All I know is, I better not lose my free adult sites. 

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I'm personally against it, but is it all that much different from Google hiding results, Facebook hiding groups, Verizon throttling Netflix and Youtube (2014), and the numerous other times companies hid information or controlled what you saw?

The problem with the supply and demand argument is that many internet providers have contracts with the cities and counties they sell to. These contracts often limit the opposition. If Comcast chose to throttle, I wouldn't be able to switch to another company unless I wanted sub 5mbps internet. Do away with these contracts, and I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it.

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I'm personally against it, but is it all that much different from Google hiding results, Facebook hiding groups, Verizon throttling Netflix and Youtube (2014), and the numerous other times companies hid information or controlled what you saw?

The problem with the supply and demand argument is that many internet providers have contracts with the cities and counties they sell to. These contracts often limit the opposition. If Comcast chose to throttle, I wouldn't be able to switch to another company unless I wanted sub 5mbps internet. Do away with these contracts, and I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it.

Verizon throttling Netflix and YouTube was partly why Net Neutrality was brought in the first place though right?

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Please people. Supply and demand will always dictate these things. Just like when there was only one telephone company. I remember when long distance costed like ten cents per minute within the US because AT&T could do it. There were no other options. Once cellular service came about, all the sudden telephone bills plummeted.

This is much ado about nothing.

The law of supply and demand goes out the window when government-endorsed monopolies are in play. That's the problem here. If I had as many choices of ISP as I do grocery store, they were all competing for my dollar and I could go to any one I choose, the need for net neutrality would not exist. Because governments hand out monopolies to a single carrier, that carrier has no incentive to price itself competitively. In fact, it has every incentive to do exactly the opposite and get every penny it can out of its customers, because they have nowhere else to go.

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Okay so it's been established that roughly 80% of the continental US has an effective monopoly when it comes to ISPs. That's the problem with repealing net neutrality. The fact that Ajit Pai is a pathological liar who used to be Verizon's Lawyer, that admitted to being bought out, is the sole person trying to push this through should open some eyes. Let's not ignore the millions of FAKE comments that were supplied as support to repeal this bill. All of this stinks, anyone who would support this repeal is just thinking "Muh Free Market!!!" Without putting much thought into the implications. The internet was founded on Net Neutrality Principles but ISPs started to get cheeky as technology advanced. Which led to repeated fines from the FCC until it was established that the FCC didnt have the authority to keep them in check. Enter 2015 Net Neutrality bill classifying ISPs under title 2 granting FCC authority to supervise them. Check out the laundry list of infractions that led to Net Neutrality having to be passed in the first place. A little preview of hijinx to come if this goes through.


-2004

Verizon disables bluetooth competition

-2005

Madison River Blocks Vonage

Verizon prevents customers from downloading ringtones off the internet

-2007

AT&T Prevents skype from working on Iphones

Comcast throttles p2p

Verizon disables other GPS products

-2008

COX and RCN throttle P2P

-2009

AT&T Prevents Google voice app from appearing in app store

Verizon disable FM radio chips

-2010

Windstream routes searches through it's own engine secretly

-2011

Metro PCS blocks all streaming video except for youtube

AT&T, Sprint, Verizon all prevented Google wallet from working

AT&T throttles speed on unlimited data plans

2012

Verizon blocks free tethering apps

AT&T charges extra for facetime

Verizon and AT&T put super cookies on phones(tracking ALL user data)

Comcast hides FCC mandated package from consumers(in compliance with a buyout)

-2013

Comcast engages in zero rating with Xfinity video

Verizon admits to wanting paid fast lanes in court

Verizon prevents Asus Nexus 7 from working

AT&T and Verizon devise payment plans that double charge consumers

Verizon blocks free caller blocking program

-2014

Verizon disables all FM tuner apps

Verizon prevented SIM cards from working if bought from 3rd party vendors

Verizon prevents 'Pay with Paypal' from working

-2015

TMobile throttles speed on unlimited data plans

Verizon blocks customers from getting SIM cards for Nexus 6

Verizon Lies on their website about Iphones

-2016

AT&T investigated for zero rating

Verizon prevents customers from using Whitepages caller ID

Verizon Zero rates its video platform Go90

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I'd be interested to see the arguments for how this is good for the consumer

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I'd be interested to see the arguments for how this is good for the consumer

If it's good for corporations, it's good for the consumer.

Am I getting this right, Trickle Downers?

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

I'd be interested to see the arguments for how this is good for the consumer

If it's good for corporations, it's good for the consumer.

Am I getting this right, Trickle Downers?

lol, I'll never understand how anyone in the general public could be for this. 

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DF says this was the standard before 2015 when the FCC made it official. I'm assuming there were indicators or actions by ISPs to spur the FCC's actions when they enacted NN. I honestly don't know enough about the issue to hold a definitive viewpoint. However, I do know that the Chicken Littles, who typically hyperbolize everything they disagree with, have latched onto this issue and are now predicting a dystopian future. That, in itself, makes me skeptical. I'm in a 'wait and see' mode to observe if the shrillness is justified.

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I'm not saying the idea of net neutrality is bad but I question if the FCC oversight is helpful or harmful towards the goal of a free and open internet. I don't see the incentive for ISP to purposefully slow their servers. If they did it to increase charges for better access that is already the norm, there's always tiered packages with better speeds based on payment. I don't believe the hyperbole they'd set up a payment for specific access program there's nothing indicating that would be a profitable venture.

The real problem is state sponsored monopolies. If you really want a free and open internet eliminate local governments ability to auction exclusive isp contracts based on geography.

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DF says this was the standard before 2015 when the FCC made it official. I'm assuming there were indicators or actions by ISPs to spur the FCC's actions when they enacted NN. I honestly don't know enough about the issue to hold a definitive viewpoint. However, I do know that the Chicken Littles, who typically hyperbolize everything they disagree with, have latched onto this issue and are now predicting a dystopian future. That, in itself, makes me skeptical. I'm in a 'wait and see' mode to observe if the shrillness is justified.

Move along, nothing to see here.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

DF says this was the standard before 2015 when the FCC made it official. I'm assuming there were indicators or actions by ISPs to spur the FCC's actions when they enacted NN. I honestly don't know enough about the issue to hold a definitive viewpoint. However, I do know that the Chicken Littles, who typically hyperbolize everything they disagree with, have latched onto this issue and are now predicting a dystopian future. That, in itself, makes me skeptical. I'm in a 'wait and see' mode to observe if the shrillness is justified.

Move along, nothing to see here.

Perhaps not. We shall see.

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The real problem is state sponsored monopolies. If you really want a free and open internet eliminate local governments ability to auction exclusive isp contracts based on geography.

Bingo. Eliminate geographic monopolies, enact and enforce one-touch make ready laws that allow the Googles of the world to change wiring on AT&T poles without waiting for AT&T to send their own crew out (they never will), and let supply and demand shape the market.

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I'm not saying the idea of net neutrality is bad but I question if the FCC oversight is helpful or harmful towards the goal of a free and open internet. I don't see the incentive for ISP to purposefully slow their servers. If they did it to increase charges for better access that is already the norm, there's always tiered packages with better speeds based on payment. I don't believe the hyperbole they'd set up a payment for specific access program there's nothing indicating that would be a profitable venture.

The real problem is state sponsored monopolies. If you really want a free and open internet eliminate local governments ability to auction exclusive isp contracts based on geography.

The is every incentive to slow services, which is exactly what Verizon did with netflix which was one of the precursors to the whole 2015  Net Neutrality rules.  When people are talking about tiered packages the different speeds arent what they mean.  When verizon did it, it didnt matter if you were paying for 100mbs of speed, they would slow your access to netflix to unwatchable speeds as a way to strong arm netflix into coughing up a check.

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I'm personally against it, but is it all that much different from Google hiding results, Facebook hiding groups, Verizon throttling Netflix and Youtube (2014), and the numerous other times companies hid information or controlled what you saw?

The problem with the supply and demand argument is that many internet providers have contracts with the cities and counties they sell to. These contracts often limit the opposition. If Comcast chose to throttle, I wouldn't be able to switch to another company unless I wanted sub 5mbps internet. Do away with these contracts, and I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it.

Verizon throttling Netflix and YouTube was partly why Net Neutrality was brought in the first place though right?

Maybe. 

Like homebiscuit said, I'm probably not as well-versed in all of this stuff. 

I just don't trust these companies that are pretending to look out for our best interest.

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Verizon throttling Netflix and YouTube was partly why Net Neutrality was brought in the first place though right?

Maybe. 

Like homebiscuit said, I'm probably not as well-versed in all of this stuff. 

I just don't trust these companies that are pretending to look out for our best interest.

Is there anymore hated industry than telecom? I know I just live to call up and deal with Comcast, Verizon, or DirecTV. 

But they’ve got our backs I’m sure.

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Verizon throttling Netflix and YouTube was partly why Net Neutrality was brought in the first place though right?

Maybe. 

Like homebiscuit said, I'm probably not as well-versed in all of this stuff. 

I just don't trust these companies that are pretending to look out for our best interest.

 I get that, but o one hand you have what seemed to be every site on the internet big and small saying rally against this repeal, and on the other hand you have 4 companies who are effective monopolies in most regions, paying millions lobbying for the repeal.

Does netflix, amazon, google, duvalpride or whoever else care about your best interest?  More than likely not, but what they do care is having as many eyes on their sites as possible, using their services, and clearly they believe killing net neutrality will effect how many people will use or have proper access to their services.

The big four service providers didnt dump millions into lobbying so they can create competition against themselves.

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Net Neutrality = Government can't regulate internet
No Net Neutrality = Government can regulate internet

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Liberals hate this because it promotes freedom. The left loves to be told what to do.

Hey hoss, I don't know if you ran to the stadium to recite the Pledge of Allegiance and got lost on the way home or something, but I'm still waiting for you to explain to me how the concept of net neutrality runs counter to freedom. You still out there? O say, I can't see you.

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Why would it benefit an ISP to provide crappy service to their customers? Netflix reached an agreement with the major ISPs outside of government interference anyways. Do you really want the government to have more control on your internet... you want your internet at the speed of government? The reason we have had faster internet in the USA than Europe is that we've had a pretty loose regulatory environment. 

The sad and unfortunate part of life in 2017 is this bold part. The answer to this question is overwhelmingly yes, for a growing number of people. Damn the facts, or the economics, or the simple fact we are supposed to be a "free" country. Governments can only gain anything by taking from others, they have no money, or goods, or create anything. Yet we are one of the highest regulated and taxed markets in the world, and have become heavily reliant on government as a society. 

NN is only about 2 years in, to think this is some doomsday for the internet is a little naive. Most companies, including ISPs, want happy customers. The ones who don't, or can't satisfy customers enough, usually go under or get bought by more successful companies. Unless of course you're "too big to fail", then you get theft(sorry, tax) dollars and get bailed out to "save the economy". Then you get $15 trillion dollars of debt over the last 2 administrations, taxed and printed into existence, with hundreds of trillions in unfunded liabilities our government has already promised that they have no way to pay for. But, the majority of citizens ignore that for whatever reason. Just provide more government, regulations, taxes and more spending. I think getting government OUT of more and more things, is the way to go.

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