Not even remotely close, but twist it however you need to do so in order to feel like your moral superiority is winning a debate. 

 

The truth is I agree that there needs to be a discussion about how to keep it from happening again.  We disagree on where the focus needs to be, but hey, you focus on more laws and regulation because that would have saved lives in this instance, right?

I'm focused on the fact that someone who should not have had a gun got his hands on one. The system failed. Why did it fail? What needs to be done to keep it from failing like that again? Changing laws and/or adding new ones is a valid part of the discussion. Saying that there's no point in revisiting existing laws because a law wouldn't have stopped the shooter is the ultimate cop-out, and I think you know that.

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http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/06..._from.html


Alabama took a step forward today.

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I'm focused on the fact that someone who should not have had a gun got his hands on one. The system failed. Why did it fail? What needs to be done to keep it from failing like that again? Changing laws and/or adding new ones is a valid part of the discussion. Saying that there's no point in revisiting existing laws because a law wouldn't have stopped the shooter is the ultimate cop-out, and I think you know that.

 

So a simple question for you (or anyone else).  What laws need to be changed or added specifically to address what happened and prevent it from happening in the future?

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

So the confederate flag is banned from being sold due to social pressure because racist. When are these companies going to ban the Egyptian flag, Roman flag, Russian Empire flag, UK flag, Portuguese flag, Spanish flag, Nazi Germany flag, USSR flag, PR of China flag,  Imperial Japan flag, and South Africa flag? They are all equally if not more racist and certainly more devastating to enslaved populations.

 

The hypocrisy is unreal.

 

 

However, all of the businesses that are claiming that they are going to remove the Confederate Battle Flag from their stock will continue to carry items depicting Che Guevara.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

So a simple question for you (or anyone else).  What laws need to be changed or added specifically to address what happened and prevent it from happening in the future?

If I had the answer to that, I'd be running for President. That's what the discussion at a national level is for. I do have a few ideas:

 

1. Lengthen waiting periods for a more thorough background check.

2. That background check must include a thorough review of medical history. Mental illness of any kind, including depression, means no gun for you.

3. Make it illegal for guns to be gifted or passed down without the recipient passing the same background check.

4. If a person commits a crime using your gun and you hadn't previously reported it stolen, you are charged with negligence and/or providing a firearm to an unlicensed individual. This includes parents who don't properly secure their weapons, allowing their children of any age to get a hold of them.

 

I also have some more broad ideas about limiting the number/type of weapons that can be owned by anyone or any organization (including police, FBI, etc., military exempted), limiting the amount of ammunition you can legally possess, etc., but I'm not an expert on gun laws. A lot of it is simply making sure we do a better job of enforcing the gun laws we have on the books, and there's no doubt that those laws failed in this instance.

 

An idea I've kicked around in my head in the past is banning concealed carry nationwide and making open carry legal everywhere except schools at the same time. If we're going to have guns, we might as well be upfront about it, and if the Charleston shooter had walked into that church and seen four of the nine parishioners packing heat, maybe he'd have had a change of heart about pulling out that gun of his own. There aren't many things that can make you rethink an action taken against another human being like seeing a firearm strapped to said human being's waist can.

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However, all of the businesses that are claiming that they are going to remove the Confederate Battle Flag from their stock will continue to carry items depicting Che Guevara.

Which is, imo, hypocrisy at its finest.

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If I had the answer to that, I'd be running for President. That's what the discussion at a national level is for. I do have a few ideas:


1. Lengthen waiting periods for a more thorough background check.

2. That background check must include a thorough review of medical history. Mental illness of any kind, including depression, means no gun for you.

3. Make it illegal for guns to be gifted or passed down without the recipient passing the same background check.

4. If a person commits a crime using your gun and you hadn't previously reported it stolen, you are charged with negligence and/or providing a firearm to an unlicensed individual. This includes parents who don't properly secure their weapons, allowing their children of any age to get a hold of them.


I also have some more broad ideas about limiting the number/type of weapons that can be owned by anyone or any organization (including police, FBI, etc., military exempted), limiting the amount of ammunition you can legally possess, etc., but I'm not an expert on gun laws. A lot of it is simply making sure we do a better job of enforcing the gun laws we have on the books, and there's no doubt that those laws failed in this instance.


An idea I've kicked around in my head in the past is banning concealed carry nationwide and making open carry legal everywhere except schools at the same time. If we're going to have guns, we might as well be upfront about it, and if the Charleston shooter had walked into that church and seen four of the nine parishioners packing heat, maybe he'd have had a change of heart about pulling out that gun of his own. There aren't many things that can make you rethink an action taken against another human being like seeing a firearm strapped to said human being's waist can.

Very good stuff

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If I had the answer to that, I'd be running for President. That's what the discussion at a national level is for. I do have a few ideas:

 

1. Lengthen waiting periods for a more thorough background check.

2. That background check must include a thorough review of medical history. Mental illness of any kind, including depression, means no gun for you.

3. Make it illegal for guns to be gifted or passed down without the recipient passing the same background check.

4. If a person commits a crime using your gun and you hadn't previously reported it stolen, you are charged with negligence and/or providing a firearm to an unlicensed individual. This includes parents who don't properly secure their weapons, allowing their children of any age to get a hold of them.

 

I also have some more broad ideas about limiting the number/type of weapons that can be owned by anyone or any organization (including police, FBI, etc., military exempted), limiting the amount of ammunition you can legally possess, etc., but I'm not an expert on gun laws. A lot of it is simply making sure we do a better job of enforcing the gun laws we have on the books, and there's no doubt that those laws failed in this instance.

 

An idea I've kicked around in my head in the past is banning concealed carry nationwide and making open carry legal everywhere except schools at the same time. If we're going to have guns, we might as well be upfront about it, and if the Charleston shooter had walked into that church and seen four of the nine parishioners packing heat, maybe he'd have had a change of heart about pulling out that gun of his own. There aren't many things that can make you rethink an action taken against another human being like seeing a firearm strapped to said human being's waist can.

 

1.  The waiting period is long enough.

2.  The background check already includes checking health records (as far as I know).

3.  This would make it very difficult to enforce.  As an example, when my grandfather passed away I got his gun collection.  For what it's worth, included in that collection are a lot of "vintage" firearms that I'll probably never use, but do display.

4.  There are already negligence laws on the books.

 

Limiting the number and/or types of weapons is not an option.  Again, you are targeting innocent individuals, the vast majority of them legal and law abiding citizens.  I personally happen to own a pretty good sized gun collection, and I have ammunition for a lot of them.

 

You also want to cuff and limit capabilities of law enforcement, and I disagree with that as well.

 

Banning concealed carry is not really a good idea.  What you are doing is placing law abiding citizens in harm's way.  I get your point, but being "open carry" would take us back to the days of the "wild west" that so many "anti gun" people bring up.  Open carry works in more rural areas, but it certainly wouldn't work in a place like Washington DC or New York City.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

1. The waiting period is long enough.

2. The background check already includes checking health records (as far as I know).

3. This would make it very difficult to enforce. As an example, when my grandfather passed away I got his gun collection. For what it's worth, included in that collection are a lot of "vintage" firearms that I'll probably never use, but do display.

4. There are already negligence laws on the books.


Limiting the number and/or types of weapons is not an option. Again, you are targeting innocent individuals, the vast majority of them legal and law abiding citizens. I personally happen to own a pretty good sized gun collection, and I have ammunition for a lot of them.


You also want to cuff and limit capabilities of law enforcement, and I disagree with that as well.


Banning concealed carry is not really a good idea. What you are doing is placing law abiding citizens in harm's way. I get your point, but being "open carry" would take us back to the days of the "wild west" that so many "anti gun" people bring up. Open carry works in more rural areas, but it certainly wouldn't work in a place like Washington DC or New York City.

What's so hard to enforce about #3? Why couldn't you take them to get registered?

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What's so hard to enforce about #3? Why couldn't you take them to get registered?

A gun registery should not exist, it's the first step to confiscation.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

A gun registery should not exist, it's the first step to confiscation.

 

In that case, be prepared for the day our evil government confiscates our automobiles.

 

And boats.

 

And mobile homes.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

A gun registery should not exist, it's the first step to confiscation.

What's your basis for saying that?

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What's your basis for saying that?

History, every gun registration has lead to confiscation

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History, every gun registration has lead to confiscation

Really?  Because most countries today require registration.  And many of those countries... still haven't seen people have all their guns confiscated.

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I was wrong about Trent Baalke. 

Slippery slope fallacy^^

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More anti-gun laws is not the answer. It never has been and never will be the answer.


No law is going to stop a crazy person or criminal from having a gun. If they want one, they will get one.


Having more guns in the hands of properly trained good people is better than making it more difficult for people to get a gun. Restricting gun use is a bad, bad idea in my opinion.


Mental illness is a bigger problem than guns.

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Mental illness is a bigger problem than guns.

Excuse me?!

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What's so hard to enforce about #3? Why couldn't you take them to get registered?

What good does registering a gun do? It would have prevented nothing had his gun been registered.


The government invades my privacy enough as is. It is none of their damn business what guns I own.

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Excuse me?!

Yes?

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Yes?

What do you mean when you say that mental illness is a bigger problem than guns, exactly?

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