(06-03-2022, 02:13 PM)JagsFanSince95 Wrote:

(05-26-2022, 02:50 PM)Bullseye Wrote: 1.  So you''d rather have Jared Odrick, Gotsis, or RRH?

2.  In 2020, the Jaguars finished 30th in rush yards allowed, 32nd in rush attempts allowed, 29th in rushing TDs allowed,  and 27th in yards per attempt allowed.  Last year, the team finished  23rd in rush yards allowed, 29th in rushing TDs allowed, and 16th in yards per attempt. Neither Ngakoue nor Ramsey were here, so the deficiencies against the run weren't on them.  In 2017, with Ngakoue as the starter at RDE and Ramsey at CB, the team was 21st in rush yards allowed and 26th in average.  In 2018, with Ngakoue the starter at RDE and Ramsey at CB, the team was 19th in rush yards allowed and 14th in yards per attempt.  Certainly not the 1985 Bears or 200 Ravens, or even the 2004-1006 Jaguars, but respectable.  That shows me Ngakoue was not solely to blame for this team's struggle against the run.

Uh, no, I'd rather the Jaguars picked a complete DE and paid them accordingly. Nothing you say changes the fact this team made the right choice to pass on Yann for his asking price, because no other team in the NFL values him as he values himself. 

And those stats are nice, I think you forget who was inside in 2017, Yann was not relied upon then whatsoever on run downs, thanks to guys like Calais. If Yann was the lynch-pin to that 2017 defense he'd be the one making 20 mil a year somewhere, he's not. You wish he was more than he is, but he's just a good rushing DE. You move TJ Watt to any defense and he will be a stud worth every penny of his contract, same with guys like Mack or JJ Watt in their primes.... Complete players, something Yann isn't. Yann has a place in the NFL, but it's not as a 20+ mil a year guy. He turned down 16.5 a year here, and he lost a lot of $ for it. Tough luck, seems he hasn't learned from his mistakes either going by his recent interviews.

Well what you are doing is letting the quest for the perfect be the enemy of the good, and by extension, be the ally of the mediocre at best.  We've already seen in our team's entire history, we've drafted all of two good DEs, and Ngakoue is one of them. We've seen the defense overall and the pass rush fall off dramatically since we traded Ngakoue. As I've pointed out, it's hilarious you (plural) demand absolute perfection from Ngakoue but not a guy like Kirk, who is even more egregiously overpaid than you assert Ngakoue wanted to be.

No, I did not forget Calais Campbell played inside in 2017.  Unlike you, however, I also did not forget that Ngakoue still led the team in sacks as a rookie with 8 in 2016...before Campbell arrived in Jacksonville.  In 2016, when Ramsey and Ngakoue arrived, the defense became a top 5 unit...again before Calais Campbell.  Ngakoue also produced a team leading 10 sacks last year for the Raiders...again without Calais Campbell.  If there is a guy who has proven to be unable to generate much impact without others, it's Josh Allen.  He had the 10 sack rookie yer when Ngakoue and Campbell were still on the team in 2019, but nothing much since then.  But truthfully, it's silly to argue that players are going to be more productive when they have better players around them.  Naturally that's going to be the case.  It would be that way with Yan, and it will be that way with josh Allen.  To use that as a negative against Ngakoue ignores the realities of football-namely that it's a team game.  As for not learning their lessons...I'd say that description best suits the Jaguars, don't you think?  Ramsey and Yan were still productive players for respectable teams when they were traded.  Both were on playoff teams last year.  Ngakoue led the Raiders in sacks.  Ramsey made another Pro bowl, made the playoffs, and this year won the Super Bowl (even though he had a bad game).  The Jaguars, on the other hand, saw their defense drop dramatically after both players were traded.  They went from a team about 2 minutes from the Super Bowl with them in 2017, to a middle of the pack team in 2018, to having the worst record in football the last two seasons running without them.  Trashing Ngakoue doesn't make the Jaguars right, no matter how desperately we want them to be right in all they do.  The record clearly shows more often than not, they are far from right, especially at the DE position.  This is why we've had one winning/playoff season since 2008.  That's why the fans started with the clown emojis.

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