(02-21-2023, 03:21 PM)IKhan't Wrote:

(02-21-2023, 09:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: T-Wigg is cool. His podcast is usually good. He's worth following for sure. 

He's missing two things badly in this episode. He's stuck on paying a guy "more than he's worth" as if it is some important validation of his Josh Allen take. 

It's not.

NFL rosters are probably anywhere from 20-40% made up of guys being paid more than they are worth. 
Overpaying Allen could indeed be a problem, I'm not going to deny that. But he's too hung up on that notion.
Just bake in a team friendly out clause in the contract. Get out in 2 years if he doesn't produce. It's common language in many deals these days. 

Secondly - he doesn't really address the fact that there is no actual plan to replace Allen's productivity and the Jaguars very recently endured an 8 year drought of not being able to find a pass rusher at either edge or DE position. 

After a brief showing of decent pass rush from Paul Spicer and Bobby McCray - they waited EIGHT YEARS to find Yannick Ngakoue.   
Are we ready to kick Allen to the curb and risk that kind of ineptitude for years on end again? 

I also noticed at one point he seemed to assert that pressures/hurries from Allen didn't end up in incompletions when I can remember two such plays just from the week 18 and the LAC game. Both quite meaningful. 

Anyway - Gonna be interesting to see if Allen gets a deal and if he steps up - deal or no deal. 

Personally - I still 100% feel that with Williams and Campbell outside, you add a quality nickel and find some push up the middle front a 3 tech and Walker+Allen will have a jump in sacks numbers. The coverage buys them half of a tick longer to get home, and some push in the middle feeds them flushed quarterbacks a bit more often. 

That plan ^ feels like it will be easier than landing a double digit sack guy in the draft.

Why would Allen sign such a contract if some other team will offer him the same amount of money without a built in "out clause?"

This is a theme I see with a lot of people on this board and it's sad. Some of you are so used to being let down by this team that you are willing to settle for players that are not what we need. I don't blame you, I really don't. We've whiffed on so many players in drafts and free agency over the years that it does feel like we are cursed sometimes, but we have to get out of this loser's mentality. Just because we haven't drafted great players at key positions in the past, doesn't mean that it will never happen. We need to look at what we do have (a franchise QB and a shutdown CB,) and realize brighter days are coming and if we wanna take that next step, we can't be afraid to take some risks. Great teams have pass rushers who are able to consistently get to the opposing QB. The Eagles had 4 guys who racked up double digit sacks and the Chiefs have one of the most feared interior pass rushers in the NFL in Chris Jones. We currently have no one even close to any of the pass rushers who reached the Superbowl. We desperately need this type of player and it's time to stop settling and actively try to find a player like this. 

Personally, I am more than ready to take some risks and see what we can get on the open market for Allen in a trade. I'm tired of settling. It pains me, because I say this as someone who had very high hopes for Josh Allen when we drafted him. I was wrong about him though. Sometimes players don't pan out like you expect them to. It's now time to move on and try something different. Maybe it'll work. Maybe it won't, but we can't be afraid to try. We finally have a franchise QB, so our window for success is limited to as long as Trevor is with us. We cannot waste any time at all. 

So you think it'll be easier to find an interior pass rushing threat than it would to find a good edge rusher who can get double digit sacks? I gotta disagree. It's much easier to find a great edge rusher than an interior pass rusher, (not that either is particularly easy though.) Guys like Chris Jones, Quinnen Williams, Daron Payne and Javon Hargrave don't come along every day. Those guys are unicorns. There were 19 guys in the NFL who reached double digit sacks in the NFL last season and only 4 were interior pass rushers. I'm not super optimistic about finding a great 3 technique in this draft, that would be any better than what we have in Travon Walker, if we would just move him back to his natural 3 technique/5 technique position. We're really wasting time trying to turn him into something he isn't (3-4 OLB/4-3 DE), when we could really benefit from playing him where he belonged from the beginning (3 technique/5 technique.)

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(02-21-2023, 01:42 PM)NoShoes Wrote: If you get 18 for him. Would you take his cap savings to go get Daron Payne and draft Ojulari as his edge replacement?

I would do this in a nano second. 

I definitely wouldn't draft Ojulari as Allen's replacement. I have other edge rushers I like much better. If Isaiah Foskey would be on the board at #18, I'd be on him like a fly on crap.

Every single contract has an "out" in it. Be it the structure of cap vs dead cap, performance based, etc. You can simply load the cap hit of a deal to a year you have space and then be able to cut them another year with not much on the dead cap. The player gets the same amount of guarantees regardless of that structure so for them it doesn't matter.

Even Mahomes' contract has an "out" in it after 2024. They can cut him anytime in 2025 and beyond (well kind of, his guarantees kick in the year prior each year) and instantly save $40-50 million in cap space. Obviously they won't, but it's a good example that even the best of the best have outs for the club.

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