I think you're reaching to call Alex Smith a franchise guy.

 

I'm just saying he's arguably better than Eli Manning, who you called a franchise QB.


 

Personally I'd only call the top ten I listed as franchise QBs, not Eli, not Wilson. I agree that finding a franchise QB is not easy, but ten teams have done it, so it's not an insurmountable obstacle. Maybe just insurmountable for the Jags.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

I'm just saying he's arguably better than Eli Manning, who you called a franchise QB.


 

Personally I'd only call the top ten I listed as franchise QBs, not Eli, not Wilson. I agree that finding a franchise QB is not easy, but ten teams have done it, so it's not an insurmountable obstacle. Maybe just insurmountable for the Jags.

 

What argument can you make that Alex is better than Eli. Just out of curiosity.

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While that is true,, over just the past decade we have seen the Raiders, Browns, Bills, Bucs, Lions, Texans (first 10 years,, I'll give you they were expansion team) have a long stretch of basic irrelevance.


That is just since around 2002, 2004?


I agree, it should be easier these days. But, it still happens to some franchises.


Jags

 

Yep.


 

Before free agency it could be ascribed to getting in too deep a hole, with only the draft as a way out. Now it's just the mark of overall poor management. I'm not happy that the Jags are listed along with the Browns, Raiders, and Millen-era Lions. I'm less happy that the Jags are setting futility records 'surpassing' even those clubs.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

The Jags has lost to Charlie Whitehurst, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Kirk Cousins. They don't deserve to be favorites over your local community college's football squad.

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The Jags has lost to Charlie Whitehurst, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Kirk Cousins. They don't deserve to be favorites over your local community college's football squad.

lol We lost to Charlie friggin Whitehurst and Kirk Cousins.... Man thats really bad. Atleast Fitz has beaten some other teams but the Skins and titans are tuuuurrrriiiibbbbllleeee.

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What argument can you make that Alex is better than Eli. Just out of curiosity.

 

Better quarterback rating since 2009? More consistent?


 

I'm not saying Smith is better than Eli, only that one could make a reasonable argument that he is.
 Frankly doing a thorough analysis of opposing QBs isn't something I waste time on. If you think Eli is a franchise QB and Smith isn't ... well my impression is that they're pretty much equal and you're cutting the dividing line pretty close.

 

I probably wouldn't be satisfied with either one QB'ing my team, and would hope the GM would find an upgrade.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Better quarterback rating since 2009? More consistent?


 

I'm not saying Smith is better than Eli, only that one could make a reasonable argument that he is.
 Frankly doing a thorough analysis of opposing QBs isn't something I waste time on. If you think Eli is a franchise QB and Smith isn't ... well my impression is that they're pretty much equal and you're cutting the dividing line pretty close.

 

I probably wouldn't be satisfied with either one QB'ing my team, and would hope the GM would find an upgrade.

 

I don't think those arguments would hold up to scrutiny, or even to passing evaluation by people who understand football.

 

Eli hasn't set the world on fire, but Alex Smith has been king game manager.

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The Jags has lost to Charlie Whitehurst, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Kirk Cousins. They don't deserve to be favorites over your local community college's football squad.

 

The Jags were so badly beaten by Cousins that he was being heralded as the Redskins best QB and worthy starter. Now he's behind Colt McCoy.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

I don't think those arguments would hold up to scrutiny, or even to passing evaluation by people who understand football.

 

Eli hasn't set the world on fire, but Alex Smith has been king game manager.

 

Yes. "PEOPLE WHO UNDERSTAND FOOTBALL"


 

The great authority cited by someone who has no other argument. I don't have any facts so I'll appeal to authority (even if it's made-up authority).

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Yes. "PEOPLE WHO UNDERSTAND FOOTBALL"


 

The great authority cited by someone who has no other argument. I don't have any facts so I'll appeal to authority (even if it's made-up authority).

 

It wasn't an appeal to anything.

 

What you're essentially saying is a very crude examination of one metric might make it seem like Alex is better.

 

My response is that anyone examining their careers more granularly would dismiss Alex Smith as a better player than Eli.

 

I'm not appealing to anything, I'm merely discounting your criteria.

 

That said, if you want to believe that those with the capability to understand the statistics wouldn't come away believing Eli is better that's fine, I won't try to convince you further.

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It wasn't an appeal to anything.

 

What you're essentially saying is a very crude examination of one metric might make it seem like Alex is better.

 

My response is that anyone examining their careers more granularly would dismiss Alex Smith as a better player than Eli.

 

I'm not appealing to anything, I'm merely discounting your criteria.

 

That said, if you want to believe that those with the capability to understand the statistics wouldn't come away believing Eli is better that's fine, I won't try to convince you further.

lol Someone actually thinks Alex Smith is better than a 2-time SB winning QB? Yikes....

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lol Someone actually thinks Alex Smith is better than a 2-time SB winning QB? Yikes....

 

Even not noting the SB win, just putting their stats lined up against each other without taking into account which is which, who would you think is better?

 

The guy who has thrown for 40,000 yards, or the guy who has thrown for 20,000 yards?

 

The guy who has thrown for 250+ TDs, or the guy who has thrown for 120?

 

It's not like Eli's been perfect, but Alex Smith is the very definition of "staying out of the way of his team's ability to win."

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Even not noting the SB win, just putting their stats lined up against each other without taking into account which is which, who would you think is better?

 

The guy who has thrown for 40,000 yards, or the guy who has thrown for 20,000 yards?

 

The guy who has thrown for 250+ TDs, or the guy who has thrown for 120?

 

It's not like Eli's been perfect, but Alex Smith is the very definition of "staying out of the way of his team's ability to win."

Alex Smith has not thrown a TD to his WR's all year.... conversation over.

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It wasn't an appeal to anything.

 

What you're essentially saying is a very crude examination of one metric might make it seem like Alex is better.

 

My response is that anyone examining their careers more granularly would dismiss Alex Smith as a better player than Eli.

 

I'm not appealing to anything, I'm merely discounting your criteria.

 

That said, if you want to believe that those with the capability to understand the statistics wouldn't come away believing Eli is better that's fine, I won't try to convince you further.

 

Below is a link to a (preseason) list from NFL.com. It has Smith higher than Eli. This season Smith has played somewhat better, and his team has won a lot more games, so, if anything, their play has only improved Smith's position compared to Eli.



http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...arters-132

 

All I said was that he was "arguably" better, meaning that some people would claim he was better. I never claimed he was better. I expect the results would be mixed if you asked 100 pundits who was the better QB. That's the meaning of "arguably." You asked what criteria might be used. I provided QB rating. I never said that it was definitive. No doubt there are other factors that favor Eli, such as arm strength, Superbowl wins, ...


Frankly, if you want to claim Eli is better I have no problem with it. Your claim that Eli is a franchise QB and Smith isn't puzzles me. Do you really see that much difference between the two?

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Below is a link to a (preseason) list from NFL.com. It has Smith higher than Eli. This season Smith has played somewhat better, and his team has won a lot more games, so, if anything, their play has only improved Smith's position compared to Eli.


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...arters-132

 

All I said was that he was "arguably" better, meaning that some people would claim he was better. I never claimed he was better. I expect the results would be mixed if you asked 100 pundits who was the better QB. That's the meaning of "arguably." You asked what criteria might be used. I provided QB rating. I never said that it was definitive. No doubt there are other factors that favor Eli, such as arm strength, Superbowl wins, ...


Frankly, if you want to claim Eli is better I have no problem with it. Your claim that Eli is a franchise QB and Smith isn't puzzles me. Do you really see that much difference between the two?

 

Yes, and it's clear when you watch them play.

 

Alex Smith is the culmination of a Blaine Gabbert level QB.

 

Eli Manning is more on the Tony Romo/Jay Cutler level, but I'd much rather have a QB that will make some plays from time to time than a QB that I can only count on to play from ahead.

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http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdo...56993.html

 

 

 

Hey, at least we've got something going on.

Were number 1!  Wait the titans will screw that up too... figures

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Yep.


Before free agency it could be ascribed to getting in too deep a hole, with only the draft as a way out. Now it's just the mark of overall poor management. I'm not happy that the Jags are listed along with the Browns, Raiders, and Millen-era Lions. I'm less happy that the Jags are setting futility records 'surpassing' even those clubs.

I completely agree.

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