This is about 6 year old children, they won't suggest it but they are eminently suggestable to it. That's why parents have to be notified if their kid asks or makes comments about it. How dreadful for the groomers and their allies that must be.

You're correct about 6-year-old children.
But the law is about K-12.
The law is pretty well tailored for high school age as well, but there is a misconception both sides have, and you seem to share it.
Unlike 6 year olds, 15 year olds will commonly suggest things about their own sexuality and gender identity. The misconception is that everything that a student might do that could indicate they are anything other than straight must be reported to parents.  That is not what the law says.  The law says that any change in services must be reported to the parents.  If the student is getting a new name or a new bathroom, tell the parents.  If the student is getting appointments with the guidance counselor, tell the parents.  If the guidance counselor is changing therapies, tell the parents.  These changes in services might have nothing to do with gender or sexuality.  The law does not intend to out students and in nearly all cases would not out any students as long as teachers respectfully hedge their personal conversations with students. Which they should be doing anyways.

Wrong again.

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

You're correct about 6-year-old children.
But the law is about K-12.
The law is pretty well tailored for high school age as well, but there is a misconception both sides have, and you seem to share it.
Unlike 6 year olds, 15 year olds will commonly suggest things about their own sexuality and gender identity. The misconception is that everything that a student might do that could indicate they are anything other than straight must be reported to parents.  That is not what the law says.  The law says that any change in services must be reported to the parents.  If the student is getting a new name or a new bathroom, tell the parents.  If the student is getting appointments with the guidance counselor, tell the parents.  If the guidance counselor is changing therapies, tell the parents.  These changes in services might have nothing to do with gender or sexuality.  The law does not intend to out students and in nearly all cases would not out any students as long as teachers respectfully hedge their personal conversations with students. Which they should be doing anyways.

Terrific, again you show why this law is great and much needed in our schools.

I never said the law was bad.
I said the way the law is being presented to the people, both by people who are for it and by people who oppose it, is bad.
The Governor is provoking people to oppose the bill who would probably be for it if it were explained a different way.
Many of these people work for Disney.
Bob Chapek now feels an obligation to try to change the bill, even though he probably doesn't understand it, and neither do his employees.  This didn't have to happen.  DeSantis and his team could have explained things more diplomatically.
Now that Chapek is an enemy, DeSantis is trying to make RCID devolve back to Orange County.  

Only the last part of the story is on topic.

The topic is, Tucker Carlson says that RCID devolving means Disney pays more taxes.
OC tax collector says RCID devolving means Disney pays no taxes to itself, and pays the same taxes to the County and State, but, RCID's assets (which need to be maintained) and debts (which need to be serviced) all go to the county with zero increase in revenue.

One of the two is lying.
As an Orange County home owner, I'd really like o know which one!

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

I’m waiting to hear him tell us what’s wrong with the financial literacy class requirement DeSantis signed into effect.

---

What in the Wide Wide World of Sports is agoin' on here???

I’m waiting to hear him tell us what’s wrong with the financial literacy class requirement DeSantis signed into effect.

Absolutely nothing.  That class was long long overdue.

---

You're correct about 6-year-old children.
But the law is about K-12.

Wrong again.

You're wrong (again).  The law has various provisions and every grade from K to 12 is affected.  All instruction regarding gender identity now has to be age and developmentally appropriate starting in grade 4 and going to grade 12.

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Good. What's wrong with that, man? And, again, just because you don't know something, doesn't make it any less real. There are many teachers in this country ACTIVELY recruiting kids to be allies and share in their lifestyle choices. It's not the majority. It's a small fraction, but even that can cause real harm. The time to stop it is now, and you impede this progress by not opening your eyes and acknowledging this for what it is.

---

Good. What's wrong with that, man? And, again, just because you don't know something, doesn't make it any less real. There are many teachers in this country ACTIVELY recruiting kids to be allies and share in their lifestyle choices. It's not the majority. It's a small fraction, but even that can cause real harm. The time to stop it is now, and you impede this progress by not opening your eyes and acknowledging this for what it is.

I already explained multiple times in this thread what my complaint is.

Just because you don't read it, doesn't make it any less real. Just because you think it's about groomers, doesn't mean it's wise for the governor to say it's about groomers. One of the fundamental duties of a public official is to speak in a unifying way, not a divisive one.

The parliamentarian of the Florida house or the Florida Senate would have ruled DeSantis out of order if he called his opponents groomers during a debate for that bill. You may not think it's important to say things the right way, but some of us still do. They do. And I think they know more than either of us about this topic.

But bottom line, use all the divisive rhetoric you want, but, I start to care when it directly affects my county budget and tax bill.

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Lol, the bill is targeting people who are GROOMING children. If a bill was targeting corporations who were abusing the working class, and a large contingent of people came out against it, not because there was anything wrong with the bill, but because corporate interests were influencing the counter-narrative, you could say those people were supporting corporations, right?

Do you see how I use logic to defend my points? Do you see how you use rhetoric?

You know what's funny about you? You don't think about the origins of ANYTHING. You just repeat talking points, man. How many times have conservatives been called racist, fascist, homophobic, xenophobic, bigots, NAZI's, Hitler by their opponents? It happens so frequently it's a [BLEEP] meme. None of those are ideals in the conservative party, nor is there any basis for that in the philosophy that supports conservatism, but they get labeled as such on the regular. They get deplatformed. They get physically assaulted. There is a very, very small group of actual NAZI's that might lean right when it's convenient, but they are COMPLETELY disavowed by conservatives, yet the left demagogues the whole party on the regular.

On the contrary, here you have a small fraction of progressives that ARE grooming children, their philosophy openly encourages this type of behavior, and their party openly embraces them and attacks those who call them out. If you don't want Democrats to be demagogued as groomers, maybe they should stop actively supporting this group. At the very least, maybe you could be less of a hypocrite with how you apply your standards to the respective parties.

The critical LGBTQ+ wing of the progressive movement are part of a coalition that is ushering in real fascism, but you are too ignorant to see it for what it is. And while all progressives aren't groomers, they largely share the same goal, which is the overthrow of traditional American structures. You have a family? That's great and all, but the progressive movement wants to tear that down. They envision a future where there is no nuclear family. Your job? Your house? Your independence? Your faith? Now your gender? Lol. The critical progressive movement wants it all destroyed. This sounds absurd, but it's in the literature, man. Hell, just listen to what they are saying.

Critical theory has gained control over the Democratic narrative over the last 12 years. Democratic elites and financial backers predominantly share this view. China will only donate to universities who have these types of programs, even though they don't allow this in their own country. Why? Do they just really want America to thrive? Lol. Hate to break it to you, but you are tacitly supporting this destructive trash by not contributing to the shut down of their perverse ideals, and you have the audacity to be offended that Democrats are being associated with them. You're the one that's uninformed, not me.

Your leaders need to be rejecting this for the good of America, and you need to be rejecting the leaders that are allowing this movement to grow. Period. There is no greater threat to America. Until then, I don't really care if they are called groomers or not. It's not rhetoric. It's inevitable.

---

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Lol, the bill is targeting people who are GROOMING children. If a bill was targeting corporations who were abusing the working class, and a large contingent of people came out against it, not because there was anything wrong with the bill, but because corporate interests were influencing the counter-narrative, you could say those people were supporting corporations, right?

Do you see how I use logic to defend my points? Do you see how you use rhetoric?

You know what's funny about you? You don't think about the origins of ANYTHING. You just repeat talking points, man. How many times have conservatives been called racist, fascist, homophobic, xenophobic, bigots, NAZI's, Hitler by their opponents? It happens so frequently it's a [BLEEP] meme. None of those are ideals in the conservative party, nor is there any basis for that in the philosophy that supports conservatism, but they get labeled as such on the regular. They get deplatformed. They get physically assaulted. There is a very, very small group of actual NAZI's that might lean right when it's convenient, but they are COMPLETELY disavowed by conservatives, yet the left demagogues the whole party on the regular.

On the contrary, here you have a small fraction of progressives that ARE grooming children, their philosophy openly encourages this type of behavior, and their party openly embraces them and attacks those who call them out. If you don't want Democrats to be demagogued as groomers, maybe they should stop actively supporting this group. At the very least, maybe you could be less of a hypocrite with how you apply your standards to the respective parties.

The critical LGBTQ+ wing of the progressive movement are part of a coalition that is ushering in real fascism, but you are too ignorant to see it for what it is. And while all progressives aren't groomers, they largely share the same goal, which is the overthrow of traditional American structures. You have a family? That's great and all, but the progressive movement wants to tear that down. They envision a future where there is no nuclear family. Your job? Your house? Your independence? Your faith? Now your gender? Lol. The critical progressive movement wants it all destroyed. This sounds absurd, but it's in the literature, man. Hell, just listen to what they are saying.

Critical theory has gained control over the Democratic narrative over the last 12 years. Democratic elites and financial backers predominantly share this view. China will only donate to universities who have these types of programs, even though they don't allow this in their own country. Why? Do they just really want America to thrive? Lol. Hate to break it to you, but you are tacitly supporting this destructive trash by not contributing to the shut down of their perverse ideals, and you have the audacity to be offended that Democrats are being associated with them. You're the one that's uninformed, not me.

Your leaders need to be rejecting this for the good of America, and you need to be rejecting the leaders that are allowing this movement to grow. Period. There is no greater threat to America. Until then, I don't really care if they are called groomers or not. It's not rhetoric. It's inevitable.

What you're missing is, I don't care if why you're saying is true or not.  I care that the political temperature got high enough that Disney felt a need to pick a fight with the Republican party of Florida, and I care that the RPOF was petty enough to respond in a way that could increase my taxes.  What you're talking about is metaphysical.  I'm talking about real consequences.  

Sure there are kids out there who get abused or exposed to certain ideas too early.  It's terrible.  The bill that was passed is probably going to help reduce that, it certainly won't hurt.  But it passed in a way that made people who aren't pedophiles or groomers or anything like that feel attacked.  That's bad public policy, and now I'm in line to pay more taxes.  

I think you fundamentally misunderstand the role of government.  The government exists to always punish the one who does wrong, and sometimes commend the one who does right.  No more, no less.  It is not there to commend or punish ideas or statements.  Only actions.  It is not a forum where debates are won and lost.  It's just a place to punish the wrongdoers and uplift some of the people who have done right by their neighbors.

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Lol, the bill is targeting people who are GROOMING children. If a bill was targeting corporations who were abusing the working class, and a large contingent of people came out against it, not because there was anything wrong with the bill, but because corporate interests were influencing the counter-narrative, you could say those people were supporting corporations, right?

Do you see how I use logic to defend my points? Do you see how you use rhetoric?

You know what's funny about you? You don't think about the origins of ANYTHING. You just repeat talking points, man. How many times have conservatives been called racist, fascist, homophobic, xenophobic, bigots, NAZI's, Hitler by their opponents? It happens so frequently it's a [BLEEP] meme. None of those are ideals in the conservative party, nor is there any basis for that in the philosophy that supports conservatism, but they get labeled as such on the regular. They get deplatformed. They get physically assaulted. There is a very, very small group of actual NAZI's that might lean right when it's convenient, but they are COMPLETELY disavowed by conservatives, yet the left demagogues the whole party on the regular.

On the contrary, here you have a small fraction of progressives that ARE grooming children, their philosophy openly encourages this type of behavior, and their party openly embraces them and attacks those who call them out. If you don't want Democrats to be demagogued as groomers, maybe they should stop actively supporting this group. At the very least, maybe you could be less of a hypocrite with how you apply your standards to the respective parties.

The critical LGBTQ+ wing of the progressive movement are part of a coalition that is ushering in real fascism, but you are too ignorant to see it for what it is. And while all progressives aren't groomers, they largely share the same goal, which is the overthrow of traditional American structures. You have a family? That's great and all, but the progressive movement wants to tear that down. They envision a future where there is no nuclear family. Your job? Your house? Your independence? Your faith? Now your gender? Lol. The critical progressive movement wants it all destroyed. This sounds absurd, but it's in the literature, man. Hell, just listen to what they are saying.

Critical theory has gained control over the Democratic narrative over the last 12 years. Democratic elites and financial backers predominantly share this view. China will only donate to universities who have these types of programs, even though they don't allow this in their own country. Why? Do they just really want America to thrive? Lol. Hate to break it to you, but you are tacitly supporting this destructive trash by not contributing to the shut down of their perverse ideals, and you have the audacity to be offended that Democrats are being associated with them. You're the one that's uninformed, not me.

Your leaders need to be rejecting this for the good of America, and you need to be rejecting the leaders that are allowing this movement to grow. Period. There is no greater threat to America. Until then, I don't really care if they are called groomers or not. It's not rhetoric. It's inevitable.

What you're missing is, I don't care if why you're saying is true or not.  I care that the political temperature got high enough that Disney felt a need to pick a fight with the Republican party of Florida, and I care that the RPOF was petty enough to respond in a way that could increase my taxes.  What you're talking about is metaphysical.  I'm talking about real consequences.  

Sure there are kids out there who get abused or exposed to certain ideas too early.  It's terrible.  The bill that was passed is probably going to help reduce that, it certainly won't hurt.  But it passed in a way that made people who aren't pedophiles or groomers or anything like that feel attacked.  That's bad public policy, and now I'm in line to pay more taxes.  

I think you fundamentally misunderstand the role of government.  The government exists to always punish the one who does wrong, and sometimes commend the one who does right.  No more, no less.  It is not there to commend or punish ideas or statements.  Only actions.  It is not a forum where debates are won and lost.  It's just a place to punish the wrongdoers and uplift some of the people who have done right by their neighbors.

If they feel attacked maybe they should quit supporting groomers. That's the point of the attack in the first place, so it seems to be working.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Lol, the bill is targeting people who are GROOMING children. If a bill was targeting corporations who were abusing the working class, and a large contingent of people came out against it, not because there was anything wrong with the bill, but because corporate interests were influencing the counter-narrative, you could say those people were supporting corporations, right?

Do you see how I use logic to defend my points? Do you see how you use rhetoric?

You know what's funny about you? You don't think about the origins of ANYTHING. You just repeat talking points, man. How many times have conservatives been called racist, fascist, homophobic, xenophobic, bigots, NAZI's, Hitler by their opponents? It happens so frequently it's a [BLEEP] meme. None of those are ideals in the conservative party, nor is there any basis for that in the philosophy that supports conservatism, but they get labeled as such on the regular. They get deplatformed. They get physically assaulted. There is a very, very small group of actual NAZI's that might lean right when it's convenient, but they are COMPLETELY disavowed by conservatives, yet the left demagogues the whole party on the regular.

On the contrary, here you have a small fraction of progressives that ARE grooming children, their philosophy openly encourages this type of behavior, and their party openly embraces them and attacks those who call them out. If you don't want Democrats to be demagogued as groomers, maybe they should stop actively supporting this group. At the very least, maybe you could be less of a hypocrite with how you apply your standards to the respective parties.

The critical LGBTQ+ wing of the progressive movement are part of a coalition that is ushering in real fascism, but you are too ignorant to see it for what it is. And while all progressives aren't groomers, they largely share the same goal, which is the overthrow of traditional American structures. You have a family? That's great and all, but the progressive movement wants to tear that down. They envision a future where there is no nuclear family. Your job? Your house? Your independence? Your faith? Now your gender? Lol. The critical progressive movement wants it all destroyed. This sounds absurd, but it's in the literature, man. Hell, just listen to what they are saying.

Critical theory has gained control over the Democratic narrative over the last 12 years. Democratic elites and financial backers predominantly share this view. China will only donate to universities who have these types of programs, even though they don't allow this in their own country. Why? Do they just really want America to thrive? Lol. Hate to break it to you, but you are tacitly supporting this destructive trash by not contributing to the shut down of their perverse ideals, and you have the audacity to be offended that Democrats are being associated with them. You're the one that's uninformed, not me.

Your leaders need to be rejecting this for the good of America, and you need to be rejecting the leaders that are allowing this movement to grow. Period. There is no greater threat to America. Until then, I don't really care if they are called groomers or not. It's not rhetoric. It's inevitable.

Wishing I could rep this multiple times.

---

"Remember Red, Hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies."  - Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption

Neo-Fascist Liberals are destroying the left.

And I'm pretty happy with it.

---

Lol, the bill is targeting people who are GROOMING children. If a bill was targeting corporations who were abusing the working class, and a large contingent of people came out against it, not because there was anything wrong with the bill, but because corporate interests were influencing the counter-narrative, you could say those people were supporting corporations, right?

Do you see how I use logic to defend my points? Do you see how you use rhetoric?

You know what's funny about you? You don't think about the origins of ANYTHING. You just repeat talking points, man. How many times have conservatives been called racist, fascist, homophobic, xenophobic, bigots, NAZI's, Hitler by their opponents? It happens so frequently it's a [BLEEP] meme. None of those are ideals in the conservative party, nor is there any basis for that in the philosophy that supports conservatism, but they get labeled as such on the regular. They get deplatformed. They get physically assaulted. There is a very, very small group of actual NAZI's that might lean right when it's convenient, but they are COMPLETELY disavowed by conservatives, yet the left demagogues the whole party on the regular.

On the contrary, here you have a small fraction of progressives that ARE grooming children, their philosophy openly encourages this type of behavior, and their party openly embraces them and attacks those who call them out. If you don't want Democrats to be demagogued as groomers, maybe they should stop actively supporting this group. At the very least, maybe you could be less of a hypocrite with how you apply your standards to the respective parties.

The critical LGBTQ+ wing of the progressive movement are part of a coalition that is ushering in real fascism, but you are too ignorant to see it for what it is. And while all progressives aren't groomers, they largely share the same goal, which is the overthrow of traditional American structures. You have a family? That's great and all, but the progressive movement wants to tear that down. They envision a future where there is no nuclear family. Your job? Your house? Your independence? Your faith? Now your gender? Lol. The critical progressive movement wants it all destroyed. This sounds absurd, but it's in the literature, man. Hell, just listen to what they are saying.

Critical theory has gained control over the Democratic narrative over the last 12 years. Democratic elites and financial backers predominantly share this view. China will only donate to universities who have these types of programs, even though they don't allow this in their own country. Why? Do they just really want America to thrive? Lol. Hate to break it to you, but you are tacitly supporting this destructive trash by not contributing to the shut down of their perverse ideals, and you have the audacity to be offended that Democrats are being associated with them. You're the one that's uninformed, not me.

Your leaders need to be rejecting this for the good of America, and you need to be rejecting the leaders that are allowing this movement to grow. Period. There is no greater threat to America. Until then, I don't really care if they are called groomers or not. It's not rhetoric. It's inevitable.

What you're missing is, I don't care if why you're saying is true or not.  I care that the political temperature got high enough that Disney felt a need to pick a fight with the Republican party of Florida, and I care that the RPOF was petty enough to respond in a way that could increase my taxes.  What you're talking about is metaphysical.  I'm talking about real consequences.  

Sure there are kids out there who get abused or exposed to certain ideas too early.  It's terrible.  The bill that was passed is probably going to help reduce that, it certainly won't hurt.  But it passed in a way that made people who aren't pedophiles or groomers or anything like that feel attacked.  That's bad public policy, and now I'm in line to pay more taxes.  

I think you fundamentally misunderstand the role of government.  The government exists to always punish the one who does wrong, and sometimes commend the one who does right.  No more, no less.  It is not there to commend or punish ideas or statements.  Only actions.  It is not a forum where debates are won and lost.  It's just a place to punish the wrongdoers and uplift some of the people who have done right by their neighbors.

No. I'm not missing that, which is why I think you're a simpleton. Every single "reasonable" person that I know who leans left all suffers from the same problem: They would gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today. This Wimpy attitude is directly contributing to the destruction of our values and institutions. It's why our Covid policy was [BLEEP]. It's why our government is corrupt. It's why our media lies to us. It's why our science is compromised. It's why our rights are slowly trampled. Our immediate comfort takes precedent over the long-term success of our nation. Sometimes, the right thing is uncomfortable. Sometimes, you have to hear things you don't like. The cold hard reality is that, when you're all heading for a cliff, the first one to turn around is the most progressive.

---

What you're missing is, I don't care if why you're saying is true or not.  I care that the political temperature got high enough that Disney felt a need to pick a fight with the Republican party of Florida, and I care that the RPOF was petty enough to respond in a way that could increase my taxes.  What you're talking about is metaphysical.  I'm talking about real consequences.  

Sure there are kids out there who get abused or exposed to certain ideas too early.  It's terrible.  The bill that was passed is probably going to help reduce that, it certainly won't hurt.  But it passed in a way that made people who aren't pedophiles or groomers or anything like that feel attacked.  That's bad public policy, and now I'm in line to pay more taxes.  

I think you fundamentally misunderstand the role of government.  The government exists to always punish the one who does wrong, and sometimes commend the one who does right.  No more, no less.  It is not there to commend or punish ideas or statements.  Only actions.  It is not a forum where debates are won and lost.  It's just a place to punish the wrongdoers and uplift some of the people who have done right by their neighbors.

No. I'm not missing that, which is why I think you're a simpleton. Every single "reasonable" person that I know who leans left all suffers from the same problem: They would gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today. This Wimpy attitude is directly contributing to the destruction of our values and institutions. It's why our Covid policy was [BLEEP]. It's why our government is corrupt. It's why our media lies to us. It's why our science is compromised. It's why our rights are slowly trampled. Our immediate comfort takes precedent over the long-term success of our nation. Sometimes, the right thing is uncomfortable. Sometimes, you have to hear things you don't like. The cold hard reality is that, when you're all heading for a cliff, the first one to turn around is the most progressive.

And if there is no cliff, that guy is delusional and paranoid.

---

My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

There's always a decline, even if it doesn't look like a cliff, the fall is often fast and hard. Last year, what were conservatives saying about reckless spending. What did they say would happen? Oh yeah... inflation. What happens? Inflation, but it's just a coincidence... the war in Ukraine caused this problem. What about becoming energy dependent on other nations. What would happen then? Oh yeah, gas prices would rise dramatically. But nope, that's just because OPEC randomly decided to change their prices. It's not a supply or demand thing, is it? What about lockdowns and the damaging effect on the economy? Oh, yeah, it's going to stunt our economic growth and hurt mom and pop shops. What about defunding the police? More crime. Shocker. Mail-in ballots; massive cheating (that one didn't happen, lol). I could literally do this for an hour.

Dennis Prager was on Real Time with Bill Maher 3 years ago, when he said the left was saying men could menstruate. He was laughed off stage. Conservatives know your radicals better than you do. The news you consume doesn't show you the flaws in progressive ideology like it should. This is why you don't care. You don't see it. And, because you buy the lie that conservatives cause this mess, you don't do any proper self-reflection on what's being sold to you. It's sad. It doesn't matter how many "coincidences" there are. You still fall for it. Just compare blue run cities to red ones. It's obvious who has destructive policies. This happens over and over, but you and your ilk buy every lie sold to you by the mainstream media.

To be fair, conservatives are the same with abuse by corporate America, fake foreign wars, deregulation, and taxes. One-way censorship, low wages, job losses, and a rigged stock market is starting to make some of them realize that maybe corporate America isn't their friend. Even that's not enough.

---

And look, I am not a conservative that thinks liberals have no place in this country. We need regulation. We need a voice for the poor and disenfranchised. We need to explore new options and avenues for growth, opportunity, and unity. However, giving that voice to the progressive community is a disaster. Those things cannot occur without liberalism, and the progressive circle does not care about individual liberty in the slightest.

---

There's always a decline, even if it doesn't look like a cliff, the fall is often fast and hard. Last year, what were conservatives saying about reckless spending. What did they say would happen? Oh yeah... inflation. What happens? Inflation, but it's just a coincidence... the war in Ukraine caused this problem. What about becoming energy dependent on other nations. What would happen then? Oh yeah, gas prices would rise dramatically. But nope, that's just because OPEC randomly decided to change their prices. It's not a supply or demand thing, is it? What about lockdowns and the damaging effect on the economy? Oh, yeah, it's going to stunt our economic growth and hurt mom and pop shops. What about defunding the police? More crime. Shocker. Mail-in ballots; massive cheating (that one didn't happen, lol). I could literally do this for an hour.

Dennis Prager was on Real Time with Bill Maher 3 years ago, when he said the left was saying men could menstruate. He was laughed off stage. Conservatives know your radicals better than you do. The news you consume doesn't show you the flaws in progressive ideology like it should. This is why you don't care. You don't see it. And, because you buy the lie that conservatives cause this mess, you don't do any proper self-reflection on what's being sold to you. It's sad. It doesn't matter how many "coincidences" there are. You still fall for it. Just compare blue run cities to red ones. It's obvious who has destructive policies. This happens over and over, but you and your ilk buy every lie sold to you by the mainstream media.

To be fair, conservatives are the same with abuse by corporate America, fake foreign wars, deregulation, and taxes. One-way censorship, low wages, job losses, and a rigged stock market is starting to make some of them realize that maybe corporate America isn't their friend. Even that's not enough.

---

And look, I am not a conservative that things liberals have no place in this country. We need regulation. We need a voice for the poor and disenfranchised. We need to explore new options and avenues for growth, opportunity, and unity. However, giving that voice to the progressive community is a disaster. Those things cannot occur without liberalism, and the progressive circle does not care about individual liberty in the slightest.

I think we agree more than we disagree.

Some of what you're saying is simplistic though.  The world isn't so simple that one side is always right.

Conservatives beat the inflation drum starting in 2008.  The inflation didn't come until 2021.  They were wrong for 12 years.  They also had power for 4 of those years, and actually increased deficits with an overzealous tax cut during that time.

We got more energy independent during both the Obama and the Trump administrations.  Then COVID happened and Trump actually *made a deal* with OPEC in April 2020, to stabilize oil prices. That was probably the right move at the time, but that deal definitely caused oil prices to rise in 2021.

The lockdowns were necessary at first, I think we agree, because at a bare minimum the decks needed to be cleared in the hospitals for a potential surge of infections.  PPE needed to be stockpiled, etc.  But once we were locked down other voices started coming in saying we needed to stay locked down and all COVID cases are avoidable, etc.  The damage of the initial lockdown was substantial but justifiable.  That damage looks much worse now because the lockdowns went on for too long and because so many people decided, of their own volition, to work from home or not work at all.  That probably doesn't change even if the actual mandated lockdown was shorter.

Comparing "blue" cities to "red" ones is BS.  New York City has a lower crime rate than Jacksonville.  And in any case, city elections are never about the same issues as state elections or national elections.  A city council in the US is no more a model for how to run the US federal government than the Canadian Parliament is. Perhaps even less.

I don't believe conservatives caused this mess.  I'm not going to belabor the point but "the mess" is due to technology.  The malevolent actors were always there.  The new tech gave them the tools they needed to disconnect people from real community that really listens and really corrects and really finds consensus, and plug them into fake communities where everyone gets to shout down viewpoints they don't like and We are never wrong.

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Of course, what I am saying is simplistic. It wasn't meant to be a breakdown of each issue. I could refute the points you made as a follow up, but that wasn't the point. The point was simply that conservatives are often right about the future results of bad Democratic policy, but it gets maligned as scaremongering on the front end, then the gaslighting occurs on the back end. My point was a direct response to you saying you don't care if I'm right about the issue. You should care, because it's very obvious in this thread that you don't know what you're talking about. So, I think it's a bit daft for you to be so focused on calling groomers groomers instead of educating yourself on the actual threat to our republic.

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Of course, what I am saying is simplistic. It wasn't meant to be a breakdown of each issue. I could refute the points you made as a follow up, but that wasn't the point. The point was simply that conservatives are often right about the future results of bad Democratic policy, but it gets maligned as scaremongering on the front end, then the gaslighting occurs on the back end. My point was a direct response to you saying you don't care if I'm right about the issue. You should care, because it's very obvious in this thread that you don't know what you're talking about. So, I think it's a bit daft for you to be so focused on calling groomers groomers instead of educating yourself on the actual threat to our republic.

Liberals like him just see the trees. They can't even fathom the forest.

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Of course, what I am saying is simplistic. It wasn't meant to be a breakdown of each issue. I could refute the points you made as a follow up, but that wasn't the point. The point was simply that conservatives are often right about the future results of bad Democratic policy, but it gets maligned as scaremongering on the front end, then the gaslighting occurs on the back end. My point was a direct response to you saying you don't care if I'm right about the issue. You should care, because it's very obvious in this thread that you don't know what you're talking about. So, I think it's a bit daft for you to be so focused on calling groomers groomers instead of educating yourself on the actual threat to our republic.

Funny, I might say the same about you.  What you are saying doesn't make any sense to me.  You seem to be willing to have the country start a full civil war as long as the party you vote for makes the word choices you think are most accurate.  And perhaps you justify that choice because you think "the other side" also wants a civil war.  If so, you really don't know what you're talking about.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

It doesn't make sense because you can't think beyond your immediate experiences. You have not said one thing revelatory in this thread. You have not provided any new information. You haven't even attempted to use logic. You are just stating your opinion, while simultaneously admitting you don't know or care about the future goals of a group that wants to destroy American culture. All you care about is your immediate comfort. If weak willed people like you would stop enabling these clowns, we could begin to focus on some of the more pressing issues that are affecting the every day American, but you aren't going to get there by enabling these terrible ideologies.

Pushing back against this doesn't mean civil war you hyperbolic toad. It means calling a spade a spade. It means collectively coming together and telling these people that their warped ideology doesn't belong in our schools. It means educating yourself so you can actually see further than your nose.

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