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flgatorsandjags · 11-19-2016, 11:19 PM

Quote:Pass Rusher > Oline in importance

Pass Rusher = Oline in need

this pass rushing class > this oline class

top 5 > 20s

picking top 5 > having an extra 3rd and 5th

this is really easy

i agree with everything other than pass rusher>oline importance but you have to draft value. There is no olineman worth a top 3 pick. My choice is to trade down but not if we dont get a good bit of picks that would be equal value to where we pick. The best value for olineman in this draft is rounds 2-4 anyway. I would love to build a dominant defense at the same time we improve our oline

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 12:55 AM

Quote:Im arguing a need that also happens to be a more important position no matter what the need is, and judging by what general media is saying (which to be fair could be wrong) is probably the better player.

Everyone said last year that the top 5 and the late round were the same too and again it didnt turn out like that.

It's your opinion that D-Line is more of a need. It's NOT fact. As for which players are better, none of us truly know until we see these guys play in the NFL.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 01:00 AM

Quote:Pass Rusher > Oline in importance

Pass Rusher = Oline in need

this pass rushing class > this oline class

top 5 > 20s

picking top 5 > having an extra 3rd and 5th

this is really easy

Again, the bolded part is your opinion. It's NOT a fact. All of what you said is your opinion. Stop acting like it's a fact. We all have differing opinions on this board. I happen to think Yannick Ngakoue still has a pretty bright future ahead of him, so the cupboard isn't totally empty at pass rusher.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 01:02 AM

Quote:Statistically the chances of the player panning out decreases with each passing pick. In order for me to assume that risk I need to be well compensated. I'm sorry if I don't jump at the first offer another team suggest. If he values the player he's targeting enough, and I would assume he does considering how far he's willing to trade up, he should be willing to pay the price for making such a move.

Look at what other teams have gotten in terms of compensation from moving 20+ spots down the board from a top pick. The thing is the team that moves down the board usually ends up with the short end of the stick compared to the player they could have gotten. So in order to hedge my bets and adjust to the larger risk that pick 25ish won't pan out, you better load me up with 2nd, 3rd, 4th round picks for this year and a possible 1st and 2nd next year.

I didn't say I would jump on the first offer, obviously I would use the full amount of time on the clock, I only used the 1st, 3rd and 5th if it was the only offer we got. In all likelihood, we'd get much more.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 01:06 AM

Quote:I'd look at adding a FA like Ronald Leary or better if someone is a cap casualty and possibly a right tackle as well.

Spend the 1st on a Garrett, Allen or Barnett. Then see who's available later on the O-Line. Might even consider trading back up into the 1st

Get a couple of big nasty maulers with a mean streak and stop running a finesse scheme

I'm not a fan of Leary. The interior offensive line position drops off sharply after the first 4 to 5 guys, so I would be hesitant to wait until round 2 or later. We need multiple starters on the O-line as well as much needed depth that we sorely lack.

I do agree with changing the running scheme. What we've been doing, isn't working.

KYjaggy · 11-20-2016, 01:11 AM

Our pass rush needs an influx far more than our oline does. A franchise QB could function behind what we have at oline right now just fine.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 01:27 AM

Quote:Our pass rush needs an influx far more than our oline does. A franchise QB could function behind what we have at oline right now just fine.

What about the run game? Rushers certainly can't function behind the current O-Line and they haven't been able to for years. What good is having a one dimensional offense? That's why we're in our current situation.

wg171 · 11-20-2016, 01:53 AM

Quote:I'm not a fan of Leary. The interior offensive line position drops off sharply after the first 4 to 5 guys, so I would be hesitant to wait until round 2 or later. We need multiple starters on the O-line as well as much needed depth that we sorely lack.

I do agree with changing the running scheme. What we've been doing, isn't working.

Out of curiosity what would your starting offensive and defensive lines look like in 2017?

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 02:07 AM

Quote:Out of curiosity what would your starting offensive and defensive lines look like in 2017?

I have no idea. It depends on whose available when we draft.

KYjaggy · 11-20-2016, 04:19 AM

Quote:What about the run game? Rushers certainly can't function behind the current O-Line and they haven't been able to for years. What good is having a one dimensional offense? That's why we're in our current situation.

We are averaging a 15th best 4.3 yards per rush right now. The line is just all around average, which is good enough with a true franchise QB.

Other than Blake the only thing that is truly subpar on this team is the pass rush.

knarnn · 11-20-2016, 04:27 AM

Quote:I didn't say I would jump on the first offer, obviously I would use the full amount of time on the clock, I only used the 1st, 3rd and 5th if it was the only offer we got. In all likelihood, we'd get much more.

But if we didn't you'd be perfectly fine getting fleeced?

"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."

GlockBortles · 11-20-2016, 07:16 AM

Quote:What about the run game? Rushers certainly can't function behind the current O-Line and they haven't been able to for years. What good is having a one dimensional offense? That's why we're in our current situation.

Thats true but isnt enough of a reason to put it over the pass rushand surely not enough to take a bad trade just for a guard.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 09:04 AM

Quote:Thats true but isnt enough of a reason to put it over the pass rushand surely not enough to take a bad trade just for a guard.

I think it is enough of a reason. I believe the lack of a run game is what is holding us back. We are ranked 26th in rushing offense, but we are ranked 7th in total defense. In my opinion, that's more than good enough reason to put defense on the back burner for now. We have two first year pass rushers starting right now. It took Vic Beasley a while to get going and now he's among the league leaders in sacks with 9.5. You guys are too impatient.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 09:12 AM

Quote:But if we didn't you'd be perfectly fine getting fleeced?

I'd get what I want to build this team, so I don't consider it a fleecing. It may not be ideal, but I'm still able to get more picks in the range I want.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 09:14 AM

Quote:We are averaging a 15th best 4.3 yards per rush right now. The line is just all around average, which is good enough with a true franchise QB.

Other than Blake the only thing that is truly subpar on this team is the pass rush.

We are ranked 7th in total defense, so the pass rush can't be holding us back that much. As for the rushing average, that's only part of the story. As the game goes on and the backs get more carries, the average dips way down. We start out fine, hit a wall and abandon the run. We need consistency.

GlockBortles · 11-20-2016, 10:07 AM

Quote:I think it is enough of a reason. I believe the lack of a run game is what is holding us back. We are ranked 26th in rushing offense, but we are ranked 7th in total defense. In my opinion, that's more than good enough reason to put defense on the back burner for now. We have two first year pass rushers starting right now. It took Vic Beasley a while to get going and now he's among the league leaders in sacks with 9.5. You guys are too impatient.

neither of our pass rushers have the upside vic does.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 12:56 PM

Quote:neither of our pass rushers have the upside vic does.

In your opinion. People were calling Beasley a complete bust last year and even very early this season. Some guys just take some time to get used to the NFL.

GlockBortles · 11-20-2016, 03:30 PM

Quote:In your opinion. People were calling Beasley a complete bust last year and even very early this season. Some guys just take some time to get used to the NFL.

But beasley is a vastly superior athlete to both our pass rushers, so his floor was already higher than both of them. Thats not an opinion.

And only stupid people called him a bust lol.

JagsFanJay · 11-20-2016, 04:14 PM

Quote:But beasley is a vastly superior athlete to both our pass rushers, so his floor was already higher than both of them. Thats not an opinion.

And only stupid people called him a bust lol.

You really need to look in the dictionary and look up the word "opinion". What you say about Beasley is definitely your opinion and not a fact.

GlockBortles · 11-20-2016, 04:23 PM

Quote:You really need to look in the dictionary and look up the word "opinion". What you say about Beasley is definitely your opinion and not a fact.

Beasley being a better athlete than Fowler and Yannick isnt an opinion. Its just what the numbers say.

Vic - <a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/4905/'>http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/4905/</a>

Yannick - <a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/7372/'>http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/7372/</a>

Fowler - <a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/4914/'>http://www.mockdraftable.com/player/4914/</a>