Getting into the checkout line at Home Depot with diesel fuel, fertilizer, nails, casing and an ignition source is probably going to result in the police being called before you even get to pay, but your point is made and taken

Besides the fact that he received the gun **free** as a gift from his father despite not legally being allowed to have one.

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Besides the fact that he received the gun **free** as a gift from his father despite not legally being allowed to have one.

 

So does that mean that gun laws need to be addressed, specifically the 2nd Amendment?

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Or the whole congregation with a home made bomb. Nearly impossible to stop people who have murder in their heart. Evil will find a way.

No but you can look at other countries who are doing a much better job of it. Can we do better? Can we help make these events less common here? I think we can.

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http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/natio...story.html


I know it doesn't fit the narrative of the good ole days people like to push. People really do underestimate the media's influence on how we view the world.

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Not the point I was making. And I think fertilizer and diesel fuel are easier to procure than a gun.

But the reality is these are gun killings. And guns are extremely easy to get for anyone. You say they could make bombs but they aren't.

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I blame society because yes, racism does still exist even today. Just take a look at the video games, movies and television shows that are produced. Take a listen to some of the "music" that is being made in today's society.


Every time a mass shooting happens there is a certain crowd that calls for more restrictions regarding guns and the Second Amendment. The fact of the matter is, the majority of gun owners are law abiding citizens and use weapons in a responsible manner.



Refer to my statement towards The Anchorman.



Or on the flip-side, perhaps if someone at the prayer meeting was a concealed weapons holder and had a gun on them he would have been stopped immediately.

But again, the reality is these events happen more in the US then any other civilized nation. We also have one of the most lax laws toward gun ownership in the world. These stories rarely end with a law abiding citizen shooting the mass shooter. Again, reality vs fantasy. I think we need to stop coming up with possible scenarios that could happen and start focusing on what IS happening.

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People with bad intentions will always figure out a way to get what they need to cause the harm they intend to cause. So making guns illegal or harder to purchase will only keep the weapons away from the good guys. It's no different than illegal drugs. If you want them bad enough...they're easy to obtain.

Not necessarily true. Many other developed nations would say otherwise and have facts/stats to back it up.

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Not necessarily true. Many other developed nations would say otherwise and have facts/stats to back it up.

I should just assume you have those facts/stats readily available...?

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Have you seen my baseball?

But again, the reality is these events happen more in the US then any other civilized nation. We also have one of the most lax laws toward gun ownership in the world. These stories rarely end with a law abiding citizen shooting the mass shooter. Again, reality vs fantasy. I think we need to stop coming up with possible scenarios that could happen and start focusing on what IS happening.

 

So in your mind, we should abandon the very document that our country was founded on because of a few?  You yourself say that cases like this rarely ends up with a law abiding citizen as the perpetrator, yet your're advocating more restrictions on law abiding citizens?

 

How about we look at the root cause of such cases?  You know (or maybe not) go to the root of the problem rather than address the outcome of it.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

But again, the reality is these events happen more in the US then any other civilized nation. We also have one of the most lax laws toward gun ownership in the world. These stories rarely end with a law abiding citizen shooting the mass shooter. Again, reality vs fantasy. I think we need to stop coming up with possible scenarios that could happen and start focusing on what IS happening.

 

That's because those stories do not fit the narrative and hence do not make it to the "news".

 

A quick Google search will easily find many stories where the concealed carry holder comes out on top, possibly saving the lives of many.  

 

Is it a coincidence that places with strict gun control like Chicago and New York have some of the highest gun related crimes & crime in general?

 

Just look at these statistics, hard to argue against them.

 

http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myt...led-carry/

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I find it hard to believe that some people would try to argue that if somebody wants to do harm to others that they won't find the means to do so. There are some sick people out there...they will always be there. Again, RIP to the departed...you didn't deserve to go so soon. But the sick individual who did this apparently didn't agree.

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Have you seen my baseball?

Australia...

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I find it hard to believe that some people would try to argue that if somebody wants to do harm to others that they won't find the means to do so. There are some sick people out there...they will always be there. Again, RIP to the departed...you didn't deserve to go so soon. But the sick individual who did this apparently didn't agree.

 

But if you follow that logic you could say that if one country wants to attack another country they could do so whether they have nuclear weapons or not, therefore, we should not try to control nuclear weapons.  

 

That said, in this country, there's no chance of getting any gun control legislation passed.   Therefore, the question we ought to take up is, is there any way to clamp down on these events.    And I don't see any way other than increased government surveillance and profiling of people who have a tendency to do these things.   It seems like an almost impossible task: track these lonely, isolated young men who have no friends and who have decided  to become racists or religious fanatics.   The only way to control these acts is to get into the business of trying to predict who might flip out before  they have flipped out.   It's like one of those dystopian  science fiction movies where the government is watching everyone.  More infringement  on our freedom.   More government  surveillance.   Will we do that?  Well, if the past few years have taught us anything, it's that most people seem to be okay with trading away their freedom for more (percieved) safety.  

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Someone tell me what new gun law would have avoided this sick individual from getting a gun?

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Someone tell me what new gun law would have avoided this sick individual from getting a gun?

 

With as many guns as there are in the United States, there is no gun law that would be enforceable.   The horse is out of the barn on that one.  

 

The question we should be asking is, is there any way to minimize these incidents.    One thing I believe we can point to is that lonely, shy, frustrated young men are very susceptible to going off the rails of reality and doing things like this.   They suddenly become terrorists, or mass murderers, or both.   Maybe as a society we can become more aware of these people and do something for them.   Be their friend, get them a girlfriend, initiate some social programs (locally based, church based, private charities, whatever) and get them integrated back into society.   It's very difficult to stop them once they get it into their head that they have nothing to lose and then they find someone else to blame for their situation.   Donning the Confederate flag and posing with a firearm is a big red flag, no pun intended.   They need to get laid.  

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With as many guns as there are in the United States, there is no gun law that would be enforceable.   The horse is out of the barn on that one.  

 

The question we should be asking is, is there any way to minimize these incidents.    One thing I believe we can point to is that lonely, shy, frustrated young men are very susceptible to going off the rails of reality and doing things like this.   They suddenly become terrorists, or mass murderers, or both.   Maybe as a society we can become more aware of these people and do something for them.   Be their friend, get them a girlfriend, initiate some social programs (locally based, church based, private charities, whatever) and get them integrated back into society.   It's very difficult to stop them once they get it into their head that they have nothing to lose and then they find someone else to blame for their situation.   Donning the Confederate flag and posing with a firearm is a big red flag, no pun intended.   They need to get laid.  

 

In the old days the Lords dealt with this by packing those people off to war every summer. Society may have moved on to a more civilized order, but human depravity will always be with us.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

That's because those stories do not fit the narrative and hence do not make it to the "news".

 

A quick Google search will easily find many stories where the concealed carry holder comes out on top, possibly saving the lives of many.  

 

Is it a coincidence that places with strict gun control like Chicago and New York have some of the highest gun related crimes & crime in general?

 

Just look at these statistics, hard to argue against them.

 

http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myt...led-carry/

 

It is a small sample size and not enough to draw conclusions for the entire US.  I also think our attitude toward violence and guns is a part of that.  It may take time to reshape our views.  I don't dismiss those stats though.  We can compare ourselves to other countries, but at the same time, we have a different culture and what works there may not necessarily work here.

 

I think the thing that bugs me the most about those who don't want anymore restrictions to gun ownership is they pretty much say, there is nothing we can do.  There are bad people and we can stop them.  

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I should just assume you have those facts/stats readily available...?

 

It is not a secret.  There are a ton of stats to back it up.  Here is one.  It is pretty astounding.  Has more guns, gun rights made us safer?  That is the argument correct?  

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worl...d-country/

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So in your mind, we should abandon the very document that our country was founded on because of a few?  You yourself say that cases like this rarely ends up with a law abiding citizen as the perpetrator, yet your're advocating more restrictions on law abiding citizens?

 

How about we look at the root cause of such cases?  You know (or maybe not) go to the root of the problem rather than address the outcome of it.

 

I'm saying that no other civilized country has the problems with gun violence that we do.  I'm not saying take away guns, I'm saying we can do better and yes, we need better gun laws.  What we have now isn't working.  Just look at the numbers.

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I find it hard to believe that some people would try to argue that if somebody wants to do harm to others that they won't find the means to do so. There are some sick people out there...they will always be there. Again, RIP to the departed...you didn't deserve to go so soon. But the sick individual who did this apparently didn't agree.

 

I don't disagree, but at the same time, if you make it harder for someone to do harm, then you will lower those incidents.  It is just numbers.  If people want to cheat at black jack, they can.  But the house can make it more difficult for them to do so.  Again, look at other countries gun related murders and compare it to ours.  Do you really think we are doing the best we can?  

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