(10-24-2023, 04:23 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote:

(10-24-2023, 03:24 PM)Caldrac Wrote: No. I have seen more on the ground damage than that. Including children with their heads blown off completely, a Dad carrying his infant child in pieces in a bag, a little boy saying goodbye to his brother and asking for a strand of his hair to remember him by, Christian churches leveled, etc. 

I have seen enough. Babies, not toddlers, babies, that cannot even speak nor walk yet, completely maimed or riddled with wounds or shaking like a combat veteran from the sheer amount of bombs and explosions going off in Gaza. 

It's pretty sadistic at this point. I know it's a long history of this happening on both sides. Everybody knows that any major religion at one point had it's day as top dog on the globe and went about it's business going after non conformists, etc. 

History is brutal. Mankind is brutal. The truth is usually brutal. I just can't take it anymore. Call me gutless or spineless. I don't really care. It's inhumane the way we're treating each other and how we're being asked to take sides in all of this. It's disgusting. Shameful and disgusting.

I don't watch any of that stuff. It breaks me. The reality is this is going on all over the world. We are fortunate to have largely evaded that type of brutality in this country. On the flip side, we are totally insulated from the role or government plays on these overseas affairs.

Imo, this battle needed to be fought a long time ago. You can not stop the fighting if you don't bring the enemy to heel, and that looks absolutely barbaric.

However, you have to ask the tough questions of why our government seems to perpetually enable war around the world. It's impossible to route the enemy so long as people make money from it. If they are not strictly regulated, it doesn't take long before they become the enemy. That's where we are now, but our moderates don't have the balls to hold them accountable.

Neither Israel nor Hamas has a vision for peace. Nothing the IDF does, short of annihilating all of the Palestinians or deporting them far away, will ever "bring them to heel".  Any future that includes Palestinians remaining in Palestine has to include Israel basically respecting their rights to their land and their livelihood, or else it will not be a peaceful future. And Israel is not prepared to do that. Not this generation.
Israel is not the only bad guy, of course.  Any other oppressed group would have made more of an effort to accommodate and assimilate, except the Palestinians have been paid to continue their struggle.  At first the Arab League paid them to struggle and fight but now it's basically just Iran and some wealthy fanatics all over the world.  
If an Iranian came here and started offering people money to commit violence, we would say, "go back to your country, man." At best.  We might throw him in jail.  That's my point.  We would view any person who took the money as a traitor to our people.
Until the Palestinians start feeling the same way about their so-called allies, until they start policing themselves, and telling each other, "let's not start more crap with the Israelis," they will never ever be "brought to heel.". Israel can't do that for them.  Neither can we.  They have to figure it out for themselves. 
But they'll never figure it out unless they're offered a chance at dignity and equality with the Jews.

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