I would say first that "there's an argument" and it being his argument are different, and second that mock drafts are way different than big boards. 

I'm not going to research each one of those draftniks, but I would think most of this criticism has been within the last 3-4 weeks. I don't remember seeing anything negative on LW before then.

 

I remember last year, this happened with Khalil Mack. All of the sudden, he just wasn't "special" enough to be a top 5 pick according to many draftniks that I follow.

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I'm not going to research each one of those draftniks, but I would think most of this criticism has been within the last 3-4 weeks. I don't remember seeing anything negative on LW before then.


I remember last year, this happened with Khalil Mack. All of the sudden, he just wasn't "special" enough to be a top 5 pick according to many draftniks that I follow.

I'm not sure about the draftniks, but I do recall some criticism and concern about Williams being the pick dating back to December and January on this very board. I'll try to dig up one of the old threads.


Edit: here's one:

<a class="bbc_url" href='http://jungle.jaguars.com/index.php?/topic/9294-my-beef-with-leonard-williams/'>http://jungle.jaguars.com/index.php?/topic/9294-my-beef-with-leonard-williams/</a>

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"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."

I'm not sure about the draftniks, but I do recall some criticism and concern about Williams being the pick dating back to December and January on this very board. I'll try to dig up one of the old threads.


Edit: here's one:

<a class="bbc_url" href='http://jungle.jaguars.com/index.php?/topic/9294-my-beef-with-leonard-williams/'>http://jungle.jaguars.com/index.php?/topic/9294-my-beef-with-leonard-williams/</a>

He wasn't down on LW at all, I remember another thread that was down on LW but consider the source.

 

edit: sorry to hijack my own thread for discussion on LW, we can just agree to disagree

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He wasn't down on LW at all, I remember another thread that was down on LW but consider the source.


edit: sorry to hijack my own thread for discussion on LW, we can just agree to disagree

I was referring to the other posters in that thread not necessarily the OP.

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"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."

Again, first...no. Heck no. Sapp was the best pass rushing DT I may have ever seen. LW is underwhelming in that aspect.

 

Second, not nearly the same. Not fair to compare Dave drafting the replacement for a guy he inherited from the previous regime who was also on the final year of his contract, and a guy that Dave personally handed a very large FA deal just one month ago. 

I meant purely in looks in the face... sorry I shouldve been more clear.

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https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/20...-the-crop/

 

I think Amari Cooper WR Alabama will be the pick and liked the write up.

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I meant purely in looks in the face... sorry I shouldve been more clear.

Oh lol, I am terrible at facial comparisons (almost never see it when people are like "oh you have your dad's nose" or whatnot) so I'll take your word for that. 

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Odrick and LW are similar in physical attributes but the comparison ends there...


Do I really need to dig up the stats where LW basically doubled all of Odrick stats in 1 less.year while in college.

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Odrick and LW are similar in physical attributes but the comparison ends there...


Do I really need to dig up the stats where LW basically doubled all of Odrick stats in 1 less.year while in college.

You made the same mistake, while not quite on the same level, that you did comparing Beasley (since at least Odrick wasn't making a position switch like Vic). Williams played full time from game 1 of his career. Odrick played extremely sparingly as a freshman and was about a half time player as a sophomore.

 

In both cases the truth is 2.5 years of Odrick (and Beasley) vs 3 full years of Williams. To say that it was Williams that had a less of anything (except physical age) is a major disservice to the truth. 

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You made the same mistake, while not quite on the same level, that you did comparing Beasley (since at least Odrick wasn't making a position switch like Vic). Williams played full time from game 1 of his career. Odrick played extremely sparingly as a freshman and was about a half time player as a sophomore.


In both cases the truth is 2.5 years of Odrick (and Beasley) vs 3 full years of Williams. To say that it was Williams that had a less of anything (except physical age) is a major disservice to the truth.

So in half a year of extra starting Odrick stats would have been Williams?

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So in half a year of extra starting Odrick stats would have been Williams?

No, just pointing out one small example why simply using a game log page to try to construct an argument is full of errors. 

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No, just pointing out one small example why simply using a game log page to try to construct an argument is full of errors.

Kinda like continuing to compare Williams and Odrick as clones based on spider charts?

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Kinda like continuing to compare Williams and Odrick as clones based on spider charts?

Except I said that (and so did many others) the minute we signed Odrick...well before the spider charts were posted for this year. I even used the word funny that mockdraftable had them compared so closely, since it's normally obscure names on those comp lists. The comp was made through watching game play of the two of them, confirmed even more scarily similar physically by the spider chart. 

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Except I said that (and so did many others) the minute we signed Odrick...well before the spider charts were posted for this year. I even used the word funny that mockdraftable had them compared so closely, since it's normally obscure names on those comp lists. The comp was made through watching game play of the two of them, confirmed even more scarily similar physically by the spider chart. 

So how do these two clones put up such vastly different stats that can't be accounted for with the extra 1/2 year of starting?

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Here is their podcast on Vic Beasley. Not nearly as in depth as the LW one (6 minutes shorter), but still a very good listen. http://pffpodcast.podbean.com/e/cff-shor...bQ.twitter

 

I can do a little recap like Karnn wanted for the LW one.

-Best first step in the class. Robert Quinn level explosion.

-Worried about so many pure speed rushes once it's against NFL OTs, but...

-Only used an inside counter move 7 times last year, but turned 4 of them into sacks. "Didn't do it often, but he did it clinically" Showed he can, needs to try more consistently.

-Suggested he be on the Aldon Smith ~500-600 snap count as a rookie, but would be RoY level snaps if eased in properly. About 1,000 snaps is a full time player over 16 games.

-Is more complete against the run and than someone like Bruce Irvin, who has questions that he may never be a full time player.

-More net neutral against the run, but plenty good enough for NFL to carry him as a full time player quickly. 

-Beasley more productive with hand in dirt, but could also translate to any scheme.

-2nd most important position in the draft, should be targeted as high as #3 by Jacksonville after QBs go 1-2 (and even if they don't go 1-2). 

 

Both podcasts now PFF/CFF are convinced that QBs will/should go 1-2. 

These short podcasts are pretty good, haven't got to LW yet but I enjoyed this one. Only thing that concerns me with Beasley is they said he didn't generate pressures as much as other edge rushers did.

 

I would think the other edge rushers that graded better were from smaller schools.

 

I'm really interested to see what they say on some of the WRs and RBs that are projected to be 2nd or 3rd round picks.

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I'm really interested to see what they say on some of the WRs and RBs that are projected to be 2nd or 3rd round picks.

Me too, I will keep posting them on this thread as I see them. 

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So how do these two clones put up such vastly different stats that can't be accounted for with the extra 1/2 year of starting?

 

Read it on the twitter.

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"You do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud."

So how do these two clones put up such vastly different stats that can't be accounted for with the extra 1/2 year of starting?

 

the end.

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Coughlin when asked if winning will be a focus: "What the hell else is there? This is nice and dandy, but winning is what all this is about."

Listened to a podcast this morning on interior DLineman.

 

They have Danny Shelton as their top DT over LW. I've always thought as him as a 0T but he's actually more of a 3T. Kinda hard to project if he's actually better than LW because of age IMO. But nevertheless, he was more impressive on tape last year than LW.

 

They're also high on Henry Anderson, kind of a sleeper according to most draftniks, but very impressive on tape according to PFF. Also seemed to test well at the combine.

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Listened to a podcast this morning on interior DLineman.

 

They have Danny Shelton as their top DT over LW. I've always thought as him as a 0T but he's actually more of a 3T. Kinda hard to project if he's actually better than LW because of age IMO. But nevertheless, he was more impressive on tape last year than LW.

 

They're also high on Henry Anderson, kind of a sleeper according to most draftniks, but very impressive on tape according to PFF. Also seemed to test well at the combine.

I like Henry Anderson a lot. Him or Michael Bennett at 36 > LW at 3. Both are better pass rushers straight up to me, and play the run fine. Beasley and one of them at 36 would be dreamy. 

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