(02-21-2023, 03:21 PM)IKhan't Wrote:

(02-21-2023, 09:10 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: T-Wigg is cool. His podcast is usually good. He's worth following for sure. 

He's missing two things badly in this episode. He's stuck on paying a guy "more than he's worth" as if it is some important validation of his Josh Allen take. 

It's not.

NFL rosters are probably anywhere from 20-40% made up of guys being paid more than they are worth. 
Overpaying Allen could indeed be a problem, I'm not going to deny that. But he's too hung up on that notion.
Just bake in a team friendly out clause in the contract. Get out in 2 years if he doesn't produce. It's common language in many deals these days. 

Secondly - he doesn't really address the fact that there is no actual plan to replace Allen's productivity and the Jaguars very recently endured an 8 year drought of not being able to find a pass rusher at either edge or DE position. 

After a brief showing of decent pass rush from Paul Spicer and Bobby McCray - they waited EIGHT YEARS to find Yannick Ngakoue.   
Are we ready to kick Allen to the curb and risk that kind of ineptitude for years on end again? 

I also noticed at one point he seemed to assert that pressures/hurries from Allen didn't end up in incompletions when I can remember two such plays just from the week 18 and the LAC game. Both quite meaningful. 

Anyway - Gonna be interesting to see if Allen gets a deal and if he steps up - deal or no deal. 

Personally - I still 100% feel that with Williams and Campbell outside, you add a quality nickel and find some push up the middle front a 3 tech and Walker+Allen will have a jump in sacks numbers. The coverage buys them half of a tick longer to get home, and some push in the middle feeds them flushed quarterbacks a bit more often. 

That plan ^ feels like it will be easier than landing a double digit sack guy in the draft.

Why would Allen sign such a contract if some other team will offer him the same amount of money without a built in "out clause?"

This is a theme I see with a lot of people on this board and it's sad. Some of you are so used to being let down by this team that you are willing to settle for players that are not what we need. I don't blame you, I really don't. We've whiffed on so many players in drafts and free agency over the years that it does feel like we are cursed sometimes, but we have to get out of this loser's mentality. Just because we haven't drafted great players at key positions in the past, doesn't mean that it will never happen. We need to look at what we do have (a franchise QB and a shutdown CB,) and realize brighter days are coming and if we wanna take that next step, we can't be afraid to take some risks. Great teams have pass rushers who are able to consistently get to the opposing QB. The Eagles had 4 guys who racked up double digit sacks and the Chiefs have one of the most feared interior pass rushers in the NFL in Chris Jones. We currently have no one even close to any of the pass rushers who reached the Superbowl. We desperately need this type of player and it's time to stop settling and actively try to find a player like this. 

Personally, I am more than ready to take some risks and see what we can get on the open market for Allen in a trade. I'm tired of settling. It pains me, because I say this as someone who had very high hopes for Josh Allen when we drafted him. I was wrong about him though. Sometimes players don't pan out like you expect them to. It's now time to move on and try something different. Maybe it'll work. Maybe it won't, but we can't be afraid to try. We finally have a franchise QB, so our window for success is limited to as long as Trevor is with us. We cannot waste any time at all. 

So you think it'll be easier to find an interior pass rushing threat than it would to find a good edge rusher who can get double digit sacks? I gotta disagree. It's much easier to find a great edge rusher than an interior pass rusher, (not that either is particularly easy though.) Guys like Chris Jones, Quinnen Williams, Daron Payne and Javon Hargrave don't come along every day. Those guys are unicorns. There were 19 guys in the NFL who reached double digit sacks in the NFL last season and only 4 were interior pass rushers. I'm not super optimistic about finding a great 3 technique in this draft, that would be any better than what we have in Travon Walker, if we would just move him back to his natural 3 technique/5 technique position. We're really wasting time trying to turn him into something he isn't (3-4 OLB/4-3 DE), when we could really benefit from playing him where he belonged from the beginning (3 technique/5 technique.)

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The exact same reason Christian Kirk did.  Big money. If he believes he'll earn it - he'll take the deal 
It happens quite frequently these days. Kirk can be released after 2023 and he'll only walk with half of his $72 mil. and the Jags would have only 10 mil in dead money to deal with instead of paying another 37 mil. 

Do your next point  - I didn't say we needed a top 5 pass rushing DT. I said we need somebody that gets more push in the middle than what we are getting. Big difference. And yes, they are easier to find than double digit sack producers from the edge. 

I'm not going to get into any declarations of exactly what Travon Walker is or isn't after one season. 
Way too early to presume to know what the 22 year old is capable of just yet - and how they plan to use him in 2023 is also a mystery as of now. 

I'm not saying "don't draft an edge rusher." 
 I'm saying "don't piss away 8 sacks and 40 pressures a year until you have someone that can replace that." 

Adding a rookie edge is fine. And if they do that - they can just let Allen play out his fifth year option without a new deal. 
I just don't know that trading Allen is the kind of gamble I want to risk right now. 
Seems wholly unnecessary. Plenty of other avenues to improving the pass rush IMO.

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