Some of you have a very distorted view of what would happen to unwanted children who would be born if abortion was banned. Very, very few would be brought into the world and lead a good life with their biological parents. People who don't want children aren't gonna miraculously change their mind and treat their kids like a child that is actually wanted. Others just say put them up for adoption, like that would fix the problem. I've been reading some stats and they aren't pretty. More than 60% of the children in foster care spend 2-5 years in the system. That number gets exponentially larger for disabled and minority children. 20% spend over 5 years in the system and over 17,000 kids a year exit foster care without ever being adopted. On any given day, there are over 125,000 kids in foster care. The majority of which can never return to their biological families. In 2020 the government spent over $5 billion on foster care.

We also see story after story of the abuse cases of unwanted children and children in foster care. It's a never ending cycle, because there aren't enough case workers in America. It's a thankless job that pays next to nothing, you see horrendous things and workers are overloaded to completely unreal amounts of case loads. If abortion is made illegal again, the numbers of abused and murdered children will skyrocket and the foster care system will become even more broken than it is now. Which I didn't know was possible. You will see more deaths from back alley abortions, more children murdered, more children abused and more children abandoned. That's simply a fact. IMO, it's selfish to force children into such existences. Sure, a small percentage will go onto be adopted and live good lives, but given how many children are already in bad situations, adding to that amount just seems cruel.

I know some of you say abortion is murder, but the fact is, not everyone sees this as a reality. This country is completed divided over when a person actually becomes a person. That is never gonna change. You'll never convince some people to agree with you no matter how right everyone believes they are. It's just pushing your belief system onto other people and I'm completely against that. That is something the Taliban would do. They are inflicting their beliefs on everyone in Afghanistan and I think we can all agree that this is a bad thing. Why is it ok to inflict your beliefs on people in this situation and not in that one? As I said, not everyone views when a person becomes a person, in the same way. It's an individual belief, but some people want to force others into abiding by their beliefs by banning abortion.

No one likes abortion. I wish it wasn't necessary, but you will NEVER force people into being responsible, no matter how much you try to make them. That is just a fact. By forcing them to carry the children, only the kids will suffer. Many will be born to parents that see them as a burden and they will either be treated poorly by their biological parents/parent, will be abandoned by a parent, murdered by a parent or will be placed into an already broken system, that can't handle the amount of children that are already there. I just don't understand how these are good options? To me, it's a necessary evil. People are given free will. In that, some people will make good decisions and others will make many poor life choices. That's just how life is. When you have free will, you must take the good with the bad.

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These are all better arguments than my body, my choice. When I get a few seconds, I'll roll up my sleeves and try to present some counterpoints.

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Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

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Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

Good grief man. It’s a message board. You have no clue who some of these people are in real life.

In fact, I know you don’t like me but you actually liked a Tik Tok I made….. you just didn’t know it was me hahaha

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Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

That's not an argument or a counterpoint. That's just a mean-spirited opinion. It doesn't really do anything to advance this discussion. You're not helping.

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Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

That's not an argument or a counterpoint. That's just a mean-spirited opinion. It doesn't really do anything to advance this discussion. You're not helping.

No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

That's not an argument or a counterpoint. That's just a mean-spirited opinion. It doesn't really do anything to advance this discussion. You're not helping.

Why does it matter to offer a one sided opinion? This topic has been argued before RvW was even written. There's pro's for abortion, there's cons as well, there will never be a happy medium. Never..  And I don't find it mean spirited at all. What I'm saying is, I'm not standing in anyone's way. 

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink. This is a damned if you do, damned if you don't topic. You know that and I know that. If you or anyone else is looking for me to say, "oh please don't abort that baby, oh please don't", it's not gonna happen anymore. Go for it.. You'll have that debt to deal with later on in life, not me..

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When I was a brash 19 year old, with a fast car, and a real fast love for life, I took the advice of the Eagles and lived life in the fast lane. I had a 16 year old Girlfriend. We just really started dating at the time and she was my 1st real girlfriend. We were young, and when you're that age you tend to take risk that others with more experience tend to avoid. Anyway, I ended up getting her pregnant, (She was my 1st experience) and we panicked. We ended up getting her Aunt to tell her parents about the pregnancy while we took a nice ling cruise in my car to think before we returned to face the music. Yeah, we were scared at the time and really didn't know what to do. TO our surprise, we sat down with her Mother and had a nice rational talk about things and we all knew that me and her were way too young to be parents. Hell, she hasn't even finished High School yet, and being a 16 year old mother would have been a real hardship on her and me too. It came down to the fact that she and her mother decided to have an abortion. Deep down, I knew it was the right thing to do. My feelings about it at the time, well, I never really thought about it until I was faced with it. I know that a persons attitudes and positions can change and evolve over time depending on external, and internal factors. As for myself, I'm against abortion except in the most extreme cases such as rape, incest, and the likes. But that's just my personal opinion. Abortion is a very personal choice that can affect people on many levels, and even though I'm against it, I feel it must be up to the parties involved to make the right choice for them depending on the circumstances. We have enough information and resources today that abortion should be a rare, with education and the involvement of parents, teachers, clergy and others, I feel it can be, but until such time, it's just an unfortunate reality that we must live with as a society. We can't make choices for others, but we can be involved with offering others all the options that are available to them such as adoption. One other point I'd like to make is, I feel that the government. on any level, has too much power today over our personal lives. It shouldn't be up to anyone in government to make personal choices for anyone about anything.

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Like I said in another thread.. Go ahead and kill your baby. I just got tired of arguing about it. If you're that deranged to actually do that, you don't deserve to be a parent anyway.

There's a few on this board who I wish their mother's had it done as well..

Go for it.. You have my blessing whether you need it or not..

Good grief man. It’s a message board. You have no clue who some of these people are in real life.

In fact, I know you don’t like me but you actually liked a Tik Tok I made….. you just didn’t know it was me hahaha

Yeah, I take that back, you just pissed me off.. it's not that I just don't like you, you're just annoying sometimes..

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There are multiple people on here that probably share Drifters story, minus the Trans AM and mullet

Panicked teenagers don't think as clearly as adults ready to have children.

This topic has a lot of similarities to the old true saying If You Are Not a Liberal at 25, You Have No Heart. If You Are Not a Conservative at 35 You Have No Brain

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Good grief man. It’s a message board. You have no clue who some of these people are in real life.

In fact, I know you don’t like me but you actually liked a Tik Tok I made….. you just didn’t know it was me hahaha

Yeah, I take that back, you just pissed me off.. it's not that I just don't like you, you're just annoying sometimes..

I feel the same way. Facts can be annoying sometimes.

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That's not an argument or a counterpoint. That's just a mean-spirited opinion. It doesn't really do anything to advance this discussion. You're not helping.

No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

A man can use birth control as well (condoms), it's not just the responsibility of the woman. It's a two way street. Both the man and the woman are responsible for unwanted pregnancies.

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When I was a brash 19 year old, with a fast car, and a real fast love for life, I took the advice of the Eagles and lived life in the fast lane. I had a 16 year old Girlfriend. We just really started dating at the time and she was my 1st real girlfriend. We were young, and when you're that age you tend to take risk that others with more experience tend to avoid. Anyway, I ended up getting her pregnant, (She was my 1st experience) and we panicked. We ended up getting her Aunt to tell her parents about the pregnancy while we took a nice ling cruise in my car to think before we returned to face the music. Yeah, we were scared at the time and really didn't know what to do. TO our surprise, we sat down with her Mother and had a nice rational talk about things and we all knew that me and her were way too young to be parents. Hell, she hasn't even finished High School yet, and being a 16 year old mother would have been a real hardship on her and me too. It came down to the fact that she and her mother decided to have an abortion. Deep down, I knew it was the right thing to do. My feelings about it at the time, well, I never really thought about it until I was faced with it. I know that a persons attitudes and positions can change and evolve over time depending on external, and internal factors. As for myself, I'm against abortion except in the most extreme cases such as rape, incest, and the likes. But that's just my personal opinion. Abortion is a very personal choice that can affect people on many levels, and even though I'm against it, I feel it must be up to the parties involved to make the right choice for them depending on the circumstances. We have enough information and resources today that abortion should be a rare, with education and the involvement of parents, teachers, clergy and others, I feel it can be, but until such time, it's just an unfortunate reality that we must live with as a society. We can't make choices for others, but we can be involved with offering others all the options that are available to them such as adoption. One other point I'd like to make is, I feel that the government. on any level, has too much power today over our personal lives. It shouldn't be up to anyone in government to make personal choices for anyone about anything.

Very well said.

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Yeah, I take that back, you just pissed me off.. it's not that I just don't like you, you're just annoying sometimes..

I feel the same way. Facts can be annoying sometimes.

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No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

A man can use birth control as well (condoms), it's not just the responsibility of the woman. It's a two way street. Both the man and the woman are responsible for unwanted pregnancies.

The only safe sex for unaltered people is no sex. My point still stands that only the man is forced to carry an unwanted child to adulthood; the woman gets the choice.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Yeah, I take that back, you just pissed me off.. it's not that I just don't like you, you're just annoying sometimes..

I feel the same way. Facts can be annoying sometimes.

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No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

A man can use birth control as well (condoms), it's not just the responsibility of the woman. It's a two way street. Both the man and the woman are responsible for unwanted pregnancies.

Someone has never been a [BLEEP] 16 year old at a party.

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That's not an argument or a counterpoint. That's just a mean-spirited opinion. It doesn't really do anything to advance this discussion. You're not helping.

No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

Ya, why not ask the baby what they think? "the, woman in her sole discretion". That line always rubbed me raw. The "woman" didn't get pregnant all by herself. Seems to me she involved the man in the decision making the moment she allowed him to enter her without protection. 

My ex killed my baby when I was a young man. That wench actually got mad at me for not going to the clinic with her. I felt so helpless, 28 years later, I am still raw that I was not given a choice. SHE KILLED MY KID..

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"If you always do what you've always done, You'll always get what you always got"

I feel the same way. Facts can be annoying sometimes.

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A man can use birth control as well (condoms), it's not just the responsibility of the woman. It's a two way street. Both the man and the woman are responsible for unwanted pregnancies.

The only safe sex for unaltered people is no sex. My point still stands that only the man is forced to carry an unwanted child to adulthood; the woman gets the choice.

I've seen plenty of men who have "disappeared" after finding out their girlfriend has gotten pregnant with their child. It's a very common practice. You can't get child support if you can't find where the father disappeared to.

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I feel the same way. Facts can be annoying sometimes.

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A man can use birth control as well (condoms), it's not just the responsibility of the woman. It's a two way street. Both the man and the woman are responsible for unwanted pregnancies.

Someone has never been a [BLEEP] 16 year old at a party.

All I'm saying is that you can't put 100% of the blame on the woman. Getting pregnant requires a man and a woman. Both are 50% to blame for unwanted pregnancies. No matter the age or how drunk/high they were.

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No one is required to help.

Unless the woman, in her sole discretion, decides to keep the baby. Then the man is required to help for at least 18 years.

Ya, why not ask the baby what they think? "the, woman in her sole discretion". That line always rubbed me raw. The "woman" didn't get pregnant all by herself. Seems to me she involved the man in the decision making the moment she allowed him to enter her without protection. 

My ex killed my baby when I was a young man. That wench actually got mad at me for not going to the clinic with her. I felt so helpless, 28 years later, I am still raw that I was not given a choice. SHE KILLED MY KID..

It's very much a one way street.  The woman has sole authority to make a decision that can force the man into an 18+ year financial obligation.

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When you get into the endzone, act like you've been there before.

I'm surprised that some of y'all are pro-choice.
Why would you vote Republican if you think it should be left to a woman and a doctor with no government interference?

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

I'm surprised that some of y'all are pro-choice. 
Why would you vote Republican if you think it should be left to a woman and a doctor with no government interference?

Our tax dollars fund the biggest abuser of abortions. There is no such thing as no government interference.

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Ya, why not ask the baby what they think? "the, woman in her sole discretion". That line always rubbed me raw. The "woman" didn't get pregnant all by herself. Seems to me she involved the man in the decision making the moment she allowed him to enter her without protection. 

My ex killed my baby when I was a young man. That wench actually got mad at me for not going to the clinic with her. I felt so helpless, 28 years later, I am still raw that I was not given a choice. SHE KILLED MY KID..

It's very much a one way street.  The woman has sole authority to make a decision that can force the man into an 18+ year financial obligation.

No, that's not true anymore. Courts have gotten really good at collecting child support. And its sort of the ol, should have thought of that before you spread your legs kind of thing.

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"If you always do what you've always done, You'll always get what you always got"