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Joe · 02-03-2015, 09:16 AM

Quote:If Leonard isn't on the board that means the ransom for the remaining QB is. We take that. It's really that simple

Fully agree.

Joe · 02-03-2015, 09:17 AM

Quote:The thing is...it's not. It really isn't.

Robinson showed the ability to be a solid possession receiver. Hurns showed the ability to get deep but also showed the ability to drop the easy ones. Lee showed flashes, but lacked consistency. As optimistic I am of JB coming back, there's just no guarantee that he'll be where we need him to be, much less that his issues are definitely behind him and he won't get suspended again.

I get there's tons of promise there. But that's all there is to it at this point...promise.

If Calvin Johnson was in this draft, I'd take him #3 and don't think twice (assuming Leonard Williams isn't there). I don't care if we already have Lee, Robinson, or Hurns because quite frankly...none of them has shown the ability of a true #1 WR in the NFL. In fact, our best hope of that still remains Blackmon, who is also the biggest question mark at this position.

Basically, what it comes down to it is that we're simply not a position we're we can afford to be passing up potentially great prospects just because we have OK prospects playing the same position.

That said, I'm not sure Cooper is that elite WR prospect....

Exactly what I was trying to say as well.

SpeedyG · 02-03-2015, 10:24 AM

Quote:If Leonard isn't on the board that means the ransom for the remaining QB is. We take that. It's really that simple

Not so sure about this. I think best case is that TB goes Winston. This guarantees us either Williams or trade down. I think Marcus will have a higher value from a trade up perspective than Winston.

P. Haze · 02-03-2015, 12:30 PM

People talking about taking Cooper at three but now I'm hearing that Kevin White might get drafted before him. That being said I hope Williams is there when we draft because we need a young animal on defense.

Snicklefritz · 02-03-2015, 01:01 PM

Quote:People talking about taking Cooper at three but now I'm hearing that Kevin White might get drafted before him. That being said I hope Williams is there when we draft because we need a young animal on defense.

I'm on the Leonard Williams bandwagon as well or the next best def player or trade back. Taking a wr at 3 just makes zero sense unless it's Calvin. Look at the teams in the Super Bowl. You could make an argument that our wr corps is stronger than both the pats and the Hawks. If you add a healthy Blackmon then ours is definitely better than both teams. Our wrs are good enough, we just need to get stronger pretty much everywhere else.

Crab Cakes and Football! That's what Jacksonville does!

Cleatwood · 02-03-2015, 01:59 PM

Quote:I'm on the Leonard Williams bandwagon as well or the next best def player or trade back. Taking a wr at 3 just makes zero sense unless it's Calvin. Look at the teams in the Super Bowl. You could make an argument that our wr corps is stronger than both the pats and the Hawks. If you add a healthy Blackmon then ours is definitely better than both teams. Our wrs are good enough, we just need to get stronger pretty much everywhere else.

If Cooper was Larry Fitz, Megatron or AJ Green... I would say yea. But he's not.... And he might not even be the best WR in this draft.

Snicklefritz · 02-03-2015, 02:01 PM

Quote:If Cooper was Larry Fitz, Megatron or AJ Green... I would say yea. But he's not.... And he might not even be the best WR in this draft.

Agreed. I prefer kevin white over cooper, way more explosive, but neither are worthy of top 10 consideration.

Crab Cakes and Football! That's what Jacksonville does!

Warjag · 02-04-2015, 01:55 AM

Quote:You said you are using Draftbreakdown correct? Well just watch the three games they have from 2014 on Williams (Fresno St, Cal, Nebraska). He flashes his skill set in all of them. In addition to his skill set it must be noted that he is only 20 years old.

What I like about Williams possibly being a Jag is that presumably he can play the "Big End" position that Big Red plays. The difference is that I believe Williams can be great in run support as well as pass rush from that spot. Teams are passing on run downs than more than ever and I recall many times Big Red was left unblocked rushing the passer but that's just not his strong suit. When Big Red is on the field on passing downs it keeps a better pass rusher off the field.

What I feel Williams can become is a guy who will dominate against the run from the "Big End" spot but will also be able to convert to a pass rusher when he has to from that spot. Of course on obvious passing downs if he really is a good pass rusher you slide him inside over a guard and let him beat interior lineman with his speed/agiliy.

This is just what I've thought of course. If he's as good as people think he will be you probably just slide him in at the 3-tech and let him do his thing.

Thanks I will check it out after college recruiting ends

Stigma · 02-04-2015, 02:39 PM

What happens if Jameis Winston is the QB that falls and the Titans pass on the QB and take Leonard Williams?

What happens if no team wants to trade up for Winston because they think he is too much of a risk with his off-the-field baggage?

Given what has happened to Johnny Manziel, teams may not be willing to pay the freight to move up and if that happens, which it could, and Leonard Williams is gone, will everyone start crying because the Jags take Randy Gregory?

Given how much Jagnation LOVES to CRY about anything and everything, I am thinking that some people should stock up on tissues, JUST IN CASE!

Warjag · 02-26-2015, 03:17 PM

This is the latest LW game film from 2-15 on Draftbreakdown.

http://draftbreakdown.com/video/leonard-...te-2014-2/

huttops · 02-26-2015, 04:33 PM

Quote:This is the latest LW game film from 2-15 on Draftbreakdown.

http://draftbreakdown.com/video/leonard-...te-2014-2/

Great tape on him. I think thats what we could expect from him. Disruptive force in the middle, with excellent instincts and awareness. Has the strength but not exclusively a bull rusher, has the lateral quicks to gain leverage and once he gets his hands on you its game over. They had to use a guard to chip almost 1/5 of the plays I saw. Pretty impressive.

Snicklefritz · 02-26-2015, 04:39 PM

Quote:This is the latest LW game film from 2-15 on Draftbreakdown.

<a class="bbc_url" href='http://draftbreakdown.com/video/leonard-williams-vs-arizona-state-2014-2/'>http://draftbreakdown.com/video/leonard-williams-vs-arizona-state-2014-2/</a>

A very unimpressive game from Williams. He did flash on about 3-5 plays but he did not seem to get a good jump off the snap or a good push when on 1v1 match ups. Just did not look his explosive self in that game IMO and looked flat out slow. I still think he's the best player in the draft but Fowler is closing in.

Crab Cakes and Football! That's what Jacksonville does!

Markulous · 02-26-2015, 04:44 PM

Quote:A very unimpressive game from Williams. He did flash on about 3-5 plays but he did not seem to get a good jump off the snap or a good push when on 1v1 match ups. Just did not look his explosive self in that game IMO and looked flat out slow. I still think he's the best player in the draft but Fowler is closing in.

I can't say I agree here. Their scheme has him come off delayed off the snap for a lot of snaps. On those where he got off the line quickly, I don't see speed being any kind of issue for a 300 lb 3-tech.

Snicklefritz · 02-26-2015, 04:55 PM

Quote:I can't say I agree here. Their scheme has him come off delayed off the snap for a lot of snaps. On those where he got off the line quickly, I don't see speed being any kind of issue for a 300 lb 3-tech.

That is possible because nobody knows how hes been coached or his scheme. I've seen his cut ups of other games and this game was by far his worst. There were too many times when he was matched up over a guard and just could not take advantage. For a player that is considered the number 1 player I just would've like to see more. He had plenty of opportunities in that game to dominate and he just didn't.

Crab Cakes and Football! That's what Jacksonville does!

huttops · 02-26-2015, 05:08 PM

Quote:That is possible because nobody knows how hes been coached or his scheme. I've seen his cut ups of other games and this game was by far his worst. There were too many times when he was matched up over a guard and just could not take advantage. For a player that is considered the number 1 player I just would've like to see more. He had plenty of opportunities in that game to dominate and he just didn't.

If you thought that was his least impressive game, you should check out some cutups of Beasley and Fowler. They can get washed out at time but williams consistently generates the push even with double teams and quick outs.

EDIT: The point I'm trying to make is that the difference between Williams and anyone else, floor wise, is pretty eyeopening.

Snicklefritz · 02-26-2015, 05:34 PM

Quote:If you thought that was his least impressive game, you should check out some cutups of Beasley and Fowler. They can get washed out at time but williams consistently generates the push even with double teams and quick outs.

EDIT: The point I'm trying to make is that the difference between Williams and anyone else, floor wise, is pretty eyeopening.

I said it was Williams' least impressive game so I don't know how much it would help me if I watched Beasley or Fowler. If you watch Fowlers game vs ECU you can see him get doubled more than Williams usually does and still be disruptive and productive. Williams is a very good prospect and probably does have the highest floor along with Fowler, but you are lying to yourself if you think that game was a good one by Williams' standards.

Just my opinion.

Crab Cakes and Football! That's what Jacksonville does!

jj82284 · 03-01-2015, 03:27 PM

Quote:We struggled on both sides of the ball, and offense will likely be a focus in free agency.

Watt is a 3-4 inside guy too, and didn't have many sacks in college, about the same as Williams. Not sure if Williams is quite as athletic, but they seem pretty close to the same type of prospect.

Watt was a converted te, he only played two years at the position. Even still his tfl numbers dwarf Williams and athletically they aren't on the same planet. JJ watt has a Waldo's skill set with an every position frame. That's different than a bit who has to play 3/5

pirkster · 03-02-2015, 02:36 PM

Simply put, he's the top prospect of the draft.

If it weren't for Winston (an elite QB prospect), he'd be the first overall.

"You do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud."

pirkster · 03-02-2015, 02:42 PM

Quote:People talking about taking Cooper at three but now I'm hearing that Kevin White might get drafted before him. That being said I hope Williams is there when we draft because we need a young animal on defense.

IMO, Cooper/White is a lot like Luck/RG3.

Cooper is the safer pick with higher floor, but White may have more upside potential.

"You do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud."

knarnn · 03-02-2015, 10:49 PM

Quote:A very unimpressive game from Williams. He did flash on about 3-5 plays but he did not seem to get a good jump off the snap or a good push when on 1v1 match ups. Just did not look his explosive self in that game IMO and looked flat out slow. I still think he's the best player in the draft but Fowler is closing in.

Quote:I can't say I agree here. Their scheme has him come off delayed off the snap for a lot of snaps. On those where he got off the line quickly, I don't see speed being any kind of issue for a 300 lb 3-tech.

Fast forward to 4:15

<a class="bbc_url" href='http://prod.video.jaguars.clubs.nfl.com//JAC/videos/dct/video_audio/2015/02-February/20150225-jagsLIVECosell-1200k.mp4'>http://prod.video.jaguars.clubs.nfl.com//JAC/videos/dct/video_audio/2015/02-February/20150225-jagsLIVECosell-1200k.mp4</a>

"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."