I do understand the concept, Pay them on the basis of it would be cheaper due to their production going up and it would cost more to sign a player down the road.   My issue is the team is paying mega contracts a bit premature. We have seen players have one good year and getting blockbuster contracts.  Have we learned nothing from the Haynesworth debacle? There are a few examples of players who got paid too early and their cap hit is or will be hurting the team.  They are way overpaid and now we have access to less talent due to overpaid contracts.

Trevor Lawrence:

I have been labeled as a Lawrence hater by some but I believe I have been really fair to him. I recognize His Size, Big Arm, Athletic Ability, along will all his tools. It just does not translate on the field. Lawrence is not a QB who makes guys better around him. Do you know what the number 1 stat that effects who wins or losses in a game? It is the turnover battle. Lawrence far and away leads the league in Turnovers since drafted. He just had another 2 costly turnovers Sunday and one directly lead to the opponent having first and goal. He is not a terrible QB but I put him in the average at best category. He will give you an amazing game or two but then give you 3 bad ones in return. The Simple fact they paid this man over $200 million dollars just blows my mind and such a Jaguar thing to do.  We are stuck with him so the only hope is the light bulb clicks.  Lawrence played better yesterday but his 2 turnovers lead to 14 points.  When a team losses the turnover battle they almost always lose the game. Lawrence is a big contributor to the teams failures.


Josh Hines-Allen:

The very definition of getting paid and now coasting.  Last year he had 17.5 sacks.  This year he is on pace for 6 sacks on the year.  I am not going to pretend he was ever a dominant edge rusher because even last year there were plenty of plays to where he got washed out of the play.  The difference was he was making enough impact plays to offset his inconsistency. 

Cam Robinson:

Cam never was dominant but he was decent. He is getting paid like an upper tier tackle but his performance has been very mediocre at best. The line seems to be playing better with him out of the lineup!



Hines-Allen has played so Poorly in some games this year one cannot even tell if he is in the game.  Yes the defense sucks this year but it all starts with the pass rush. Walker has been the only one doing anything consistent on this defensive line. Allen has played like a mediocre player most of this year. He added a 2nd last name but now getting less than half of the production.

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JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

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I do understand the concept, Pay them on the basis of it would be cheaper due to their production going up and it would cost more to sign a player down the road.   My issue is the team is paying mega contracts a bit premature. We have seen players have one good year and getting blockbuster contracts.  Have we learned nothing from the Haynesworth debacle? There are a few examples of players who got paid too early and their cap hit is or will be hurting the team.  They are way overpaid and now we have access to less talent due to overpaid contracts.

Trevor Lawrence:

I have been labeled as a Lawrence hater by some but I believe I have been really fair to him. I recognize His Size, Big Arm, Athletic Ability, along will all his tools. It just does not translate on the field. Lawrence is not a QB who makes guys better around him. Do you know what the number 1 stat that effects who wins or losses in a game? It is the turnover battle. Lawrence far and away leads the league in Turnovers since drafted. He just had another 2 costly turnovers Sunday and one directly lead to the opponent having first and goal. He is not a terrible QB but I put him in the average at best category. He will give you an amazing game or two but then give you 3 bad ones in return. The Simple fact they paid this man over $200 million dollars just blows my mind and such a Jaguar thing to do.  We are stuck with him so the only hope is the light bulb clicks.  Lawrence played better yesterday but his 2 turnovers lead to 14 points.  When a team losses the turnover battle they almost always lose the game. Lawrence is a big contributor to the teams failures.


Josh Hines-Allen:

The very definition of getting paid and now coasting.  Last year he had 17.5 sacks.  This year he is on pace for 6 sacks on the year.  I am not going to pretend he was ever a dominant edge rusher because even last year there were plenty of plays to where he got washed out of the play.  The difference was he was making enough impact plays to offset his inconsistency. 

Cam Robinson:

Cam never was dominant but he was decent. He is getting paid like an upper tier tackle but his performance has been very mediocre at best. The line seems to be playing better with him out of the lineup!



Hines-Allen has played so Poorly in some games this year one cannot even tell if he is in the game.  Yes the defense sucks this year but it all starts with the pass rush. Walker has been the only one doing anything consistent on this defensive line. Allen has played like a mediocre player most of this year. He added a 2nd last name but now getting less than half of the production.

If TLaw finishes the year with 26 td's, 23 picks, and a 62 completion percentage,  would you consider that being a bust?

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https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...7910381730

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JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks  - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

It's interesting PFF keeps giving JHA a great grade. I really can't name a game he's had a significant impact on. Honestly I can't even name a big time play he has made that was significant. 

Also doesn't help to be rotated off the field so much. The scheme is definitely impacting his play as well. 

Across the league DE play has seem to been down as well. Only one who really was game wrecking was Aidan Hutchinson, and he got hurt. Watt, Garrett, Crosby, Bosa's, Lawrence have all been pretty quiet.

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New DC also asked Josh Allen to bulk up, which has impacted him, this is not put in these articles of why he's not producing.

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Bulking up has not helped Allen or Cisco

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Neither Josh-Allen nor Cam Robinson could've been paid any later unless you franchise tagged them.

Oh, WAIT, the DID tag BOTH of them...

Maybe we should just close this now?

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks  - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

It's interesting PFF keeps giving JHA a great grade. I really can't name a game he's had a significant impact on. Honestly I can't even name a big time play he has made that was significant. 

Also doesn't help to be rotated off the field so much. The scheme is definitely impacting his play as well. 

Across the league DE play has seem to been down as well. Only one who really was game wrecking was Aidan Hutchinson, and he got hurt. Watt, Garrett, Crosby, Bosa's, Lawrence have all been pretty quiet.

The grades aren't about big picture impact, they are about winning individual matchups and double teams, time to pressure, pressure rate, and of course the standard sacks, tackles, assists, PD, FF, etc 

His sack number is down but his pressure numbers are still high. The fall off from our secondary this year is definitely affecting this. It's fair to say he's having less impact on games this year, but you can say that for the entire defense.

---

I do understand the concept, Pay them on the basis of it would be cheaper due to their production going up and it would cost more to sign a player down the road.   My issue is the team is paying mega contracts a bit premature. We have seen players have one good year and getting blockbuster contracts.  Have we learned nothing from the Haynesworth debacle? There are a few examples of players who got paid too early and their cap hit is or will be hurting the team.  They are way overpaid and now we have access to less talent due to overpaid contracts.

Trevor Lawrence:

I have been labeled as a Lawrence hater by some but I believe I have been really fair to him. I recognize His Size, Big Arm, Athletic Ability, along will all his tools. It just does not translate on the field. Lawrence is not a QB who makes guys better around him. Do you know what the number 1 stat that effects who wins or losses in a game? It is the turnover battle. Lawrence far and away leads the league in Turnovers since drafted. He just had another 2 costly turnovers Sunday and one directly lead to the opponent having first and goal. He is not a terrible QB but I put him in the average at best category. He will give you an amazing game or two but then give you 3 bad ones in return. The Simple fact they paid this man over $200 million dollars just blows my mind and such a Jaguar thing to do.  We are stuck with him so the only hope is the light bulb clicks.  Lawrence played better yesterday but his 2 turnovers lead to 14 points.  When a team losses the turnover battle they almost always lose the game. Lawrence is a big contributor to the teams failures.


Josh Hines-Allen:

The very definition of getting paid and now coasting.  Last year he had 17.5 sacks.  This year he is on pace for 6 sacks on the year.  I am not going to pretend he was ever a dominant edge rusher because even last year there were plenty of plays to where he got washed out of the play.  The difference was he was making enough impact plays to offset his inconsistency. 

Cam Robinson:

Cam never was dominant but he was decent. He is getting paid like an upper tier tackle but his performance has been very mediocre at best. The line seems to be playing better with him out of the lineup!



Hines-Allen has played so Poorly in some games this year one cannot even tell if he is in the game.  Yes the defense sucks this year but it all starts with the pass rush. Walker has been the only one doing anything consistent on this defensive line. Allen has played like a mediocre player most of this year. He added a 2nd last name but now getting less than half of the production.

If TLaw finishes the year with 26 td's, 23 picks, and a 62 completion percentage,  would you consider that being a bust?

I would not consider it great. If you are making the Manning comparison it is in a different era.

---

JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks  - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

I watch nearly every snap.  The last couple of games I didn't even know if he played.

---

If TLaw finishes the year with 26 td's, 23 picks, and a 62 completion percentage,  would you consider that being a bust?

I would not consider it great. If you are making the Manning comparison it is in a different era.

---

JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks  - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

I watch nearly every snap.  The last couple of games I didn't even know if he played.

Wow.

See an optometrist, I guess? 

he's number 41 BTW

---

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

If TLaw finishes the year with 26 td's, 23 picks, and a 62 completion percentage,  would you consider that being a bust?

I would not consider it great. If you are making the Manning comparison it is in a different era.

---

JHA is playing good football, he's just not getting a lot of sacks  - and he's getting doubled more frequently too.
No idea what games you are watching.

I'm not going to even address the Lawrence thing - it's all been said in the other thread.

https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...5727860166

I watch nearly every snap.  The last couple of games I didn't even know if he played.

What's different about today and when Manning played when it comes to turnovers.

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I would not consider it great. If you are making the Manning comparison it is in a different era.

---

I watch nearly every snap.  The last couple of games I didn't even know if he played.

What's different about today and when Manning played when it comes to turnovers.

Manning had multiple HoF guys on his team at the time?

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Player signing timing is in the eye of the beholder. The beholder will always be like Goldilocks only this time too soon, too late or just right.

---

A new broom always sweeps clean.

Pay your guys. Even if you're wrong you gotta try to show you will pay your players. This feels like a fluke year at this point. Trevor has been balling out the past three weeks.

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Pay your guys.  Even if you're wrong you gotta try to show you will pay your players.  This feels like a fluke year at this point.  Trevor has been balling out the past three weeks.

Trevor's contract will look like a discount in 2 years.  Signing him early and at less than Dak Prescott's contract was smart.  Note:  I'm not defending Baalke.  But that was a good signing.  I also think that the JHA signing was fine.  He's not getting many sacks, but he's still a big part of what's going good with our defense.  Of course, there's not much that's good.  But it's not JHA that's the problem.  With a better defensive scheme and better coaching and player usage, JHA and Walker are 2 great ends.  It's the inside linemen that are not being used right/not playing well that's the problem with this D line.

This idea that we are paying players too early is kinda not the problem.

---

I do understand the concept, Pay them on the basis of it would be cheaper due to their production going up and it would cost more to sign a player down the road.   My issue is the team is paying mega contracts a bit premature. We have seen players have one good year and getting blockbuster contracts.  Have we learned nothing from the Haynesworth debacle? There are a few examples of players who got paid too early and their cap hit is or will be hurting the team.  They are way overpaid and now we have access to less talent due to overpaid contracts.

Trevor Lawrence:

I have been labeled as a Lawrence hater by some but I believe I have been really fair to him. I recognize His Size, Big Arm, Athletic Ability, along will all his tools. It just does not translate on the field. Lawrence is not a QB who makes guys better around him. Do you know what the number 1 stat that effects who wins or losses in a game? It is the turnover battle. Lawrence far and away leads the league in Turnovers since drafted. He just had another 2 costly turnovers Sunday and one directly lead to the opponent having first and goal. He is not a terrible QB but I put him in the average at best category. He will give you an amazing game or two but then give you 3 bad ones in return. The Simple fact they paid this man over $200 million dollars just blows my mind and such a Jaguar thing to do.  We are stuck with him so the only hope is the light bulb clicks.  Lawrence played better yesterday but his 2 turnovers lead to 14 points.  When a team losses the turnover battle they almost always lose the game. Lawrence is a big contributor to the teams failures.


Josh Hines-Allen:

The very definition of getting paid and now coasting.  Last year he had 17.5 sacks.  This year he is on pace for 6 sacks on the year.  I am not going to pretend he was ever a dominant edge rusher because even last year there were plenty of plays to where he got washed out of the play.  The difference was he was making enough impact plays to offset his inconsistency. 

Cam Robinson:

Cam never was dominant but he was decent. He is getting paid like an upper tier tackle but his performance has been very mediocre at best. The line seems to be playing better with him out of the lineup!



Hines-Allen has played so Poorly in some games this year one cannot even tell if he is in the game.  Yes the defense sucks this year but it all starts with the pass rush. Walker has been the only one doing anything consistent on this defensive line. Allen has played like a mediocre player most of this year. He added a 2nd last name but now getting less than half of the production.

---

We still do not know if the Jags got good value from either player.

---

I would not consider it great. If you are making the Manning comparison it is in a different era.

---

I watch nearly every snap.  The last couple of games I didn't even know if he played.

Wow.

See an optometrist, I guess? 

he's number 41 BTW

41 has been the guy not making many plays. The fact he has a higher pff grade than Walker this year is laughable.

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Of all the problems in this team, this is just not it.

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