(01-25-2019, 10:22 PM)Last42min Wrote: The single greatest problem in a political/religious debate is ones willingness to criticize their own positions. "Team" politics is ruinous to civility because people value ideology over principles (especially as it pertains to character). Ideology is the absence of the pursuit of truth. The vocal minority tends to get the most attention, and it ultimately leads to the moderates of each side supporting positions they might otherwise reject. People end up aligning themselves with people they shouldn't, simply because they are closer in ideology, even if they completely disagree with their character. Once that happens, then a certain type of behavior becomes the status quo. And before someone pops out with their "gotcha," yes, this also applies to Trump. However, that is not an incident that happened by itself. We are basically seeing conflict escalation in US politics.

I read this forum more than the Jags forum. I agree that insults and name calling are thrown about more here than they should be, but the implications are also greater than anything one would debate in the Home Team forum. It doesn't matter if someone believes Blake is the best QB ever to wear a uniform. It does matter to some people if late term abortions are legalized or banned. Whether we have this forum or not, "othering" has become a trend in American politics, and it's not going to go away without some kind of drastic change. Imo, it's good to have this forum so you can at least communicate with people that think differently.

you're correct that ideology is the absence of truth but it goes even deeper than that. 
In a democracy with multiple parties and multiple regional interests, the only way to govern is by coalition.  After the coalition wins and gets what it wants, it writes an ideology to explain and preserve itself.
Unfortunately in ours, coalitions are sticky and the ideologies that explain them last much longer than they should and get more convoluted than a soap opera.  Even after no one really believe or understands the original ideology, the husk of the party with its name recognition and access to the ballot in all 50 states is too valuable.  That husk will attract interlopers. These new people who will seem to the old ideologues to have no principles.

So on this level, Trump could have been a very good thing for us, this kind of changing of the guard. If he governed shrewdly there are a lot of openings for him to do things that would be good for everyone that would catch both parties so off guard that they'd be afraid to oppose him.  But he'd rather just lob dumb insults and focus on hot button issues rather than dodge them. Regardless, once he's gone, the Republican party will have become something totally different.

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