reaching too far down your board to fill the need. 

I bet 30 teams this year passed on higher rated prospects at some point in the first three rounds to take a player they needed. 
Hell, the Jags pretty clearly did it with Walker, Fortner and Snoop Conner.

The larger issue for this topic is Caldwell's (and eventually Coughlin's) inability to retain draft picks they hit on. 
The work isn't done when you land the talent. Players, despite their ego, personality, or misguided agents and advisors, have to be MANAGED. Negotiating their retention can be screwed up a million different ways. We witnessed it with Ngakoue and Ramsey.
Both players were alienated in some way and despite much of (probably most of) the blame falling on those players, the front office failed to get the job done at the end of the day. They share the blame. 

Whatever your wacky takes on the players might be. The team suffered when they walked. Significantly.

Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

So if it's foolish to draft based on need, and you have a GM that does that, doesn't it make matters worse for that GM to create needs where he actually had good players?!?

Think!

And to be clear, you are holding up Baalke as the paragon of sound drafting practices?  Am I reading this correctly?

---

Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

Muma is probably the ONLY example of BAP selection in the Jags 2022 draft. 
And even that can be viewed as a need since our new DC wants to employ the $LB position and we didn't have a clear candidate on the roster.

The Jags traded up twice for, drum roll please...   NEED. 

You believe in fairy tales all you want, pal. 

Teams draft for need just as often as they select a straight up BAP pick.

Exactly!

On top of that BAP drafting is no guarantee of success, either if you evaluate the players incorrectly and rank them incorrectly.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

Muma is probably the ONLY example of BAP selection in the Jags 2022 draft. 
And even that can be viewed as a need since our new DC wants to employ the $LB position and we didn't have a clear candidate on the roster.

The Jags traded up twice for, drum roll please...   NEED. 

You believe in fairy tales all you want, pal. 

Teams draft for need just as often as they select a straight up BAP pick.

Lol, you still live in your fantasy world thinking teams won't take the top guy on their board and pass up need.  Yes they were need buy also the top guy on their board.  You don't trade up they way they did just till fill a need unless their is a guy there at the top of their board that fills a need.  Lloyd was the best LB in the draft and they even said they had him as a top 15 player.  Connor was a 5th round pick, we really had no clue how their board looked in the 5th round but I think it's safe to say he was their top guy on the board the way they traded up for him.  They could of stayed and took a different back.  Still living in your fantasy world I see thinking teams won't stick to their board and take the top guy over a position more of need when multiple coaches and GMs have talked about this for years, even Doug and Ballke talked about it and was pretty clear after the draft it's what they did.

---

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time.  Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

If Dave was drafting for position or need, don't you think artificially creating the need by letting those players walk didn't provide temptation/extra incentive to do just that?!?  You said there was no link between letting guys like Yan and Ramsey go and poor drafting, and then you say you never draft for need.  The Jaguars created their own needs by getting rid of productive players, then drafted to fill those needs they needlessly created. 

They let CB Jalen Ramsey leave, and followed that decision up by drafting CB CJ Henderson 9th overall, signing Griffin to a free agent deal, then drafting Campbell at the top of the 2md round.

I've already discussed the foolish efforts to replace Yan.

They cut Fournette and wound up spending a first round pick on Etienne.

That's three insstances of cutting or trading productive players that contributed to the last winning team we had, then drafting almost immediately in the first round the following draft to try to fill the vacuum created by those transactions. 

How in the hell can you deny the link between those transactions and the subsequent draft picks?!?

What?  No we didn't, Robinson was a UDFA, he out played LF in trying camp and then we cut him.  There isn't any denying that J Rob is better than LF.  That's what bad GMs do is not stick to their board and over draft for a play that's of more of need.

---

You're are helping make my point, Dave was drafting for position, you never do that.  Always take the BPA, we had the wrong guy at GM.  I'd take Fatukasi and Oluakun at 20 mil anyway over Yawn

---

Lol, or you 2 could be wrong?  The Vikings, Ravens, and Raiders have helped proven that.   I guess the Colts are the smartest team lol

---

I'm talking about Walker, Dave drafted for need, that was his problem.  That will get one fired every time.  Dave was a bad drafter before he traded Yawn

If Dave was drafting for position or need, don't you think artificially creating the need by letting those players walk didn't provide temptation/extra incentive to do just that?!?  You said there was no link between letting guys like Yan and Ramsey go and poor drafting, and then you say you never draft for need.  The Jaguars created their own needs by getting rid of productive players, then drafted to fill those needs they needlessly created. 

They let CB Jalen Ramsey leave, and followed that decision up by drafting CB CJ Henderson 9th overall, signing Griffin to a free agent deal, then drafting Campbell at the top of the 2md round.

I've already discussed the foolish efforts to replace Yan.

They cut Fournette and wound up spending a first round pick on Etienne.

That's three insstances of cutting or trading productive players that contributed to the last winning team we had, then drafting almost immediately in the first round the following draft to try to fill the vacuum created by those transactions. 

How in the hell can you deny the link between those transactions and the subsequent draft picks?!?

What?  No we didn't, Robinson was a UDFA, he out played LF in trying camp and then we cut him.  There isn't any denying that J Rob is better than LF.  That's what bad GMs do is not stick to their board and over draft for a play that's of more of need.

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Sometimes BPA meets need, so you you are going to draft need and a lot of teams have need at a lot of positions so needs will get filled.  That's said 99% of the time you take the player at the top of your board.  Some teams do draft need and those are the ones that pick at the top, glad it looks like we have finally broke that so hopefully we won't be picking neat the top again any time soon.   Did you see the teams board?  What players did the team have rated higher than Walker?  I think it was pretty clear that Walker was their highest rated player.  I think it's also been pretty clear that Baalke takes the top player on his board passing up players of need multiple times.  He has said it multiple times as well as Doug, stick to their board and take the top player.  Muma was another clear example.

So if it's foolish to draft based on need, and you have a GM that does that, doesn't it make matters worse for that GM to create needs where he actually had good players?!?

Think!

And to be clear, you are holding up Baalke as the paragon of sound drafting practices?  Am I reading this correctly?

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Muma is probably the ONLY example of BAP selection in the Jags 2022 draft. 
And even that can be viewed as a need since our new DC wants to employ the $LB position and we didn't have a clear candidate on the roster.

The Jags traded up twice for, drum roll please...   NEED. 

You believe in fairy tales all you want, pal. 

Teams draft for need just as often as they select a straight up BAP pick.

Exactly!

On top of that BAP drafting is no guarantee of success, either if you evaluate the players incorrectly and rank them incorrectly.

It was a no win situation with Dave, he should of been fired when Tom came in.  We were going to make Jalen the highest paid corner and we offered Yawn way more than he was worth and money per year he will never get close to.  So they tried to retain both but both had their own issues so it was best to cut ties.  Happy.the culture is different now and we have good character guys that are good at football.

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Well the Jags , Vikings, Ravens, Raiders, and Colts disagree with yall. as well as every other team in the NFL lol. I would say the Colts agree but he is only making 13 mil per year, he would still be here if he was that cheap but he turned down the offer when we offered 6 mil more and more years than he has ever received. You would of made him the highest paid DE because it's not your money

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So if it's foolish to draft based on need, and you have a GM that does that, doesn't it make matters worse for that GM to create needs where he actually had good players?!?

Think!

And to be clear, you are holding up Baalke as the paragon of sound drafting practices?  Am I reading this correctly?

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Exactly!

On top of that BAP drafting is no guarantee of success, either if you evaluate the players incorrectly and rank them incorrectly.

It was a no win situation with Dave, he should of been fired when Tom came in.  We were going to make Jalen the highest paid corner and we offered Yawn way more than he was worth and money per year he will never get close to.  So they tried to retain both but both had their own issues so it was best to cut ties.  Happy.the culture is different now and we have good character guys that are good at football.

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Well the Jags , Vikings, Ravens, Raiders, and Colts disagree with yall.  as well as every other team in the NFL lol.  I would say the Colts agree but he is only making 13 mil per year, he would still be here if he was that cheap but he turned down the offer when we offered 6 mil more and more years than he has ever received.  You would of made him the highest paid DE because it's not your money

1.  Thw Vikings traded for Ngakoue in 2020.  They finished with a better defense and a better record than the Jaguars in 2020 and 2021.  Also finished with more sacks in both years.
2.  The Ravens traded for Ngakoue later in 2020.  They finished with a better defense and a better record than Jacksonville in 2020.  Also finished with more sacks.
3.  The Raiders signed Yann as a free agent last year.  They finished with a better record than the Jaguars did last year and recorded more sacks.

4.  The Colts traded for him this year and are projected to have a better record than we are this year.

5.  As I pointeed out before, each year, Ngakoue finished with more sacks than the Jaguars players trying to replace him.

6.  Interestingly absent from your analysis is the fact that as bad as you claim Ngakoue is, teams still don't hesitate to acquire him when they get the chance.  Were he such a liability, why is that happening?  These aren't bottom of the barrel teams churning the bottom of their roster.  All of the teams who acquired him are/were respectable, playoff contending teams at the time trying to get better.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

So if it's foolish to draft based on need, and you have a GM that does that, doesn't it make matters worse for that GM to create needs where he actually had good players?!?

Think!

And to be clear, you are holding up Baalke as the paragon of sound drafting practices?  Am I reading this correctly?

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Exactly!

On top of that BAP drafting is no guarantee of success, either if you evaluate the players incorrectly and rank them incorrectly.

It was a no win situation with Dave, he should of been fired when Tom came in.  We were going to make Jalen the highest paid corner and we offered Yawn way more than he was worth and money per year he will never get close to.  So they tried to retain both but both had their own issues so it was best to cut ties.  Happy.the culture is different now and we have good character guys that are good at football.

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Well the Jags , Vikings, Ravens, Raiders, and Colts disagree with yall.  as well as every other team in the NFL lol.  I would say the Colts agree but he is only making 13 mil per year, he would still be here if he was that cheap but he turned down the offer when we offered 6 mil more and more years than he has ever received.  You would of made him the highest paid DE because it's not your money

The bolded is:

• Inaccurate
  
• Conflating unrelated matters 
  
• Wildly assumptive
  

Those teams don't disagree with me. They vied for his services and moved on when they saw a different way forward. They all got what they paid for. I bet they are all happy customers. They got affordable sacks and pressures. 

The colts clearly value his production and see an easy way to maneuver around his lackluster play vs the run. 
(so did the Jags)

You have absolutely no idea if the Jags 2020 offer included more guaranteed money than the 26 mil he's guaranteed from the colts. 
We never saw any terms, and the leaked offer amount has never even been confirmed by either party. It was most likely leaked by the team in an attempt to save face with agents and the NFLPA. If so, they are obviously going to try to paint the picture of an exorbitant offer even if it wasn't. 

But, then again, you're a guy who believes in the tooth fairy and pure BPA, so it's probably really easy for you to lie to yourself about all of the circumstances around the Jags' failures to retain key talent that impacts their W/L column.

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It was a no win situation with Dave, he should of been fired when Tom came in.  We were going to make Jalen the highest paid corner and we offered Yawn way more than he was worth and money per year he will never get close to.  So they tried to retain both but both had their own issues so it was best to cut ties.  Happy.the culture is different now and we have good character guys that are good at football.

---

Well the Jags , Vikings, Ravens, Raiders, and Colts disagree with yall.  as well as every other team in the NFL lol.  I would say the Colts agree but he is only making 13 mil per year, he would still be here if he was that cheap but he turned down the offer when we offered 6 mil more and more years than he has ever received.  You would of made him the highest paid DE because it's not your money

The bolded is:

• Inaccurate
  
• Conflating unrelated matters 
  
• Wildly assumptive
  

Those teams don't disagree with me. They vied for his services and moved on when they saw a different way forward. They all got what they paid for. I bet they are all happy customers. They got affordable sacks and pressures. 

The colts clearly value his production and see an easy way to maneuver around his lackluster play vs the run. 
(so did the Jags)

You have absolutely no idea if the Jags 2020 offer included more guaranteed money than the 26 mil he's guaranteed from the colts. 
We never saw any terms, and the leaked offer amount has never even been confirmed by either party. It was most likely leaked by the team in an attempt to save face with agents and the NFLPA. If so, they are obviously going to try to paint the picture of an exorbitant offer even if it wasn't. 

But, then again, you're a guy who believes in the tooth fairy and pure BPA, so it's probably really easy for you to lie to yourself about all of the circumstances around the Jags' failures to retain key talent that impacts their W/L column.

The Viking are happy they traded a 2nd and a 4th for Yawn for less than a years of service?  Lmao, the Ravems and Raiders dumped him pretty quick as well.  Those teams could of kept him if they thought he was worth it. You are reaching for any comment you can to try to make your argument and you haven't came up with a good one yet lol.  That tweet from Tom P. is all we have, he's a NFL reporter, what do you have to back up your made up thoughts on the situation?  Nothing lol.  If those reports were false there isn't any doubt Yawn and his agent would of came out and said they were false.  Cmon man think!  They wanted teams tonknow what they were looking for it just didn't turn out the way they planned because he wasn't worth close to that.  The main reason Yawn fired his [BLEEP] lol

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The bolded is:

• Inaccurate
  
• Conflating unrelated matters 
  
• Wildly assumptive
  

Those teams don't disagree with me. They vied for his services and moved on when they saw a different way forward. They all got what they paid for. I bet they are all happy customers. They got affordable sacks and pressures. 

The colts clearly value his production and see an easy way to maneuver around his lackluster play vs the run. 
(so did the Jags)

You have absolutely no idea if the Jags 2020 offer included more guaranteed money than the 26 mil he's guaranteed from the colts. 
We never saw any terms, and the leaked offer amount has never even been confirmed by either party. It was most likely leaked by the team in an attempt to save face with agents and the NFLPA. If so, they are obviously going to try to paint the picture of an exorbitant offer even if it wasn't. 

But, then again, you're a guy who believes in the tooth fairy and pure BPA, so it's probably really easy for you to lie to yourself about all of the circumstances around the Jags' failures to retain key talent that impacts their W/L column.

The Viking are happy they traded a 2nd and a 4th for Yawn for less than a years of service?  Lmao, the Ravems and Raiders dumped him pretty quick as well.  Those teams could of kept him if they thought he was worth it. You are reaching for any comment you can to try to make your argument and you haven't came up with a good one yet lol.  That tweet from Tom P. is all we have, he's a NFL reporter, what do you have to back up your made up thoughts on the situation?  Nothing lol.  If those reports were false there isn't any doubt Yawn and his agent would of came out and said they were false.  Cmon man think!  They wanted teams tonknow what they were looking for it just didn't turn out the way they planned because he wasn't worth close to that.  The main reason Yawn fired his [BLEEP] lol

Again - inaccurate.

The vikes gave a 2nd and a 5th. They received a 3rd and a 5th for him when they moved on.
While there he recorded a sack in each of his 5 starts plus 12 pressures, 4 QB knockdowns, and 2 forced fumbles. (5 starts, one partial game) Not bad.

The vikings (as referenced earlier in thread multiple times) didn't have the necessary rotational pieces to utilize him as a situational rusher only so they went a different way. 
Sure they may not feel "happy" about it, but he was producing as a pass rusher for them. They just didn't have the luxury of using their DE that way exclusively. 

Baltimore thought they did, so they gave it a shot as well. A team on it's way to the playoffs saw an opportunity to pair Calais Campbell with his former teammate and try to recapture some of the magic they had together in Jax. 
Different scheme, different usage, didn't work out as well as they hoped, but it got them into the postseason. 
I doubt they shed any tears one way or the other. It wasn't a crazy investment. 

The Raiders got what they paid for in Ngakoue in year one and then some, but it was a Mayock/Gruden regime then. New coach, new GM, new defensive scheme and a DC who prioritizes size on his DL. 
More 3-4 in a multiple system makes Ngakoue a bad fit for the scheme and clearly not a philosophical fit for the traits Patrick Graham wants on his DLs. 

This stuff is all very benign. There was no abject failure at any of his stops that resulted in disgruntled employers shipping him off in a cloud of drama or disappointment. Just football business decisions. 

If the colts get from him what the '21 raiders did, they'll be happy indeed.

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