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JagJohn
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(03-13-2020, 09:35 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: (03-13-2020, 08:25 AM)JagJohn Wrote: From TDN today:
DERRICK BROWN, DL, AUBURN
NFL comparison: D.J. Reader
It’s weird for a best-case comparison like this to be construed as a negative, but here we are. D.J. Reader, a massively underrated nose tackle who is about to cash in on the open market, is arguably the top run-stuffer in the league. He’s able to push the pocket and get to the quarterback. He’s also a more impactful pass-rusher than the majority of 0-techniques.
However, he’s still a nose tackle and one that simply doesn’t impact the game much because of the position he plays. It’s fairly easy to find defenders who can routinely clog the middle, even if a rare few can do it as well as Reader. Derrick Brown, despite his completely dominant film, is the same way. After displaying average athleticism at the combine, I don’t see the type of elite pass-rush upside he needs to warrant a high draft selection, which makes him a reach as a top-10 pick. Anywhere outside of that range continues to be tremendous value for Brown, but his price tag is something teams must be very cautious about.
The person that wrote this clearly hasn't witnessed the dynamic we Jags fan painfully endured when Marcell Dareus was lost to injury.
If you can't stop the run, you're screwed. You will not consistently stop the run without a quality nose tackle. (especially if your linebackers are sub par or banged up)
Also - I don't think Brown's combine showing is definitive of his upside as a pass rusher. He may not be Aaron Donald in the middle vs the pass, but he can be plenty disruptive.
The argument, at least as I see it, is not about whether we need a good run-stuffing DT. We clearly do. The argument is whether using a top 10 pick to get one is the best use of our resources. I'm not so sure about that.
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JackCity
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03-13-2020, 12:31 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-13-2020, 12:32 PM by JackCity.)
The way I see it is it's absolutely fair to question how good Brown will be as a pass rusher at the next level. Will he ever be Fletcher Cox? No, I doubt it.
However I'd say it's more likely than not he's a high level run stopper, above average pass rusher + his ability to take double teams and push the pocket will open up sacks and pressures for everyone else. So I'd still be happy with him at #9.
With Kinlaw it's clear he's very athletic and has the same build as some of the best interior disruptors (Chris jones, Buckner), his issue is more so his snap to snap consistency was nowhere near Browns , but unlike brown, he doesn't need to walk through a lineman to get to the QB, he's too long and athletic.
So I think it's quite likely if both of the players hit that Kinlaw will he the better pass rusher, however I think it's more likely Brown is better than Kinlaw and that Kinlaw takes a while to get going. honest.
I'm not gonna complain about either at #9 to be honest
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NYC4jags
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(03-13-2020, 11:30 AM)JagJohn Wrote: (03-13-2020, 09:35 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: The person that wrote this clearly hasn't witnessed the dynamic we Jags fan painfully endured when Marcell Dareus was lost to injury.
If you can't stop the run, you're screwed. You will not consistently stop the run without a quality nose tackle. (especially if your linebackers are sub par or banged up)
Also - I don't think Brown's combine showing is definitive of his upside as a pass rusher. He may not be Aaron Donald in the middle vs the pass, but he can be plenty disruptive.
The argument, at least as I see it, is not about whether we need a good run-stuffing DT. We clearly do. The argument is whether using a top 10 pick to get one is the best use of our resources. I'm not so sure about that.
That wasn't the argument I was addressing at all. I was specifically and directly refuting a statement from the writer at draft network.
I do think there may be better value available at #9 than just selecting one of the top 2 defensive tackles there.
Personally, I'd look to sign a mid-tier NT in free agency to further the flexibility of strategy in the draft. You can still draft a nose tackle, you just won't have the same urgency about it.
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jaglou53
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(03-15-2020, 10:11 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: (03-13-2020, 11:30 AM)JagJohn Wrote: The argument, at least as I see it, is not about whether we need a good run-stuffing DT. We clearly do. The argument is whether using a top 10 pick to get one is the best use of our resources. I'm not so sure about that.
That wasn't the argument I was addressing at all. I was specifically and directly refuting a statement from the writer at draft network.
I do think there may be better value available at #9 than just selecting one of the top 2 defensive tackles there.
Personally, I'd look to sign a mid-tier NT in free agency to further the flexibility of strategy in the draft. You can still draft a nose tackle, you just won't have the same urgency about it.
My preference would be Michael Pierce. He's great against the run and won't cost a fortune. As you said, the Jags would no longer have the urgency to take a defensive tackle with their first pick. It would then be a no-brainer if Okudah or Simmons were on the board at that point. If that is not the case, they could take whichever defensive tackle is on the board, an offensive tackle (Wirfs/Thomas/Wills) or trade back if the offer is good enough. There are so many needs on this team that it would even be difficult for Caldwell to mess it up.
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