One thought I just had that has absolutely no basis whatsoever...I wonder if Maester Aemon suspected somehow who Jon really was in retrospect? I can't quite put my finger on it and there's no basis for this, mind you.

 

Much like with Varys...there's no actual justification for it. However, in the books Varys has what is made out to be an almost supernatural skill in disguise although my comment was more a poke at all the comments I see made around the interwebs about how quickly he gets around Westeros (i.e. teleportation device). Never mind that there are almost always subtle time skips in play even in last night's episode. If you look closely during the final sequence, there are ships from both Dorne and Highgarden amdist Dany's already considerable armada (which would indicate a time skip of a couple of months thinking realistically). It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Varys had a childhood after his incident that mirrored Arya's even if Varys isn't a killer necessarily.

 

Speaking of which, who wants to bet dollars to donuts Varys ends up killing Qyburn? I don't think the real Master of Whispers will take to kindly to what Qyburn the Imposter has corrupted his little birds into becoming.

 

Edit: I also wonder, based on what you said about Lyanna, if indeed her relationship with Rhaegar may have been consensual. What little I know of Rhaegar doesn't seem to substantiate him being a rapist...which is apparently somewhat corroborated by Ned's and Barristan's opinion of him (which I just had to look up to confirm).

There is a lot of insight available on Rhaegar/Lyanna if you want to check it out. I don't want to post it here for those that don't want too much backstory.

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I dont remember the episode but I think it was after the red wedding but wasn't Bran telling a story about how a cook killed the kings son into a pie and fed him to the king lol...I think immediately after that scene they went to Walder Frey (I been rewatching the series) 

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I dont remember the episode but I think it was after the red wedding but wasn't Bran telling a story about how a cook killed the kings son into a pie and fed him to the king lol...I think immediately after that scene they went to Walder Frey (I been rewatching the series)

The story of the Rat King. It's a story about the caution of betraying a guest in your home. Which also ties back to Frey.

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Just saw it and- WOW. 

 

Jon Snow the "bastard" is a Stark AND a Targaryen. Take that Sansa, Littlefinger and all of Westeros. This should make things wholly more interesting. Wouldn't he be the true heir over Dany as she is younger than him? And he is Ned (by way of Lyanna) and Dany's (by way of Raegar) nephew. Mind blowing. I was pretty sure of his parentage earlier in the season but to think of it outside of just who his parents are and the implications is interesting. I think Dany will not take the news well. 

 

I don't know what Sansa's issue with Jon is but she needs to get over it. She should have told him about the Knights of the Vale. Stupid girl. A lot of people got killed because she didn't quite trust Jon or felt jilted because he didn't ask her opinion on how to deal with Ramsey. I don't hate her but she's not my favorite. 

 

I can't wait to see what Bran can do!

 

Arya is an interesting kind of scary. She has done what she needed to in order to survive but to what end? She's now a mercenary even if it is for personal reasons instead of for hire. There are people still alive on her hit list. Will it be her or Jamie who kills Cersei?

 

Oleanna Tyrell is outstanding. So is Lady Mormont. That's all I need to say about them.

 

Tommen..... I guffawed out loud when he jumped. I didn't see that coming but when it happened I wasn't surprised. I'm glad he did it if only to be another feather in Cersei's Crappy Mother Cap. I think Jamie is not going to be happy AT ALL when he finds out what she did. She may not have actually pushed Tommen out that window but she may as well have. Did she think he would end himself? I don't know, but it got her what she wanted and that should be very suspect for Jamie. Her goal has always been the Iron Throne and now that she is actually sitting on it I don't see her letting anyone take it away or question her, including her brother. 

 

I still don't care much for Dany but I like that she trusts Tyrion. She would be stupid not to and being as they're headed for his old stomping grounds and she's going to come up against Cersei...she's going to need all the help she can get, dragons or no. Cersei is a special kind of crazy and Tyrion has been at the business end of her crazy all his life. 

 

Nothing turned out the way I thought it would for this episode, but I also didn't know what to expect. All I know is it was pretty sweet and sets the next season up to be super interesting on so many levels. 

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The dad is Rhaegar Targaryen. The reason she was saying promise me to Ned is because if Robert Baratheon found out that the girl he was supposed to marry had a kid with his enemy then he would've wanted Jon dead. So Ned pretended Jon was his to keep him safe and literally told no one, not even his wife (which strained their relationship).


So technically Jon is a Targaryen.

 

And has a better claim on the Iron Throne than Dany.  That could get interesting.  Also, did I just imagine it or was there a little spark there between Jon and Sansa for a second?  Though they don't know it, they're technically cousins and in this world that wouldn't prevent a Targaryen/Stark alliance.  Just sayin'.

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I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you. 
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He does not have a better claim. Rhaegar and Lyanna were not married either. He's not a snow, he's a Blackfyre.

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I don't think Jon would have a higher claim. Unless Raeghar had a second marriage in secret he is still a b word while Danny is legitimate. 

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I don't think Jon would have a higher claim. Unless Raeghar had a second marriage in secret he is still a b word while Danny is legitimate.

I think he does by virtue of him being male though. Remember the Boltons...Ramsay was only concerned if his father's child was born male, which he was. The implication was that if that child were female, Ramsay would still be next in line.


Or am I mis-remembering how that all went down?

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<i>Behold man's final mad disgrace.</i>

<i>He chops his nose to spite his face.</i>

 

-Etrigan the Demon

 

He does not have a better claim. Rhaegar and Lyanna were not married either. He's not a snow, he's a Blackfyre.

Dang, you're right. And he's still a [BAD WORD REMOVED]. I was so excited by all that happened I didn't even think of that.

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I think he does by virtue of him being male though. Remember the Boltons...Ramsay was only concerned if his father's child was born male, which he was. The implication was that if that child were female, Ramsay would still be next in line.


Or am I mis-remembering how that all went down?

Ramsey would have been threatened by a true born son. I assume that trumps anything else and why he killed his stepmother and new baby brother. 

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I don't think Jon wants to be king of the whole thing, I think he's content just ruling the north.

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I think he does by virtue of him being male though. Remember the Boltons...Ramsay was only concerned if his father's child was born male, which he was. The implication was that if that child were female, Ramsay would still be next in line.


Or am I mis-remembering how that all went down?

Ramsey was legitimized. He was Ramsey Bolton not Ramsey Snow anymore. Jon is still Jon Snow.

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Ramsey would have been threatened by a true born son. I assume that trumps anything else and why he killed his stepmother and new baby brother. 

That also yeah

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I don't think Jon wants to be king of the whole thing, I think he's content just ruling the north.

I'm not sure Jon wants to rule anything. Just recently he wanted to head down to Boca and just relax. He might want to defeat the threat of the Night King but other than that.....

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I think he does by virtue of him being male though. Remember the Boltons...Ramsay was only concerned if his father's child was born male, which he was. The implication was that if that child were female, Ramsay would still be next in line.


Or am I mis-remembering how that all went down?

 

Considering Jon was proclaimed King of the North as his half sister watched, you'd think his gender would trump Dany, for consistency's sake.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

Considering Jon was proclaimed King of the North as his half sister watched, you'd think his gender would trump Dany, for consistency's sake.

You would think but then that might make for a boring story. Dany believes she's the one and will not take Jon's claim well, whether it's him that does it (which I don't see that happening) or someone else does so on his behalf. I don't think they're going to be buddies when they finally meet, at least not on her part. Then again, she may be happy to have a living blood relative since she thinks she's the last of her line. And you could do much worse than Jon Snow.

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You would think but then that might make for a boring story. Dany believes she's the one and will not take Jon's claim well, whether it's him that does it (which I don't see that happening) or someone else does so on his behalf. I don't think they're going to be buddies when they finally meet, at least not on her part. Then again, she may be happy to have a living blood relative since she thinks she's the last of her line. And you could do much worse than Jon Snow.

Jon has 2 choices as of now, and one of them he doesn't know of.


Fight the white walkers with the "army" he thinks he has now after getting back winterfell, or fall inline behind the [BLEEP] that is rolling up on his port with 1k ships and 3 dragons.


Like Dani or not she is the one to beat now. And she is gathering allies from places she hasn't even been.

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"I'm gonna have to say NO to the reading of the Latin!"

Ah... Here's our new after loss meltdown .gif for the upcoming season. Is that Everbank Stadium burning in the distance?

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Targaryens are above the laws of men. That's why they could marry their siblings, and they also practiced polygamy as well. Who's to say that Rhaegar, a known traditionalist, didn't decide to revive the practice and marry Lyanna in the South? He would be a true born son of Rhaegar and have a better claim than Dany, although if he was smart he would marry her for the sake of the realm and allow her to rule, he taking at most a joint power position. Jon values the good of the realm more than his own ambition and I think he would want to secure Danys help against the Others at any cost.

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"Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other." Galatians 5:26

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Jon has 2 choices as of now, and one of them he doesn't know of.


Fight the white walkers with the "army" he thinks he has now after getting back winterfell, or fall inline behind the [BAD WORD REMOVED] that is rolling up on his port with 1k ships and 3 dragons.


Like Dani or not she is the one to beat now. And she is gathering allies from places she hasn't even been.

 

It wouldn't make for very compelling TV if he quietly fell in line, though.

 

They're likely going to be at odds until Bran and Meera (it wouldn't surprise me if she dies early in the season just to make Bran's trek more arduous, drawn out and unrealistic) finally make their way back over the Wall. His remaining purpose is two-fold. Provide the avenue for the Night King's army to pass the Wall (inadvertently) and provide the means for men to defend themselves by bringing to light Jon's and Dany's shared ancestry.

 

Incidentally, I am of the belief that Dany is already aware of Jon's presence in the north so she has one up on him as of right now. She's allied herself with the Iron Born, Dornish and the armies of Highgarden in addition to her army from Essos. One of those three factions, most likely those from Highgarden, would already be aware of what happened in the North by the time they set sail. And that's assuming Varys didn't pick up that bit of intel traveling to and fro.

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<i>Behold man's final mad disgrace.</i>

<i>He chops his nose to spite his face.</i>

 

-Etrigan the Demon