It will definitely take some time for real changes to occur, but when they do, NFL locker rooms will be more like normal workplaces.

It IS a normal workplace. It just happens to be a workplace full of testosterone fueled, post adolescent men.


Did the banter and jock play go to far? Definitely. Do I think this will cause all locker rooms to be monitored for this type of idiocy? NO!


It is a case of boys being boys, unfortunately none of the other boys stood up for the weakling. Some say this is a tough sport for tough men, but I think a little common sense and decency needs to be observed.


TBD

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You can't compare your own jobs with NFL locker rooms. Totally different enviornment.

Lol, you act like an NFL locker room should be way better than what he is talking about, when it is probably as bad or worse.

 

J.W. I think its safe to say you have zero experience with that kind of environment, or with one where guys were bashing on each other. Its a thing, it happens. Martins ongoing joke was being 'gay,' and clearly he was giving it to the other linemen too as evidenced by his texts. I know a certain amount of people will try and run with the report as 'evidence,' but how about you look at the actual evidence rather than Ted Well's 'conclusions.' His conclusions are not evidence, the texts contained are.

 

And they lead to no surprise that the Miami locker room pandered to the lowest common denominator and made all kinds of politically incorrect jokes. Do I think Martin liked get made fun of? NO, but do I really think it was truly 'malicious' and that he was treated differently than other linemen? No. In fact, Incognitos initial response to Martins check in at the Psych center was supportive and concerned.

 

I am not going to go into this much more cause the overwhelming desire to be PC all the time is strong with some on the board, but I will say that this bullying stuff, its arbitrary. Based on the evidence (not Ted Wells conclusion), it is clear that the Dolphins locker room was a place were derogatory jokes were made all the time. Some of you may find that unacceptable (and admittedly it is not how I would act), but don't pretend that Martin didn't participate, or that Incognito just wanted to hurt him.

 

And especially don't pretend like  guys bashing each other doesn't happen among many groups of men and isn't gloried in movies like 'The Hangover,' which is massively popular and mainstream. Our cultures hypocrisy is appalling sometimes. Its always funny till its not. This is what happens when you don't have a true moral code, and just fly on the wings of feelings.

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Yes, it's improvement, but it's Blaine Gabbert 2012 level improvement. - Pirkster

http://youtu.be/ouGM3NWpjxk The Home Hypnotist!

http://youtu.be/XQRFkn0Ly3A Media on the Brain Link!
 

Peyton must store oxygen in that forehead of his. No way I'd still be alive after all that choking.

 

Actually the sex joke was about Player A, who was later identified as Andrew McDonald. He was upset about being labeled a victim in the report.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000...s-player-a

 

My issue with the "guys being guys" claim is that sounds like they did nothing wrong, when it reality it was the classic definition of bullying and will cost people jobs.

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Actually the sex joke was about Player A, who was later identified as Andrew McDonald. He was upset about being labeled a victim in the report.

<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000326021/article/agent-andrew-mcdonald-is-wells-reports-player-a'>http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000326021/article/agent-andrew-mcdonald-is-wells-reports-player-a</a>


My issue with the "guys being guys" claim is that sounds like they did nothing wrong, when it reality it was the classic definition of bullying and will cost people jobs.

If it truly is a classic case of bullying, I think the proper course is not termination, but education.


The NFL spends a lot of time and money showing these young men how to plan for their futures after football. Maybe the league should spend some time and money showing them how to be men, not adolescent boys.

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If it truly is a classic case of bullying, I think the proper course is not termination, but education.


The NFL spends a lot of time and money showing these young men how to plan for their futures after football. Maybe the league should spend some time and money showing them how to be men, not adolescent boys.

 

Whether jobs should be lost or not, someone predicted Richie Incognito will be cut.

 

This scandal involved an assistant coach. If a player's position coach is a bully, how is he supposed to learn not to be a bully? That is why I think someone should fire Jim Turner.

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And that excuse has just about run its course.

You're too forgiving; that excuse ran it's course about 5 years ago.

 

If it truly is a classic case of bullying, I think the proper course is not termination, but education.


The NFL spends a lot of time and money showing these young men how to plan for their futures after football. Maybe the league should spend some time and money showing them how to be men, not adolescent boys.

Education is great for a coach who simply failed to address the situation, but if he participated himself, I think termination is the only course of action.

 

The NFL has all kinds of programs to help incoming players deal with fame, fortune, drugs, booze, women, etc..  For some it works.  Unfortunately, there are some who just aren't smart enough to learn.

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When you get into the endzone, act like you've been there before.

Lol, you act like an NFL locker room should be way better than what he is talking about, when it is probably as bad or worse.

 

J.W. I think its safe to say you have zero experience with that kind of environment, or with one where guys were bashing on each other. Its a thing, it happens. Martins ongoing joke was being 'gay,' and clearly he was giving it to the other linemen too as evidenced by his texts. I know a certain amount of people will try and run with the report as 'evidence,' but how about you look at the actual evidence rather than Ted Well's 'conclusions.' His conclusions are not evidence, the texts contained are.

 

And they lead to no surprise that the Miami locker room pandered to the lowest common denominator and made all kinds of politically incorrect jokes. Do I think Martin liked get made fun of? NO, but do I really think it was truly 'malicious' and that he was treated differently than other linemen? No. In fact, Incognitos initial response to Martins check in at the Psych center was supportive and concerned.

 

I am not going to go into this much more cause the overwhelming desire to be PC all the time is strong with some on the board, but I will say that this bullying stuff, its arbitrary. Based on the evidence (not Ted Wells conclusion), it is clear that the Dolphins locker room was a place were derogatory jokes were made all the time. Some of you may find that unacceptable (and admittedly it is not how I would act), but don't pretend that Martin didn't participate, or that Incognito just wanted to hurt him.

 

And especially don't pretend like  guys bashing each other doesn't happen among many groups of men and isn't gloried in movies like 'The Hangover,' which is massively popular and mainstream. Our cultures hypocrisy is appalling sometimes. Its always funny till its not. This is what happens when you don't have a true moral code, and just fly on the wings of feelings.

 

I'm very unclear as to what you're trying to say. "This is what happens when you don't have a true moral code". What? Whose moral code?

 

Are you saying what was going on was ok? Or are you saying it was bad but we shouldn't be surprised? I honestly can't tell.

 

I think it's clear that expectations of locker room behavior have been raised. It's actually going to be considered a professional workplace, with all that brings with it. Can you imagine true professionals like Manning or Brady putting up with this crap?

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The sun's not yellow, it's chicken.

 

Education is great for a coach who simply failed to address the situation, but if he participated himself, I think termination is the only course of action.

 

The NFL has all kinds of programs to help incoming players deal with fame, fortune, drugs, booze, women, etc..  For some it works.  Unfortunately, there are some who just aren't smart enough to learn.

 

NFL fans, owners, GMs, Coaches and teammates WANT players who are physically, emotionally and mentally intimidating, and to think otherwise is self-deception. No one wants the wimp, everyone wants the Big Nasty.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

NFL fans, owners, GMs, Coaches and teammates WANT players who are physically, emotionally and mentally intimidating, and to think otherwise is self-deception. No one wants the wimp, everyone wants the Big Nasty.

 

All of those people want millionaires to act like professionals because that is what they are. Miami's locker room was anything but that.

 

Roger Goodell has already started talking to players about the issue. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000...ace-issues

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NFL fans, owners, GMs, Coaches and teammates WANT players who are physically, emotionally and mentally intimidating, and to think otherwise is self-deception. No one wants the wimp, everyone wants the Big Nasty.

Assuming your theory  to be true, shouldn't the intimidation be over opponents rather than teammates?

 

Do Brady, Manning and Rodgers all have the Big Nasty?  Funny, I've never heard them described in such terms. How about Russell Wilson?

 

In-your-face intimidation = stupid 15 yard penalties............not the kind of players Caldwell is looking for.

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When you get into the endzone, act like you've been there before.

Assuming your theory to be true, shouldn't the intimidation be over opponents rather than teammates?


Do Brady, Manning and Rodgers all have the Big Nasty? Funny, I've never heard them described in such terms. How about Russell Wilson?


In-your-face intimidation = stupid 15 yard penalties............not the kind of players Caldwell is looking for.

So when taking about physical intimidation you go to the quarterback position? Yeah, all those guys had Big Nasty type players up front on their great teams. So did the Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Bears, and you don't think the Seahawks do? After all that garbage with Sherman a month ago? Great teams find it, nurture it, harness it, and turn it loose on the opponents.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

All of those people want millionaires to act like professionals because that is what they are. Miami's locker room was anything but that.


Roger Goodell has already started talking to players about the issue. <a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000326137/article/roger-goodell-players-met-to-discuss-workplace-issues'>http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000326137/article/roger-goodell-players-met-to-discuss-workplace-issues</a>

You should really read up on the history of professional sports. This behavior is nothing new and is ingrained in the sports psyche from grade school on.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

You should really read up on the history of professional sports. This behavior is nothing new and is ingrained in the sports psyche from grade school on.

 

What happened at Miami is not the typical guys being guys. It was classic bullying. Teasing, joking, pranks, and rookie hazing are normal. Not what Richie Incognito, John Jerry, and MIke Pouncey did.

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If we weren't in the doldrums...

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What happened at Miami is not the typical guys being guys. It was classic bullying. Teasing, joking, pranks, and rookie hazing are normal. Not what Richie Incognito, John Jerry, and MIke Pouncey did.

Yeah, cause guys never bully each other with slurs, cursing, slander, and physical abuse.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Yeah, because guys never bully each other with slurs, cursing, slander, and physical abuse.

 

Not all cursing and slander is bullying. Not all physical contact is abuse. What happened at Miami was not the same kind of behavior that is done everywhere else.

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Not all cursing and slander is bullying. Not all physical contact is abuse. What happened at Miami was not the same kind of behavior that is done everywhere else.

 

It happens at my job--sometimes worse--and no one cares. I'd guess that it's far more common in careers where it's mostly male-dominated and stressful. 

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I was pretty hard on Incognito, but I must admit I feel bad for him now.

 

One minute he is sending out love texts for Martin, now he is sending out bitter texts explaining how the truth will come to light.

 

This guy needs to take a year off from football.

 

Martin needs to figure out what he wants the next 5-10 years of his life.

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Whether someone has a liberal, or conservative viewpoint, a authoritative figure should not lock a thread for the sole purpose to get the last word in all the while prohibiting someone else from being able to respond.

Not all cursing and slander is bullying. Not all physical contact is abuse. What happened at Miami was not the same kind of behavior that is done everywhere else.

 

I know you stand resolutely by your opinions, but in my fairly common experience as a male, the stuff that goes on when guys are hanging out away from females would make you sick to your stomach. We fight. We insult. We injure. We aren't really all that civilized. And that's with our FRIENDS.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

All of the "locker room" stuff, I can wrap my head around. It's not that I condone it, but I understand that it occurs. What really bothers me about all of this is how Incognito pointed out that Martin was suicidal, as if that was somehow in his favor. The environment that Incognito participated in and helped to foster led to Martin having that depression.

 

I agree with the poster above who stated that Incognito really just needs to take a year off of football, get himself some counseling, and get his life in order.

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I'm trying to make myself more informed and less opinionated.

Stop saying whatever stupid thing you're talking about and pay attention to all the interesting things I have to say!