Why are we dropping our standards? The standard used to be to avoid even the pretense of corruption. This is why people should recuse themselves even if they feel like they can be fair. It's not because they are liars, but because other people need to know the system is fair. I would not be up in arms about this mess if Democrats simply defied odds. I mean, I don't doubt for a second I would be pointing out the implausibility of that situation, but that's not really the issue I'm addressing now.

Literally everything they do with regards to voting weakens our confidence in the integrity of the voting process. That is their POLICY. Voter ID? Nope. Signatures on ballots? Nope. Illegal immigrants? Sure. Underage voting. Let's do it. Extended voting. Early voting. Mail-in voting. Ballot harvesting. We can't open things up unless we are technologically securing ballots, and we can't do that if we can't make a system with checks and balances with regards to that technology.

Our system needs to be as pure as possible so that people can trust it. I feel like you guys constantly get the cause and effect wrong.

Republicans need to be the change they want to see before they start complaining about stuff.

A big problem in politics is that the public doesn't perceive a difference between the parties a lot of times, and the fact that republicans are only interested in what the other side is doing but never hold their own side accountable isn't helping that.

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Why are we dropping our standards? The standard used to be to avoid even the pretense of corruption. This is why people should recuse themselves even if they feel like they can be fair. It's not because they are liars, but because other people need to know the system is fair. I would not be up in arms about this mess if Democrats simply defied odds. I mean, I don't doubt for a second I would be pointing out the implausibility of that situation, but that's not really the issue I'm addressing now.

Literally everything they do with regards to voting weakens our confidence in the integrity of the voting process. That is their POLICY. Voter ID? Nope. Signatures on ballots? Nope. Illegal immigrants? Sure. Underage voting. Let's do it. Extended voting. Early voting. Mail-in voting. Ballot harvesting. We can't open things up unless we are technologically securing ballots, and we can't do that if we can't make a system with checks and balances with regards to that technology.

Our system needs to be as pure as possible so that people can trust it. I feel like you guys constantly get the cause and effect wrong.

I'm in favor of all those steps.  What I object to is losing candidates alleging cheating without having proof of it.  And even worse is a candidate pointing to a situation he created and saying it was evidence of cheating.  

And again, as I have already explained, there's nothing implausible about the situation in Arizona.  

And, thirdly, Secretaries of State have been running for other offices for 200 years.  All of a sudden, because your candidate lost to a sitting Secretary of State, who is running for a different office, it's unfair?

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Why are we dropping our standards? The standard used to be to avoid even the pretense of corruption. This is why people should recuse themselves even if they feel like they can be fair. It's not because they are liars, but because other people need to know the system is fair. I would not be up in arms about this mess if Democrats simply defied odds. I mean, I don't doubt for a second I would be pointing out the implausibility of that situation, but that's not really the issue I'm addressing now.

Literally everything they do with regards to voting weakens our confidence in the integrity of the voting process. That is their POLICY. Voter ID? Nope. Signatures on ballots? Nope. Illegal immigrants? Sure. Underage voting. Let's do it. Extended voting. Early voting. Mail-in voting. Ballot harvesting. We can't open things up unless we are technologically securing ballots, and we can't do that if we can't make a system with checks and balances with regards to that technology.

Our system needs to be as pure as possible so that people can trust it. I feel like you guys constantly get the cause and effect wrong.

Republicans need to be the change they want to see before they start complaining about stuff.

A big problem in politics is that the public doesn't perceive a difference between the parties a lot of times, and the fact that republicans are only interested in what the other side is doing but never hold their own side accountable isn't helping that.

Republicans need to be the change sure, but how do you change a system if you aren't the one in power because the broken system elected the party that isn't interested in fixing the system? This is a huge catch 22. Until the Dems lose close elections by the very system they have created, then there will be little interest in fixing it. Why secure a system against corruption and fraud when its working for you time after time? As others have said before in this forum, the Repubs need to work more on gaming and beating the system as it exists today.

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"Remember Red, Hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies."  - Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption

Republicans need to be the change they want to see before they start complaining about stuff.

A big problem in politics is that the public doesn't perceive a difference between the parties a lot of times, and the fact that republicans are only interested in what the other side is doing but never hold their own side accountable isn't helping that.

Republicans need to be the change sure, but how do you change a system if you aren't the one in power because the broken system elected the party that isn't interested in fixing the system?  This is a huge catch 22.  Until the Dems lose close elections by the very system they have created, then there will be little interest in fixing it.  Why secure a system against corruption and fraud when its working for you time after time?  As others have said before in this forum, the Repubs need to work more on gaming and beating the system as it exists today.

Republicans came into this election with control of more states, and the states I'm hearing the most complaining about are Republican controlled states.

A more productive way for the party to expend its efforts would be to figure out how to win over more voters rather than screaming about how above reproach they are and that it couldn't really just be that their policies aren't popular.

As I said in another thread, it's time for introspection and change for the republican party, not for more complaints about how unfair the world is.

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Republicans lost Maryland and Massachusetts. That's not shocking. GA is surprising, because, while Walker is a terrible candidate, you rarely see candidates down ticket do that badly. However, I'll concede that Republicans can't complain about GA unless they feel the corruption is coming from within their own party (which is how I personally feel). AZ, on the other hand, is a different story, because Republicans don't oversee elections there. People wanted to get their electoral process cleaned up and got more of the same. Whether or not there are shenanigans, the appearance of impropriety is off the charts for the second election in a row. Alaska is a wildcard because they are trying something new.

Look through this list:

https://www.politico.com/2022-election/r.../governor/

With the exception of MA and MD, there is almost an entire shift to the right. DEEP blue states shifted right, yet they lost seats? Normally that kind of turnout guarantees shifts in favor of the majority. It didn't manifest itself that way at all. I have a hard time believing that to be 100% coincidence.

Here's the thing. I know there has to be a burden of proof for someone to get convicted of something. I get it. I agree. However, when you watch a magician, you don't say I can't PROVE it's not magic, therefore it's magic. No, you acknowledge there's a slight of hand going on even if you don't get it. That's what I'm saying. I think there's sleight of hand going on which I believe to be coming in the combination of lax voter laws, illegal ballot harvesting, and an unwillingness by society to demand that we pull back the curtain. I want the last part to change, but that doesn't happen when we all just sit back and explain away why these processes aren't transparent, simple and accountable.

No amount of introspection is going to overcome the brokenness in the current system. Look around, dude. It's not the establishment types that are complaining. So, asking the Mitch McConnells and Lindey Grahams to become introspective isn't going to amount to much change. They are rich and powerful and in no risk of losing their status as long as they play the game.

So, you're not going to get the establishment to be introspective. I have no doubts that certain political elites are being introspective about how to advance their career after this election, but how does that help us? That only helps if they feel beholden to us, and they don't. It just so happens that the majority of people from outside of the system are trying to come in through the Republican party, and these are the people getting chewed up and spit out. It's happening on the left, too. Remember Bernie? Or Marianne WIlliamson?

Personally, I want "we the people" to become more introspective and start trying to reduce the power wielded by the elites. So, when you say Republicans need to be more introspective and you're talking about the base, you may as well be saying "Hey slaves in the early 19th century, maybe you need to really start being introspective about how you got here. Hey Jews in the 3rd Reich, maybe you should start reflecting on how you ended up in these camps." Yes, that's hyperbolic. It's not meant to be a good faith argument.

Hyperbole aside, it's how I feel about the establishment pooling its power to make the elites richer. I wish I found more allies here.

I never thought I'd see the day the democratic base be the champions for the system, but hey... they control the narrative now and they have the power. Nothing to see here, please move along.

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Is rather be an educated ronster than an uneducated drive by poster that can't use his brain to be critical of anything but other people. This is the only way the left makes ground. They convince people like you demagogue people instead of confronting ideas, and the demagoguery becomes the goal instead of the issue itself. 

There isn't a complaint from someone on the left with regards to policy that i can't understand the sentiment behind it, but you don't even bother yourself with that type of empathy. Your only sense of superiority comes from being part of the ingroup. It's pedantic, uncritical, and uninformed.

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You know... there isn't a single person on this board that wouldn't feel cheated if they were in the exact same position as Kari Lake. If you can't look at that situation and recognize that something is seriously broken, that speaks to your own cognitive bias or ability. Yet, not enough people are willing to speak out about it, because they are afraid of being called an election denier. It's all rhetoric. People like you are just a tool to keep them in line. Great job, tool.

Man. Lots of words when you could have just said “I’m better and smarter than everyone. Bow down to me peasents!”

You called people out for no reason at all and then call them a tool?

Tough keyboard guy huh? Take a break big boy because you’re looking a little desperate for attention.

It’s ok to say you’re wrong at times.  But if this is an “argument”, you’re missing the mark.  Your post just screams “my side won and you have to deal with it, no matter how we got there”.

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Man. Lots of words when you could have just said “I’m better and smarter than everyone. Bow down to me peasents!”

You called people out for no reason at all and then call them a tool?

Tough keyboard guy huh? Take a break big boy because you’re looking a little desperate for attention.

It’s ok to say you’re wrong at times.  But if this is an “argument”, you’re missing the mark.  Your post just screams “my side won and you have to deal with it, no matter how we got there”.

I’m not arguing with anyone because I don’t have a side.

Politics are the worst because it brings out the worst in people (as evidence by numerous posts in this forum).

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It’s ok to say you’re wrong at times.  But if this is an “argument”, you’re missing the mark.  Your post just screams “my side won and you have to deal with it, no matter how we got there”.

I’m not arguing with anyone because I don’t have a side.

Politics is the worst because it brings out the worst in people (as evidence by numerous posts in this forum).

I won’t argue with that. I also agree to it as well.  At least to this specific post.  +1

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I’m not arguing with anyone because I don’t have a side.

Politics is the worst because it brings out the worst in people (as evidence by numerous posts in this forum).

I won’t argue with that. I also agree to it as well.  At least to this specific post.  +1

I come to this message board to talk about the Jags because I live in Maryland and believe it or not, not many Jags fans here!

Every once in a while, I venture over to this chess pool and see something I don’t like and I make a post.

I’ll leave for another few weeks until something else perks my interests, post and then move on again. Classic drive by guy.

BORTLES

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I won’t argue with that. I also agree to it as well.  At least to this specific post.  +1

I come to this message board to talk about the Jags because I live in Maryland and believe it or not, not many Jags fans here!

Every once in a while, I venture over to this chess pool and see something I don’t like and I make a post.

I’ll leave for another few weeks until something else perks my interests, post and then move on again. Classic drive by guy.

BORTLES

I do the same.  Nothing wrong in that.  We can always agree to disagree.  The Jags are our common ground.  Just don’t forget we’re “Xbox” friends and I have your full first and last name, lol.  J/k. And probably can get the ip.

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I come to this message board to talk about the Jags because I live in Maryland and believe it or not, not many Jags fans here!

Every once in a while, I venture over to this chess pool and see something I don’t like and I make a post.

I’ll leave for another few weeks until something else perks my interests, post and then move on again. Classic drive by guy.

BORTLES

I do the same.  Nothing wrong in that.  We can always agree to disagree.  The Jags are our common ground.  Just don’t forget we’re “Xbox” friends and I have your full first and last name, lol.  J/k. And probably can get the ip.

Stop! Are we really?! That’s hilarious if true

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I do the same.  Nothing wrong in that.  We can always agree to disagree.  The Jags are our common ground.  Just don’t forget we’re “Xbox” friends and I have your full first and last name, lol.  J/k. And probably can get the ip.

Stop! Are we really?! That’s hilarious if true

I wouldn’t lie about something so serious. Haha
It’s true.

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You 2 should build a bunk bed and do karate in the garage lolol

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Not gonna lie, I miss my bunk bed as a kid. You down for this cleatus?

(Damn I had to type that 5 times before it quit trying to change it to “clitoris”)

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Not gonna lie, I miss my bunk bed as a kid. You down for this cleatus?

(Damn I had to type that 5 times before it quit trying to change it to “clitoris”)

Message board infected with dirty AI.

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"Remember Red, Hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies."  - Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption

Not gonna lie, I miss my bunk bed as a kid.  You down for this cleatus?

(Damn I had to type that 5 times before it quit trying to change it to “clitoris”)

Message board infected with dirty AI.

That’s probably what makes me keep coming back.  She’s a dirty lil thang! Mmm

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Not gonna lie, I miss my bunk bed as a kid.  You down for this cleatus?

(Damn I had to type that 5 times before it quit trying to change it to “clitoris”)

Fun fact. My first day of college, my professor pulled me to the side and said “is this a joke?”

I said “I don’t know what you mean”

“You wrote [BLEEP] on your note card for your name”

“Ummm. Sorry but that’s an F not a T. My name is Clif”

*dead silence between the 2 of us*

“Well next time make the F a little more clear”

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Not gonna lie, I miss my bunk bed as a kid.  You down for this cleatus?

(Damn I had to type that 5 times before it quit trying to change it to “clitoris”)

Fun fact. My first day of college, my professor pulled me to the side and said “is this a joke?”

I said “I don’t know what you mean”

“You wrote [BLEEP] on your note card for your name”

“Ummm. Sorry but that’s an F not a T. My name is Clif”

*dead silence between the 2 of us*

“Well next time make the F a little more clear”

Hahah, That’s awesome.

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And let me be clear. I am not a fan of Kari Lake. I think she's the wrong kind of candidate. I am tired of people overlooking the obvious because they are afraid of being labeled something.

Please elaborate.

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Trump did this.

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