Quote:Seems to be some quite interesting conversation here....

 

 

After spending the last two weeks in two Nordic countries I have to say that this was quite an eye opening experience, especially considering that I definitely tend to lean conservative on most issues.

 

Perhaps the biggest difference that I observed is that for the most part everything is clean, there simply are no bad looking "ghetto" areas, or at least very little and those few bad areas look nothing like some of the worst areas here in the U.S. I would definitely say that this was a check on the "pro's" of a socialist state. Income inequality is an issue here in the U.S. and no doubt it is a leading cause of crime and of the many shootings we have here. 

 

Consider the increase in land value because again there are not many ghetto neighborhoods bringing down the value of everyone else. 

 

 

My nephew is a very bright kid who is aspiring to be a doctor. Thing is, he does not need a voucher system, he does not need to win a "lottery" nor does he need to have wealthy parents in order to attend a good school because all of the schools in the country are not just very good, but best in the world. There are just as many trade schools as there are universities for those who do not want to become doctors. 

 

Another relative has a two year old son, his wife is now pregnant and their second child will be born next spring. They timed their children this way because she is able to stay on maternity leave until the child is 3 years old so it makes sense to have your children 3 years apart.

 

Obviously I understand that none of this is free, but I don't see anything wrong with taking care of your people and ensuring the success of our greatest asset, which is our children. As a society is it more beneficial for some billionaire to be able to purchase another yacht? Or give 1,000 children access to tools for success such as food, parents that actually have time for you, and a good education? I'd have to check "pro's" on all of these issues as well. Socialism can work, and this is evidence of it. Very low corruption and a largely homogenous population are definitely contributing factors, these do not exist here in the U.S.

 

Today, I had a lovely day in Miami. Hung out at Bayside, watched a few yacht's cruise by and admired the beautiful high risers, even saw a few Lambo's. Afterwards we drove from Bayside just a few miles west and goodness....you literally go from a beautiful affluent area to an area that almost makes me feel uncomfortable, something that resembles that of a third world country. Do you think that the children in these areas will get the same opportunities as those in Europe? Truthfully, it's almost a system of slavery because most of the people who live in these areas work minimum wage for those wealthy people just a few miles away. Off topic, but something that I found to be hilarious was a boat tour advertisement titled "Tour millionaire's houses". The thought of this is just insane. A Millionaire obviously owns this boat tour, so essentially the owner is being paid to have people come and tour his very own house, truly brilliant.

 

With all of this said I do have to point out that there are cons in the Nordic countries. Cost of living is higher largely in part due to higher taxes on everything. Alcohol is crazy expensive, a 24 pack of beer cost 60 Euros in a country where the only place to buy is at a government subsidized chain of liquor stores. Military is mandatory for men at age 18, I don't find this to be a bad thing, however. While driving in a 100 KM/Hour zone suddenly turns into an 80 zone followed by a radar camera, not even a kilometer later the speed limit goes back to 100....Basically a trap. This would never happen here in the states because the people have more power and simply would not allow it.  

 

Also, I believe we should always maintain the largest military in the world. When the [BAD WORD REMOVED] hits the fan, and eventually it will, these Nordic countries will cease to exist. There are countless other pros and cons that I can list but I suppose what I am saying is that it truly was eye opening to go from a country where everything is all about the money to a country that truly values it's people. 

 

Very interesting comments and you bring up several good points.

 

Regarding the part in bold, I just finished reading a very good book that gives some insight to that titled Gang Leader for a Day.  Talk about eye opening.  It's a true story of a Sociology student that enters the world of a gang and a neighborhood in one of Chicago's most notorious housing projects.

 

First of all, the lifestyle of some in that book is simply mind boggling.  It's not just the gangs, but the very people that live in the (then) projects where this takes place.  It's the underground economy and "enforcement" of the law that is truly amazing.  The book reveals not only corruption between law enforcement and the people there, but also corruption in all levels of government.  It really tells the story of how government at all levels is failing these people.

 

In my opinion, the problem isn't income inequality.  That's not what causes the major crime that we see.  The answer is fixing the broken system and holding people accountable.  Give these people a hand up not a handout.

 

When I see a socialist saying that he's going to tax everyone, not just the rich in order to give "free stuff" to everyone else, I shake my head.  That doesn't address the problem.

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