Watsons arm is more like average and he's one of the best playmakers in the league at QB. 

Minshew has played well, idc about arm velocity if you play like he does but it's just the reality of who he is as a QB.

I'm not comparing the playmaking ability at this point. But on pure arm strength/velocity Watson is terrible.

Watson threw 45mph left and right
Minshew threw 55 left 53 right

Watson had the lowest velocity of any clocked QB in like 10 years. 

Point being arm strength is a [BLEEP] indicator of success. And Watson is a prime example

Velocity score numbers mean absolutely nothing. It's utter nonsense.

That's why you end up with guys like Cody Kessler and Andy Dalton scoring similarly to Cam Newton.

Or Pat Mahomes, Drew Lock and Tyree Jackson scoring less than Brett Rypien.

I think Mahomes actually scored the same as Cody Kessler

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That's fair. I was unclear in my initial post. That's my bad.

Fournette was never great at finding the hole, but he used to at least run hard to what he thought the hole was. Sometimes he found a hole; sometimes he ran straight into his lineman's back. But he always ran hard to the line.

I was responding to someone who said he looks like he's stutter-stepping up to the line, so my reply was more about his hesitation in even getting to the line, rather than finding the hole. Like he's trying too hard to find the hole now when he should just be running hard, because at least he had some success doing that.

That has to be coaching. He hasn't done his spin move in a long time. He doesn't try to take it outside even when there is time and a better hole. He is waiting for the hole in front if him to open. If the play call says the hole it here, he is waiting for it to be there.

It would be better for him to just plow into the line every time. Another thing is they aren't resting him, so maybe he isn't doing that because he has to play every snap.

Another thing is too many of his runs are from shotgun and he can't get up to speed fast.

Sent from my SM-T820 using Tapatalk

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Fournette was the 4th overall pick... It shouldn't be a question of "us wanting him to be etc". The fact of the matter is that he should be all of those things (or at least most of them), otherwise, why in the blue hell was he taken 4th overall as a RB?

Problem is, he's only one of those things, and that's just straight line speed, IF he has 10-15+ yards of wide open space to build it up.

This team should have kept Yeldon honestly and they should give Armstead some carries/touches.

Oh I agree that a 4th overall should be able to do whatever you want. Maybe it's trying to find what exactly can Fournette do.

The big thing for me is how he is hitting the holes. He used to be hammer into that line but take the 4th and 1 on the last drive or the 2pt, he almost stutter steps into the line. He would push guys 4 yards back just with his momentum.

"The holes"?  What holes?  I haven't seen any.

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Well, yeah. I mean I disliked the pick and advised against it pre-draft for exactly the reasons we're seeing play out.
But most offenses use a bit of smoke and mirrors for their backs. I'm just hoping to see Flip try a few different versions of it than he did today. 
Fournette's skillset is limited, his vision is [BLEEP], and his contact balance is non existent, but if they are going to keep trotting him out as a bellcow I'd like to see them work to get him some space to run.

I'm wondering if we know what kind of RB we want Fournette to be. Too slow when he was bigger and too many hits and he is slimmer this year and has some speed back but is by no means a burner. Hes hitting holes nowhere near as hard as that rookie year.

We seem to want him to be everything. 3 down back, power, speed, agility, catching. I'd rather see us, like last season with Grant and Yeldon, guys with other skills to compliment Fournettes game. Fournette was in for 97% of O snaps today.

They're still in the trying to hammer the star shaped peg into the crescent shaped hole stage with Fournette. The problem is the same one they had with Bortles, which is when you make that stupid a draft pick you have to throw good money after bad to try to prove you were never wrong to start with.

My guess is Fournette is gone next year when house gets cleaned.

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I'm wondering if we know what kind of RB we want Fournette to be. Too slow when he was bigger and too many hits and he is slimmer this year and has some speed back but is by no means a burner. Hes hitting holes nowhere near as hard as that rookie year.

We seem to want him to be everything. 3 down back, power, speed, agility, catching. I'd rather see us, like last season with Grant and Yeldon, guys with other skills to compliment Fournettes game. Fournette was in for 97% of O snaps today.

They're still in the trying to hammer the star shaped peg into the crescent shaped hole stage with Fournette. The problem is the same one they had with Bortles, which is when you make that stupid a draft pick you have to throw good money after bad to try to prove you were never wrong to start with.

My guess is Fournette is gone next year when house gets cleaned.

Oh that is 100% true. He gone.

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Oh I agree that a 4th overall should be able to do whatever you want. Maybe it's trying to find what exactly can Fournette do.

The big thing for me is how he is hitting the holes. He used to be hammer into that line but take the 4th and 1 on the last drive or the 2pt, he almost stutter steps into the line. He would push guys 4 yards back just with his momentum.

"The holes"?  What holes?  I haven't seen any.

I'm not putting it all on Fournette, run blocking has been non existent, take the 4th and 1. We need 1. Get behind Norwell and Linder and push them forward. But hes trying to read the line and look for holes and isn't running fast and it's all working against him. Hes not a Bell, stuttering and cutting, Fournette is a bruiser so I just dont know why when we need 1 yard and then 2 yard hes not just power running like he did in 2017.

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I'm wondering if we know what kind of RB we want Fournette to be. Too slow when he was bigger and too many hits and he is slimmer this year and has some speed back but is by no means a burner. Hes hitting holes nowhere near as hard as that rookie year.

We seem to want him to be everything. 3 down back, power, speed, agility, catching. I'd rather see us, like last season with Grant and Yeldon, guys with other skills to compliment Fournettes game. Fournette was in for 97% of O snaps today.

They're still in the trying to hammer the star shaped peg into the crescent shaped hole stage with Fournette. The problem is the same one they had with Bortles, which is when you make that stupid a draft pick you have to throw good money after bad to try to prove you were never wrong to start with.

My guess is Fournette is gone next year when house gets cleaned.

I would love Fournette to be that guy, after the playoff win in Pittsburgh, he was fantastic that game, I thought he was it.

The game is changing so quickly and especially RB's and how teams use them. It's now very fast guys who can be a receiving threat (Gurley, Kamara, McCaffrey) and that isn't really Fournettes style.

I think maybe Lynch when he was at Seattle would be more Fournettes style but he doesn't have the light feet and burst that Lynch somehow had.

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"The holes"?  What holes?  I haven't seen any.

I'm not putting it all on Fournette, run blocking has been non existent, take the 4th and 1. We need 1. Get behind Norwell and Linder and push them forward. But hes trying to read the line and look for holes and isn't running fast and it's all working against him. Hes not a Bell, stuttering and cutting, Fournette is a bruiser so I just dont know why when we need 1 yard and then 2 yard hes not just power running like he did in 2017.

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They're still in the trying to hammer the star shaped peg into the crescent shaped hole stage with Fournette. The problem is the same one they had with Bortles, which is when you make that stupid a draft pick you have to throw good money after bad to try to prove you were never wrong to start with.

My guess is Fournette is gone next year when house gets cleaned.

I would love Fournette to be that guy, after the playoff win in Pittsburgh, he was fantastic that game, I thought he was it.

The game is changing so quickly and especially RB's and how teams use them. It's now very fast guys who can be a receiving threat (Gurley, Kamara, McCaffrey) and that isn't really Fournettes style.

I think maybe Lynch when he was at Seattle would be more Fournettes style but he doesn't have the light feet and burst that Lynch somehow had.

Great organizations saw this coming a mile away. In 2017, Coughlin took the worst possible back for the future of the NFL at #4.

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Could have had Mahomes and Dalvin Cook.

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I loved loved loved going for two, regardless of whether we had a short week.

We had momentum, that defense was on its heels, and Minshew was unfazed by the moment.

When they handed the ball to 27, I threw my arms up in the air, and we got the loss we deserved. Coaches deserve all the heat for that call. It's not like we had been gashing them with that play all game.

I have a feeling Mr. Minshew is gonna get his first W this Thursday. Looks like he is really getting in synch with the WRs, and the playcalls are putting him into position to be successful.

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By that matter, so is Watson and it hasn't hindered him yet

Watsons arm is more like average and he's one of the best playmakers in the league at QB. 

Minshew has played well, idc about arm velocity if you play like he does but it's just the reality of who he is as a QB.

Says a lot about how bad the NFL has become.

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https://twitter.com/Jaguars/status/11736...28513?s=20

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https://twitter.com/Jaguars/status/11736...28513?s=20

Look at that hole. 

Taylor looks to push the LB into the play, Cann loses his battle, Norwell loses his battle. I saw people saying it was an RPO but we didn't seem to wait for the D to react and read it, we seemed to look at that gap between the LBs and pick run before the snap.

The problem is, we've got nobody to block the LBs at the second level and the safeties dont need to play deep so that hole closes quick.

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https://twitter.com/Jaguars/status/11736...28513?s=20

Look at that hole. 

Taylor looks to push the LB into the play, Cann loses his battle, Norwell loses his battle. I saw people saying it was an RPO but we didn't seem to wait for the D to react and read it, we seemed to look at that gap between the LBs and pick run before the snap.

The problem is, we've got nobody to block the LBs at the second level and the safeties dont need to play deep so that hole closes quick.

They determine the option based on how the defense lines up, not a post snap decision on this playcall. 
Marrone indicated this post game.

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This play still has me shaking my head, Tashaun Gipson vs Fournette in the open field he doesn't even tries to make him miss....he only had the entire field open on the right...

https://twitter.com/phillip_heilman/stat...2146732032

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This play still has me shaking my head, Tashaun Gipson vs Fournette in the open field he doesn't even tries to make him miss....he only had the entire field open on the right...

https://twitter.com/phillip_heilman/stat...2146732032

I left the room after this play. He has zero wiggle and he didn't even try to run him over.

Then there is this beauty

https://twitter.com/phillip_heilman/stat...17921?s=20

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https://twitter.com/Jaguars/status/11736...28513?s=20

Look at that hole. 

Taylor looks to push the LB into the play, Cann loses his battle, Norwell loses his battle. I saw people saying it was an RPO but we didn't seem to wait for the D to react and read it, we seemed to look at that gap between the LBs and pick run before the snap.

The problem is, we've got nobody to block the LBs at the second level and the safeties dont need to play deep so that hole closes quick.

The hole between the RT & TE was huge because Watt was so far outside. The hole was even there for LF to hit, but he once again was too slow to get to the hole.

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After watching the Conversion attempt about 20 times my biggest takeaway is why did 3 out of 5 lineman get blown back a yard from the LOS. 

Linder is being paid top (3?) money and he got handled. Norwell should be our best lineman and gets pushed back initially but recovers pretty well. Cann is Cann. Can't really say 1 of the 5 definitively won their matchup. Big concern.

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I appreciate that I couldn't do what these guys do... and then I realize I wasn't drafted in the top of the draft to play football. Fournette isn't all to blame but he isn't a top draft pick. Hindsight helps but ugh it is tough as a fan.

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Birth of the Franchise - November 30, 1993
Death of the Franchise - November 29, 2011

Fans deserve better. Thanks for all the good times too many are in the past.