(05-19-2022, 09:43 AM)iHaunting Raven Wrote:

(05-18-2022, 11:33 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: Literally no one said either of the things you are claiming here. At least get somewhere on the same continent with your troll job hyperbole. 

Ngakoue screwed up equally to the front office (Coughlin) by holding out for too much and is equally to blame. 
No one is crying about it. It's ancient history - but the new regime needs to be more successful retaining talent. 

Ramsey is even more to blame in his case, but again, the Coughlin element is present. Who knows if a better a FO situation may have negotiated more effectively? We'll never know. 

We're in year 2 of a new rebuild now, and we can't afford to let a Coughlin-type-situation alienate multiple early draft picks before we can sign them to new deals.

I never said anyone said those things, I clearly meant that some people are acting like the team traded them for no reason or...

Read Bullseye's post again, clearly he can't let go of the whole thing and he always posts something similar when talking about those 2.
Caldwell is gone. Ngakoue is gone. Walker pick has nothing to do with Ngakoue.
BTW money was NEVER an issue with Ramsey as Khan said he had no problem making him the highest paid CB in the league. Also, I don't remember many people on the board not wanting to pay Ramsey, so, there was no "dismissing Ramsey because he wanted too much money".

I didn't even quote you on that other post but thanks for letting me know I can still make you cry so easily.

First off, I never mentioned Ngakoue until someone else created this thread, bashing him for a quote he made years after he left the team.  The quote wasn't directly referencing the team in terms of the primary subject matter.  The bashing alleged he still didn't take any responsibility for his career.  The bashing overwhelmingly paints Ramsey and Ngakoue as bad people.  Rarely does it focus on them as football players.  If anyone can't let Ngakoue go, it's your side of this acting like the jilted teen girls mad because their exes have moved on.

Secondly and sadly the facts don't change just because the players have changed teams, which is why my arguments on this matter have not changed.

When Ngakoue and Ramsey were here, they were two of the best three or four defenders on the team that finished in the top 5-10 defensively throughout their stays here.  Only Calais Campbell and Telvin Smith rank among them during that time period.  In just about every objective measurable category, the Jaguars defense was in the abyss before they got here, rose to prominence and dominance when they were here and absolutely fell off a cliff back into the abyss when they left.  That is beyond dispute, even in this very thread.  Those of you who bash Ngakoue and Ramsey as overrated and easily replaceable somehow have no reason, no explanation whatsoever why neither guy has been adequately replaced by this team.  The MOST you've said is that their presence would not have made any difference on a team this bad. Aside from our history showing that wasn't true...giving us our first and only winning season between 2008 amd the present, it raises the patently silly, though perhaps unintentional argument that bad teams should not bother trying to accumulate superior talent in the effort to win. Trevor Lawrence didn't make the difference between last year's team reaching the Super Bowl or not. Does that mean we should get rid of him, too?

But I've come to realize parts of this fan base simply have no appreciation for defensive play makers, even during a time there have been scant offensive play makers to counterbalance it or otherwise merit the admiration of Jaguars fans.  Brackens ranks as the team's all time leading sacker and the preeminent play making catalyst of the Coughlin era teams.  But there was no end to the Brackens bashing.  Popular criticisms included his holdout, and assertions he did not go all out on every play.  Heck, I remember him getting bashed for the play he made against Marino and the Dolphins in the 62-7 win, when he sacked Marino, forced a fumble, recovered the fumble, and actually scored a TD.  It speaks volumes no defensive players have ever gotten serious consideration for the Pride.

While I certainly don't place blame on parts of the fan base for the failings of this team's ownership, front office, and coaching, perhaps part of the fan base has gotten the team they deserve for thirteen out of the last fourteen years, given how they habitually vilify those most responsible for the winning that has taken place here.

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