I agree with you on most of your statements and definitely respect your opinion on this board.

I was a heavy supporter of TLaw and tried to give him ample time to overcome inept coaching staffs/work on his talent and timing/etc but this was the year I was expecting him to truly reel it in - and win whether this coaching staff or players around him were inept. I was expecting him to elevate this team and the players around him to victories like other superstar players in the league.

This team sucks in an epic manner from all levels of this organization. I really hope you're right man, but as of right now, I'm on the outside looking in with Trev.

How many QB's do you think do that in the NFL right now?

Both Mahomes and Lamar have HoF's on their offense huddle and as coaches. Do you think Goff is elevating the Lions or the Lions are elevating Goff. Allen can get away with running the ball at will and no one can tackle him, plus that offense actually has a running game this year.

Mahomes was horrible today and they still won because they’re well coached and their defense is great.

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You know the D is ranked 32nd yeah? They have definitely played better the last few games and today was their best performance this year but they've hardly been the Sacksonville of old. They've had more than enough bad days and plays that hurt us. It's not just all the O's fault or Trevor's.

We lost by 5 today so you think we'd played the same with Trevor?

It's amazing how much a bend-but-dont-break defense finally breaks when your sputtering offense goes 3 and out on their first 6 drives of EVERY game.

We can't conclude either way. I would certainly hope we would play better with Trevor in there but we've seen 4 years of work to determine that it's sadly inconclusive how we would have played with him in there. I would say yes, we would have won but that's just me hoping for the best. 

Can't we just have Trevor DECISIVELY shut the haters, including myself where I have been very critical of his average-at-best performances, up? That's all I want. I want our franchise QB to be the reason why we WIN games consistently and not have to make excuses up for him for the past 4 years on why he wasn't the reason we lost - when in reality, he was.

I get what your saying and your not wrong. The D wasn't getting much help the 1st half from the O and were on the field a lot. In your thread I said I felt the O hurt the D and the D hurt the O with both units struggles on 3rd down. 

The D had a great game today. Got turnovers and held the Vikings all day. Nielsen has made some adjustments and they are working. When the O got going they were putting points on the board and that's the frustration. We've had individual units having good spells but not had a whole team performance playing well.

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Is Hunter really the top prospect this year? I would've figured outside of QB, the OT from LSU & Texas would be the obvious blue chip guys at the top

This team spending money and capital on little guys is the problem with the whole roster.

They have spent money and capital all over.  On both lines as well.

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This team spending money and capital on little guys is the problem with the whole roster.

They have spent money and capital all over.  On both lines as well.

Yeah. They have just chosen poorly with all their capital.

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Get a real front office and new coaching regime in here asap.

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We have a 30 mil a year DE, a 1st overall pick DE, a 15 mill a year DT, and a 11.5 mil a year DT. The oline before the Cam trade we had a 1st round tackle, the other tackle was a 18 mil a year guy. One guard was the highest paid guard ever when we signed him and the other is 8 mil a year G. Our Center is the 13th highest paid center. Another tackle we took in the 2nd and center we took in the 3rd.

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They have spent money and capital all over.  On both lines as well.

Yeah. They have just chosen poorly with all their capital.

They are just bad on player evaluation.  We need to remeber Doug was the Eagles coach when they took Reagor over JJ.  Im sure he had say in that pick.

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Mahomes and Lamar have been doing it since they entered the league as rookies. Also, the people who are claiming Mahomes doesn't elevate the Chiefs this year, clearly don't see how that is an anomaly (I'm not saying you believe that, but if you are insinuating that then I'll lump you in to that cohort as well).

Goff is absolutely elevating the Lions, as are their supporting cast to him. To say Goff isn't elevating the players around him in the #1 scoring offense is down right asinine.

Josh Allen is a little more streaky but he certainly does put the Bills on his back and wins games because of his own talent.

I was expecting Trevor to at least be somewhat close to this group of QB talent, once in a while, in terms of positive impact for our team - especially 4 years in.

You said INEPT players and coaches. Are you saying all those teams have as many INEPT coaches/players as the Jaguars?

No.

But what I also said was that a franchise QB lifts the players around him up. Doesn't matter if they are having a bad game/bad playcall/inept players/etc. They OVERCOME those deficiencies whether or not those deficiencies are acute or long-lasting. All coaches make a bad play call, all players fail to execute on a given play or two - but great QBs can circumvent those issues more times than not. They don't ADD to those problems.

Trevor isn't the MAIN problem, but he certainly is A problem. And when your starting QB who you paid a quarter of a billion dollars to remains A problem - it turns out you have a big issue 4 years into this project...

Anyways, it's time for some dinner and drinks - hope everyone maintains their sanity until next week, just for us to be sorely disappointed once again.

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It’s astounding that after observing QB play today that would make Jaguars Gabbert blush, there’s still people dying on the Trevor is a big problem hill

Because they let the media fill their heads with things like “Wins are a QB stat” and “Generational QBs cover all other weaknesses on a team”. Anyone with common sense knows that wins are a TEAM stat, but if it HAS to be put on one individual, it’s the HEAD COACH. Also, no generational player can erase bad defensive play and/or poor play calling.

Ultimately, people double down on what they believe because they’re scared to be wrong.

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How many QB's do you think do that in the NFL right now?

Both Mahomes and Lamar have HoF's on their offense huddle and as coaches. Do you think Goff is elevating the Lions or the Lions are elevating Goff. Allen can get away with running the ball at will and no one can tackle him, plus that offense actually has a running game this year.

Mahomes and Lamar have been doing it since they entered the league as rookies. Also, the people who are claiming Mahomes doesn't elevate the Chiefs this year, clearly don't see how that is an anomaly (I'm not saying you believe that, but if you are insinuating that then I'll lump you in to that cohort as well).

Goff is absolutely elevating the Lions, as are their supporting cast to him. To say Goff isn't elevating the players around him in the #1 scoring offense is down right asinine.

Josh Allen is a little more streaky but he certainly does put the Bills on his back and wins games because of his own talent.

I was expecting Trevor to at least be somewhat close to this group of QB talent, once in a while, in terms of positive impact for our team - especially 4 years in.

The Lions are loaded all over with talent at most positions but you do know they have the best oline in the league right.  Switch our oline with the Lions and things would be much different.  One of the biggest reasons Doug was so successful in Philly is because he had one of the best oines along with one of the best defenses. If Goff had our oline he wouldnt be elevating his team like you say. Id say the oline is elevating that team more than anything although they have talent all over. Lions oline 1, Chiefs 2, and Bills 6

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/best-...-rankings/

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How many QB's do you think do that in the NFL right now?

Both Mahomes and Lamar have HoF's on their offense huddle and as coaches. Do you think Goff is elevating the Lions or the Lions are elevating Goff. Allen can get away with running the ball at will and no one can tackle him, plus that offense actually has a running game this year.

Mahomes and Lamar have been doing it since they entered the league as rookies. Also, the people who are claiming Mahomes doesn't elevate the Chiefs this year, clearly don't see how that is an anomaly (I'm not saying you believe that, but if you are insinuating that then I'll lump you in to that cohort as well).

Goff is absolutely elevating the Lions, as are their supporting cast to him. To say Goff isn't elevating the players around him in the #1 scoring offense is down right asinine.

Josh Allen is a little more streaky but he certainly does put the Bills on his back and wins games because of his own talent.

I was expecting Trevor to at least be somewhat close to this group of QB talent, once in a while, in terms of positive impact for our team - especially 4 years in.

Lol, burh...did you see today and what the "talent" is without him?

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Mahomes and Lamar have been doing it since they entered the league as rookies. Also, the people who are claiming Mahomes doesn't elevate the Chiefs this year, clearly don't see how that is an anomaly (I'm not saying you believe that, but if you are insinuating that then I'll lump you in to that cohort as well).

Goff is absolutely elevating the Lions, as are their supporting cast to him. To say Goff isn't elevating the players around him in the #1 scoring offense is down right asinine.

Josh Allen is a little more streaky but he certainly does put the Bills on his back and wins games because of his own talent.

I was expecting Trevor to at least be somewhat close to this group of QB talent, once in a while, in terms of positive impact for our team - especially 4 years in.

Lol, burh...did you see today and what the "talent" is without him?

We also got to see the absolute masterclass if offensive coaching and game planning.

Clearly Mac Jones isn't good.  But it's obvious to everyone that the is coaching staff is completely out of their depth.  It's pathetic.  Many of us have been trying to explain this to you for years.  And you keep ignoring the reality.  It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

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This team spending money and capital on little guys is the problem with the whole roster.

They have spent wasted money and capital all over.  On both lines as well.

FTFY

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Just when you think it can't get any worse............

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Just when you think it can't get any worse............

Honestly, losing this game is just normal.  It didn't get any worse.  It's just the same flat line we've been dealing with since last year.

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Just when you think it can't get any worse............

The only way it can get worse at this point is if we start having more injuries to key players.  We are in line for the number 1 spot.  It will be the 3rd time picking 1st overall in Baalkes 5 years here.  3 out of 5 picking 1st overall lol, you cant make this stuff up.

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Just when you think it can't get any worse............

The only way it can get worse at this point is if we start having more injuries to key players.  We are in line for the number 1 spot.  It will be the 3rd time picking 1st overall in Baalkes 5 years here.  3 out of 5 picking 1st overall lol, you cant make this stuff up.

Prime reason to fire Baalke.

Every home game from here on out should be a "Clown Out".

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The only way it can get worse at this point is if we start having more injuries to key players.  We are in line for the number 1 spot.  It will be the 3rd time picking 1st overall in Baalkes 5 years here.  3 out of 5 picking 1st overall lol, you cant make this stuff up.

Prime reason to fire Baalke.

Every home game from here on out should be a "Clown Out".

Khan might want to wait till black Monday.

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Lol, burh...did you see today and what the "talent" is without him?

We also got to see the absolute masterclass if offensive coaching and game planning.

Clearly Mac Jones isn't good.  But it's obvious to everyone that the is coaching staff is completely out of their depth.  It's pathetic.  Many of us have been trying to explain this to you for years.  And you keep ignoring the reality.  It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

Would you like another bite of this chicken [BLEEP] salad I made?

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

How many QB's do you think do that in the NFL right now?

Both Mahomes and Lamar have HoF's on their offense huddle and as coaches. Do you think Goff is elevating the Lions or the Lions are elevating Goff. Allen can get away with running the ball at will and no one can tackle him, plus that offense actually has a running game this year.

Mahomes was horrible today and they still won because they’re well coached and their defense is great.

I was curious at looked at the stats.  Patrick Mahomes and Trevor Lawrence's stats this season are actually pretty similar.  Both have played 9 games.  Check it out:

Mahomes:  2,208 passing yards, 12 TD's, 9 interceptions, 90.3 QB rating
Lawrence:  2,004 passing yards, 11 TD's, 6 interceptions, 87.9 QB rating

Keep in mind that Mahome's stats are with the #2 ranked offensive line while Lawrence is with the #28 ranked offensive line.

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Just when you think it can't get any worse............

Honestly, losing this game is just normal.  It didn't get any worse.  It's just the same flat line we've been dealing with since last year.

Look man, they played against a really good team with a back up QB and held them to 12 points. I have no real issues with the game today except that they still cannot run the ball worth a damn to support whoever is taking the snaps. That you think the coaches can just magically make this roster able to beat better teams says more about your perception of football than their coaching ability.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato