Do not legislate morality.

 

Agreed that's why you can't have government telling one group of people you have to pay for this groups birth control. We are all each responsible for ourselves in the end.

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it cost the tax payers way more money to deal with obesity in America. Why don't we just make food that's causing the obesity illegal. Take Bacon, Burgers, Fried Foods take those options away. Fat People are going to eat, we have to prevent them from eating bad food!

If people are having unwanted babies don't you think that also puts a burden on society? Either way, we are paying for it one way or another.

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If we have to pay for someone's birth control, we should have say in what they do if they become pregnant. Eric made a great point. You can't tell me to stay out of it and then make me responsible for making sure it doesn't happen. Your second argument isn't relevant since that isn't the conversation we're having here. I think many people would be OK with funding birth control if it meant forbidding abortions.



Why should we want to? We're paying for, what feels like, too much as it is... I WANT to pay for solutions to world hunger, but that isn't practical. I WANT to pay for solutions to cancer, but that isn't practical. I WANT to pay for solutions to <INSERT PROBLEM HERE>, but that isn't practical... so I wont. I want to fix a lot of things, but simply paying a little bit more wouldn't fix any of it. We pay enough as it is so why aren't the problems fixed?




This is where we disagree.


You're putting the responsibility on the tax-payer / insured to pay for those that are causing the problem. I don't completely agree with the libertarian point-of-view, but I believe the idea that it isn't their problem will factor in here. We shouldn't place the onus the taxer-payer. If we stop making it so appealing to be on government assistance, then we'd stop having people trying to stay on it. I work in the ghetto, and I enter too many homes on government assistance (daily). You can't believe how many people have told me that they wont apply for a job because their benefits haven't ended, or that that they "need another baby, so [they] can" afford to move out of their home and into a nicer one. That's a problem, and many people think those are the outliers when, from my experiences, have been the average.


The libertarian doesn't want you to take money out of their pockets, so I don't know how you can make that argument.

But you are missing the reality of it. We are paying either way. As a society we are paying a ton for unwanted pregnancies.

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But you are missing the reality of it. We are paying either way. As a society we are paying a ton for unwanted pregnancies.

 

Yes, we are paying with increased crime, more prisons, more police, more courts, more welfare, and on and on. 

 

Providing free birth control seems like such a no-brainer to me, I don't understand why people resist the idea.  I guess they prefer a slew of unwed mothers, fatherless babies, teenage criminals who have no father, and loads of welfare payments. 

 

In addition to that, if a person thinks abortion is murder, wouldn't decreasing unwanted pregnancies lead to a decrease in abortions?

 

The only reason I can think why people resist this idea is religion.  It sure isn't logic.   But we can't discuss religion, so that's that. 

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Yes, we are paying with increased crime, more prisons, more police, more courts, more welfare, and on and on. 

 

Providing free birth control seems like such a no-brainer to me, I don't understand why people resist the idea.  I guess they prefer a slew of unwed mothers, fatherless babies, teenage criminals who have no father, and loads of welfare payments. 

 

In addition to that, if a person thinks abortion is murder, wouldn't decreasing unwanted pregnancies lead to a decrease in abortions?

 

The only reason I can think why people resist this idea is religion.  It sure isn't logic.   But we can't discuss religion, so that's that. 

 

You do realize that we give birth control away by the ton now and we still have all those problems, right?

 

That in addition to preventative birth control we also permit abortion and we STILL have those problems, right?

 

Birth control isn't the issue, the culture is. And saying that taxpayers should foot the bill to prevent births of potential criminals is placing the blame and responsibility in the wrong place. If we'd actually blame the right people, those who actually do the deeds, instead of rewarding them,  then we'd be on the road to correcting this.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

But you are missing the reality of it. We are paying either way. As a society we are paying a ton for unwanted pregnancies.

 

 

Yes, we are paying with increased crime, more prisons, more police, more courts, more welfare, and on and on. 

 

Providing free birth control seems like such a no-brainer to me, I don't understand why people resist the idea.  I guess they prefer a slew of unwed mothers, fatherless babies, teenage criminals who have no father, and loads of welfare payments. 

 

In addition to that, if a person thinks abortion is murder, wouldn't decreasing unwanted pregnancies lead to a decrease in abortions?

 

The only reason I can think why people resist this idea is religion.  It sure isn't logic.   But we can't discuss religion, so that's that. 

 

I understand your point, and I think it's a valid argument, but I don't agree with it. I believe that if you take away the incentive, that the problem is more likely to go away. Since I think the incentive is the problem, I don't believe I should have to fund the alternative when taking away the benefits would be easier and cheaper.

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In other news, Hobby Lobby will not offer insurance coverage for IUDs and morning after pills, but will allow coverage of Viagra and vasectomies.

 

Is this what you're calling hypocritical? Hobby Lobby believes that the former kills a living child, the latter doesn't. While it may seem a strange set of priorities to you, to them it is a consistent position.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Actually the morning after pill is not actually an abortion in a pill.  The morning after pill is emergency contraception.  They work before pregnancy begins.  And in fact won't work if you're already pregnant.

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I was wrong about Trent Baalke. 

Is this what you're calling hypocritical? Hobby Lobby believes that the former kills a living child, the latter doesn't. While it may seem a strange set of priorities to you, to them it is a consistent position.

 

IUDs and the morning after pill kill a living child? Please do tell me how that works. 

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On Wisconsin.

IUDs and the morning after pill kill a living child? Please do tell me how that works.

I don't think he was saying that's his belief just pointing out that's hobby lobby's belief.

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Is this what you're calling hypocritical? Hobby Lobby believes that the former kills a living child, the latter doesn't. While it may seem a strange set of priorities to you, to them it is a consistent position.

 

It's consistent to them, hypocritical to me. Why is it so hard to separate those two?

 

They have no problem giving men the chance to have sex without worrying about pregnancy, yet they want to control a woman's ability to do the same.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley