I find this whole issue to be "par for the course" regarding why we are even discussing it.

 

First of all, for the record I was not born or raised in the South.  I am also neither black nor white (I'm kind of a happy medium between the two).

 

This issue only came up because some crazy white racist shot and killed a bunch of black people in a church recently.  The PC crowd embraced this, then pointed to the flag that flies at a memorial on capitol grounds and started screaming for it to be taken down.  Politicians, both on the left and the right support this, not because of what the flag represents (or doesn't), but because it's the politically smart thing to do.  That's why as some would call it, "it's a bipartisan issue".  It is not.  Any politician left or right would damage their career if they weren't "on board" with the calls to take the flag down, especially now that the political season is starting.

 

My personal feeling on the issue.  I would leave the flag in place because it is a memorial and a piece of our nation's history.  Someone pointed out that the flag needs to be placed in a museum, and I certainly agree.  However, a memorial is also somewhat a form of museum.  Just because a memorial is on capitol grounds doesn't mean that the state in question is endorsing what the flag represents (or doesn't) to people.

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

I find this whole issue to be "par for the course" regarding why we are even discussing it.

 

First of all, for the record I was not born or raised in the South.  I am also neither black nor white (I'm kind of a happy medium between the two).

 

This issue only came up because some crazy white racist shot and killed a bunch of black people in a church recently.  The PC crowd embraced this, then pointed to the flag that flies at a memorial on capitol grounds and started screaming for it to be taken down.  Politicians, both on the left and the right support this, not because of what the flag represents (or doesn't), but because it's the politically smart thing to do.  That's why as some would call it, "it's a bipartisan issue".  It is not.  Any politician left or right would damage their career if they weren't "on board" with the calls to take the flag down, especially now that the political season is starting.

 

My personal feeling on the issue.  I would leave the flag in place because it is a memorial and a piece of our nation's history.  Someone pointed out that the flag needs to be placed in a museum, and I certainly agree.  However, a memorial is also somewhat a form of museum.  Just because a memorial is on capitol grounds doesn't mean that the state in question is endorsing what the flag represents (or doesn't) to people.

 

So, now you're defending your flag!  GET OUT! 

 

Sorry, preemptive strike because the rain of ignorance will shower down upon you for being logical. 

---

Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

That is really the issue here. The Confederate Battle Flag has been co-opted by hate groups just as is the case with the Nazi flag.


Ignoring history, or trying to hide it from public view, is a certain way to assure that it will be repeated.



That's your opinion, and you're certainly entitled to it. I'm not going anywhere. Unlike you, I'm proud of my country, flaws and all. I don't want to try to run from our history because I'm some mind-numbed coward who can't bear the thought of having to face the bad things this country has done in the name of progress. But hey, the world needs people like you too, and I would never suggest you leave this nation. We need ignorant folks to assure "big" issues like a flag continue to distract you from real issues that this nation is facing.


Remembering ALL of our history is an important part of appreciating just what we have here as a nation. Unfortunately, some folks were taught a very selective version, and it tends to reveal itself in discussions like these. Not your fault that you're ignorant. That's the way your side of the aisle likes to keep people.


I'm not sure what the quip about Texas was intended to accomplish. Considering they have one of the more thriving economies in the country, and their economic footprint actually rivals many countries, if your intent was to imply people from Texas are stupid, try again.

I don't really want you to leave this beautiful nation which believe it or not I quite like. I just think it's ironic that anyone opposed to the 'war on terrorism' 10 years ago was told 'IF YOU DON'T LIKE AMERICA, YOU CAN GET OUT!' but those same people who would say that shill for a symbol of treason.


And I'm pretty up on the civil war, btw. Spent 4 yrs in Gettysburg, took a lot of history. Seen Ken Burns' doc, which I agree with.

---

So, now you're defending your flag!  GET OUT! 

 

Sorry, preemptive strike because the rain of ignorance will shower down upon you for being logical. 

 

Nope.  I gave a disclaimer that clearly states that my heritage has nothing to do with the Confederate Battle Flag.  Of course, that will probably be ignored by the reading comprehension challenged on this board (see what I did there?  I was PC!).

 

By the way, being logical is really my personality.  My wife was the first one to say that I am too much like Spock.  

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Meh I don't care either way, it's a piece of cloth, if some idiot wanted to fly an ISIS flag that's their business, a flag by itself means nothing. 

---

Man people really think slavery wasnt THE issue of the civil war. In 2015. Incredible. Nevermind it was directly stated by the leaders of the confederacy.


That flag was and IS associated with the biggest discrace in American history (in before people say Obama). Nothing else matters. Go on waving your racist flag, makes it easier for the rest of us to not associate with you.

---

I'm not denying the souths instance or dependence on slavery nor am I justifying it. Non of that changes the reality that Lincoln was a tyrannical president responsible for the death of more Americans then any other individual in history.

So Lincoln should have just let the South break away?

---

So Lincoln should have just let the South break away?

Yes

---

The situation with the Confederate flag is stirred by nothing more than emotions.  It's no different. 

 

It's irrelevant what has happened elsewhere.  In SC, the flag is flown over a monument dedicated to Confederate soldiers on the capitol grounds. Considering what the monument is, the flag is an appropriate display regardless of how offensive it may be to some. If the flag is offensive there, then so would the very existence of a monument dedicated to the dead soldiers, so then what?  Should SC dig them all up and move them somewhere that is less offensive? At some point there's a line.  Where would you estimate that is?

 

Every state except for one that had the Confederate Battle Flag included in their state flags has removed it.  Odds are the last holdout will do so in the not too distant future.  So, the Confederate flag isn't a symbol associated with government institutions.  It's an historic symbol being associated with those individuals who died for the Confederacy in the Civil War.  That's not some sort of endorsement by government.  It's simply recognition that the history does indeed exist.

 

If it's a concern about flags flying over government facilities, the American flag offends many people.  It should be taken down.  I live in Florida.  The state flag has native Americans on it.  Considering their plight in American history, and because I have Indian heritage, should I demand that the flag be changed because my ancestors were murdered and robbed of their rights by the evil white man even before slavery became a scar from which this nation has still not fully recovered?

 

I'll concede your point of this being an emotional reaction to the recent shooting. My feeling is it should have never been erected in the first place, especially permanently bolted 30 feet above a memorial on state capitol grounds. Just like the naming of Forrest High School, it was typical of many symbolic acts in southern states in the late 50s/early 60s in reaction to forced integration.

 

Your point about the depiction of a Seminole woman on the Florida state flag is interesting, but not really relevant. Is there anything about it that honors those who died in the genocidal campaign against Native Americans?

---

If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

I'll concede your point of this being an emotional reaction to the recent shooting. My feeling is it should have never been erected in the first place, especially permanently bolted 30 feet above a memorial on state capitol grounds. Just like the naming of Forrest High School, it was typical of many symbolic acts in southern states in the late 50s/early 60s in reaction to forced integration.

 

Your point about the depiction of a Seminole woman on the Florida state flag is interesting, but not really relevant. Is there anything about it that honors those who died in the genocidal campaign against Native Americans?

 

Correct. The Confederate flag was flown over the S Carolina state capitol starting in 1962 as basically a middle finger to civil rights.

---

While my views on the Confederate flag are quite clear, I would like to point this out in regards to eBay and Amazon banning the sale of items displaying the Confederate flag:

 

Both sites still allow for the sale and purchase of Nazi memorabilia, including coinage and stamps that prominently display the swastika emblem.

---

While my views on the Confederate flag are quite clear, I would like to point this out in regards to eBay and Amazon banning the sale of items displaying the Confederate flag:

 

Both sites still allow for the sale and purchase of Nazi memorabilia, including coinage and stamps that prominently display the swastika emblem.

 

And they'll revert to allowing Confederate flagged items as soon as the hoopla subsides.  They're no different than the politicians who are being "bipartisan" when they support taking the flag down from a monument.  Nobody wants to be caught in the cross hairs of a politically correct mob.  That includes politicians and businesses. 

 

BTW, go out to eBay and search for "General Lee Replica".  They're being selective in what they're not allowing.

---

Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

While my views on the Confederate flag are quite clear, I would like to point this out in regards to eBay and Amazon banning the sale of items displaying the Confederate flag:

 

Both sites still allow for the sale and purchase of Nazi memorabilia, including coinage and stamps that prominently display the swastika emblem.

 

Currency is not exactly memorabilia. All they allow is coins and stamps. Everything else with that logo is banned.

---

just type in general lee

 

you can get thermos , stickers, patches. just no flag

---

Do you not think that the confederate flag largely represents a fight to keep slavery? You gonna pretend like that wasnt what the civil war was actually about? 

 

Do the south just not teach these things in their schools? 

The North had slaves as well. 

---

TravC59, aka JacksJags. @TravC59 on Twitter
;
; "This is really good, you want a bite, Honey?"

Companies are getting into this PC mess.  I find it interesting that while these companies are saying that they are going to remove any merchandise related to or depicting the Confederate Battle Flag, they still sell merchandise that depicts the image of Che Guevara.  Which is more "offensive" to people?

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

While my views on the Confederate flag are quite clear, I would like to point this out in regards to eBay and Amazon banning the sale of items displaying the Confederate flag:

 

Both sites still allow for the sale and purchase of Nazi memorabilia, including coinage and stamps that prominently display the swastika emblem.

 

Read the eBay statement. They have not banned the sale of items displaying the Confederate flag. You can still buy Confederate money if you would like.

---

;

;

Companies are getting into this PC mess.  I find it interesting that while these companies are saying that they are going to remove any merchandise related to or depicting the Confederate Battle Flag, they still sell merchandise that depicts the image of Che Guevara.  Which is more "offensive" to people?

 

We have Andrew Jackson on 20 dollar bill. That is offensive to some people.

---

;

;

I'll concede your point of this being an emotional reaction to the recent shooting. My feeling is it should have never been erected in the first place, especially permanently bolted 30 feet above a memorial on state capitol grounds. Just like the naming of Forrest High School, it was typical of many symbolic acts in southern states in the late 50s/early 60s in reaction to forced integration.

 

Your point about the depiction of a Seminole woman on the Florida state flag is interesting, but not really relevant. Is there anything about it that honors those who died in the genocidal campaign against Native Americans?

 

Whatever the motivation in the 50's and 60's, we're not the same nation we were half a century ago.  Most have let that go.  Not saying that everyone has, but I think the vast majority have moved on.

 

I disagree that the war memorial should never have been erected.  Win or lose, this nation has a history of honoring the dead in wars.  This is no different.  As we have grown and matured as a nation, those monuments deserve even more recognition because the truly do represent how this country has grown over the past centuries.  This serves as a reminder of where we were as a country, and to try to erase that history or hide it doesn't serve the purpose those who advocate such behavior would lead us to believe. 

 

Yes, having a high school named after one of the founders of the KKK may not seem noteworthy, but the reality is that he renounced that life and actually turned into one of the more high profile, vocal proponents for reconciliation and equality.  There's always more to the story than what the politically correct narrative allows.  Whether that made him worthy of having a high school named after him is irrelevant at this point because the PC police fought for and eventually got the name changed based solely on his Klan association without giving any regard to the fact that he was preaching a very different viewpoint later in life.

 

My point about the Seminole woman on the flag is simply to point out that there's always going to be someone who takes offense to something.  Similarly to groups demanding the Redskins change their name because it's not politically correct in their eyes, someone could very easily be offended by seeing a state flag with an Indian on it because it would serve as a painful reminder of the plight of native Americans early in the history of this nation. 

 

Don't like that one?  Stick to stars and stripes and how some folks say they're offended by THAT flag and the oppression it represents worldwide and here at home.  That's been happening in the current news cycles. That flag honors the valor of those who have died in the name of the United States of America.  That's the same flag that flew for northern slave owners, and over every state house that was involved in the fight to prevent civil rights. To some it's equally offensive to the Confederate Battle Flag.  Just go out on Youtube and watch Americans walking on or burning the flag in the past month.

 

The North had slaves as well. 

 

They don't teach that in yankee schools.

 

Companies are getting into this PC mess.  I find it interesting that while these companies are saying that they are going to remove any merchandise related to or depicting the Confederate Battle Flag, they still sell merchandise that depicts the image of Che Guevara.  Which is more "offensive" to people?

 

Chairman Mao's image is on all sorts of merchandise.  If anyone bothered to look up the trail of deaths (tens of millions) he was responsible for, maybe they'd rethink that?  Nah.  Probably not. 

---

Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

The North had slaves as well.

Did the North try to break away from the union to keep slavery? Are you that dense? The discussion is about the flag and what it symbolizes

---