I am totally for raising the minimum wage, while I realize that it doesn't solve the problem & will only increase the costs of services & goods (it will win votes & make people happy at least short term). The true solution is to fix the unfair trade wars with foreign countries & raise tariffs on goods & services imported into our country. To deport the illegal immigrants that cost our country billions of dollars in financial aid from schools, hospitals, police & fire, courts, and congress for constantly wasting Tax dollars making criminals legal that should've been deported 3 decades ago.

Well I hope you're ready for inflation.

---

LOL, you asked, and I pointed out something that you ignored.  You would have continued to ignore it, unless I called it out.  But whatever...  It's all good.  You have your own blind spot.  I'm sure I have mine.  

 

Though I cannot remember the last time you mentioned something that I said that you could despute.  Where as I've provided many instances where your bias has been flat out wrong.

 

And let me do it again right here...

 

"Although the nominal value of the minimum wage was increased by $5.65 (from $1.60 to $7.25) between 1968 and 2009, these legislated adjustments did not enable the minimum wage to keep pace with the increase in consumer prices, so the real minimum wage fell."  https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42973.pdf

 

I know that badger is gonna freak out that I'm providing facts with a cited source.  But guess what-- facts determine what is real and what isn't.

 

You and Oface are the same poster with differing ideologies.  Both of you take bits and pieces of the truth to skew reality in order for it to fit your own pre-conceived world view.  You know some things and then you leave out other things in order to make your point.

 

Oface does it for climate change, you do it for all things "conservative".  It's rather sad, but easily debunked.  I did it to you as well in terms of "taxes" and the administrative cost to a business.

 

I'm doing it to you again here with the minimum wage.  The real value of the minimum wage has decreased dramatically over time.  Productivity and profits of business has increased over time.  Deal with the facts, my friend.  Supply side economics does not work.  

 

I'm gonna start calling you jj-face...  

 

I have to say, my dear friend.  This is a new low for you.  

 

You said, "Eisenhower believed in common sense regulation and livable wages."  I said, okay if you want to go back to a dollar as the minimum wage then that's fine (what it was under eisenhower).  I also stated correctly that he would not look too kindly on the idea of prosecuting any group that denied AGCC or threatening a state because it puts boy girl signs on bathrooms.  

 

Your new assertion of my IRRATIONAL BIAS is your belief that the only meaningful indicator of economic growth is the increase of the federal minimum wage to inflation?  

 

If i ever start smoking, i want what u got cause it MUST BE GOOD! 

---

Freedom is only for the wealthy.  The ability to organize and exercise one's best interest is not something that the workers of our country are granted.  It's interesting that nobody ever wonders about that.  It's always about how the poor wealthy business folks that are making profits hand over fist have it so hard.  

 

But the moment a group of workers want to organize, they are evil and want to destroy the world.  I mean, look at those evil teachers!  They are going to be the death of America, if you listen to Rush, Glen, and the happy go lucky Fox And Friends 24/7 News Hour...

 

1.) we pay more than any country for education and we don't have a positive return on investment. 

 

2.) Freedom is greatest for those that are employers not employees.  At the beginning of the 20th century roughly 90 to 95% of the population were independent.  today roughly 90 to 95% of the population work for someone else.  This concentration of the means of production is the greatest contributor to what some call INCOME INEQUALITY.  If you wan to limit or mitigate that then that means more people have to develop a marketable skill and be willing to take the risk of self employment.  Raising the minimum wage 50c isn't going to make a dramatic difference if everyone is still at the fry flipper level.  

---

but if someone had a $300,000 mortgage and all of a sudden the minimum wage was repealed and the standard pay became $3 an hour, there is no way they could pay their mortgage they already have...The bank won't refinance because they already put out the $300k and they want it back

 

 

how did someone making minimum wage qualify for a 300k loan to start with?

---

how did someone making minimum wage qualify for a 300k loan to start with?

Bill Clinton.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I'm curious what you have against public unions?

 

Management (politicians) and Labor (government employees) in collusion against ownership (the taxpayers).

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

While I respect your hard work, diligence, sacrifices, and intelligence, you were absolutely, 100% lucky.

 

 

You were born in the United States of America.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

(drops mic)

 

300 million have that same advantage but I don't see all them doing as well as Eric. Living here is a huge advantage, but it's not the be all, end all of success.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

That's also great until there are 50 people applying for 1 job...or 300 people looking for a job when there are only 10 available...I get at least 10 applications a week even if I'm not hiring, when I need 3 or 4 people, I go through at least 50 applications

 

So pay more for your labor so you have fewer jobs to offer? C'mon now.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Folks, we are probably headed for a UBI (universal basic income) for all.  Automation, robotics, and especially AI will eliminate nearly ALL jobs, including white collar jobs.  So how will we buy all the stuff produced by robots?  They'll essentially have to GIVE us the money.

---

All that happens by screwing over the people at the bottom is more corporate welfare...

---

Now trump no longer "self-financing" (cause anyone taking donations is beholded to third parties, remember, remember) has hired a former Goldman Sachs fundraiser that has managed and made massive donations to Soros and Clinton. March trump march!

http://www.dailywire.com/news/5486/4-sig...en-shapiro

 

Ok, weren't you ready to cast a vote for Ted Cruz???  He had the Goldman-Sachs and Bush connections... now that Trump gets establishment assistance, it's a problem?

---

The real solution is to eliminate most of the government jobs and make it a private sector matter, in that case I fully support unions. It's pathetic that the best career trajectory today is to land a job working for the government. 

 

I fully support public unions.  You absolutely have a say in the negotiations.  You vote for the people who make the decisions.  Workers ought to have a right to collectively bargain.  Even public workers.  


This is a big part of why I'll never vote Libertarian again.  Their idea that almost everything needs to be privatized.  The private sector isn't going to make things better.  Competition doesn't make everything better.  If it did, we'd see much better internet services in the U.S. than we see now.  For our society to truly work, some things just can't be fully privatized.   Education is a big one.  It's too important, because it's about more than just making sure people can get a job.  I know we'll never agree on this issue, but that's exactly why I won't be a libertarian.  I can't budge on the issue of education.  It's too important to me.  Not because my wife is a teacher, or that I have kids in the public school system.  But because I want to live in a country where every student has a good opportunity to get an education instead of going to some for-profit school that's just looking out to make a quick buck from desperate parents.  


I agree that we spend too much money.  When I was a conservative, I was a conservative because I felt we needed to reign in spending.   But some of it is money well spent.  That's a big part of what moved me left.  I'm more than happy when my tax dollars are spent on something like education, police, or health care.  Not so happy when it's spent on corporate welfare, or getting into yet another expensive war.  

---

I was wrong about Trent Baalke. 

The pure libertarian thinks the wild west approach is a cure all.  The market will work itself out, even if chaos ensues... well, that's life.

---

The pure libertarian thinks the wild west approach is a cure all.  The market will work itself out, even if chaos ensues... well, that's life.

 

No, that's anarchy. Limited, Constitutional, minimally-invasive government is the best government. 

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I'm actually interested in the Swiss model that's currently under consideration. $2,500 income per month per person with an additional $650 per month per child up to 4 children. Trade that for the elimination of ALL social programs and I'm in.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Ok, weren't you ready to cast a vote for Ted Cruz??? He had the Goldman-Sachs and Bush connections... now that Trump gets establishment assistance, it's a problem?

I'm pointing out the irony of all the trumpettes screaming cruz just had to be a phoney establishment type since he had Goldman Sachs ties and nkw trump is doing the same.

---

I'm pointing out the irony of all the trumpettes screaming cruz just had to be a phoney establishment type since he had Goldman Sachs ties and nkw trump is doing the same.

 

In theory, yes. He won the election in spite of not having that massive support.  Now the establishment has no choice but to back him or just let Hillary win.

---

I'm actually interested in the Swiss model that's currently under consideration. $2,500 income per month per person with an additional $650 per month per child up to 4 children. Trade that for the elimination of ALL social programs and I'm in.

So that would replace public education, transportation and postal services?

---

In theory, yes. He won the election in spite of not having that massive support. Now the establishment has no choice but to back him or just let Hillary win.

But wasn't the entire apeal that he was going to be a candidate that was above the influence of big banks because he didn't need them? Basicly all the jargin about him being a new politician and above doner influence was balony he just has the funding to last longer than everyone else. Shocker

---

We got out because we worked hard, not because we where lucky. There was nothing lucky about it, I earned it. I learned a new trade in my mid 20's while working two-three jobs to make ends meet for a family of 4 at the time. I invested in my education and took night  and summer college courses. I lived within my means moving the now family of 6 into a 2 bedroom duplex so we could take the financial hit and finish my degree. I went back to work and got my certifications and built time on my resume and when the time was right I found ample employers looking for an educated, experienced, certified mechanic/service manager.

 

it wasn't luck, it was hard work and anyone can do it. 

 

What you describe used to be known as "The American Dream".  The problem is, a vast bulk of our population isn't willing to make the sacrifices necessary to achieve success.  They expect the government to provide it.  My story is similar to yours though I chose a different path to get to the end result.

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.