All fan bases are knee jerky. Jags fans are no different.

Jags fans are the worst.

Go check in on Cowboys, Jets and Giants fans at the moment.

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Jags fans are the worst.

I do not believe that at all.

Even if it were true, Jags fans would be entitled to be the worst, given the W-L record of the franchise over the last decade and ineptitude of the decision-makers.

Despite that, I think Jags fans have been tremendously patient and supportive.  But I admit, I would be done with this franchise after this season if they continue down this same leadership path.

I don't mean we have the worst fans. Just the guys on this board being particularly knee jerky in their reactions (or over reactions) to certain things. I know fans of a lot of different teams (including bad teams like the football team in DC) and they don't seem to be as bad as some posters here with chicken little scenarios and one day someone is good then a bad game later it's "he trash, fire everyone".
Happens a lot here.

I got no problem with people being critical of a franchise they are a fan of who hasn't given much to cheer about in the last 10-15 years... I was just commenting on how fast people tend to turn on players and how quickly we go from "tank for trevor" to "oh week 1 win and close game in week 2 we might be okay this year" back to "tank for trevor".

And if we win in Houston and vs the Lions (don't laugh) then what, Minshew is "the man" again? I'm sure someone will dig up the thread.

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Jags fans are the worst.

Go check in on Cowboys, Jets and Giants fans at the moment.

Jets and Giants aren't being knee jerk about their awful teams at all. They are most likely the worst and 2nd worst team in the league.

Cowboys fans are spoiled, not surprised they'd be flailing at the moment, though they've played really close vs some good competition.

I'm speaking specifically to the back and forth of "we suck" "oh we're good" "oh we suck" mentality of our fans (or this board rather) instead of just letting the season play out. Every week it's a new declaration or a dug up thread of some old declaration that is now proven right or wrong. Each game is a testament to the entire season. Week 1 upset of clots, Jags might surprise. Week 2 close game vs tacks, the offense is GREAT, the D is the only problem. Week 3 Phins Minshew sucks OL sucks, defense sucks, WRs suck. Everything sucks. so on and so forth.

And in a few weeks if we manage to pull of some wins, a bunch of posters will flip back to super high feelings.
It's the most bi-polar manic stuff I've ever seen.

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Go check in on Cowboys, Jets and Giants fans at the moment.

Jets and Giants aren't being knee jerk about their awful teams at all. They are most likely the worst and 2nd worst team in the league.

Cowboys fans are spoiled, not surprised they'd be flailing at the moment, though they've played really close vs some good competition.

I'm speaking specifically to the back and forth of "we suck" "oh we're good" "oh we suck" mentality of our fans (or this board rather) instead of just letting the season play out. Every week it's a new declaration or a dug up thread of some old declaration that is now proven right or wrong. Each game is a testament to the entire season. Week 1 upset of clots, Jags might surprise. Week 2 close game vs tacks, the offense is GREAT, the D is the only problem. Week 3 Phins Minshew sucks OL sucks, defense sucks, WRs suck. Everything sucks. so on and so forth.

And in a few weeks if we manage to pull of some wins, a bunch of posters will flip back to super high feelings.
It's the most bi-polar manic stuff I've ever seen.

You are joking, right?  Have you ever been to NYC?  Jets fans were calling for Gase's firing after his awkward opening press conference and want him out now after 20 games.  Giants fans want the GM canned after 3 years and to move on from their 2nd year QB already.  Go check out those boards. Jags fans are WAYYYYY more patient than NY fans.

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This is a results-oriented business.  There are no trophies or titles given for "moral victories" or for "winning the draft".  Our record with DC is 37-86.  6-10 is our 2nd best season in 8 years of Caldwell leadership.  These are the FACTS.

Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, whomever, none of these could perform with the current OL.    On several plays last night Mahomes had 5 seconds to throw against a good team.  Thats not on the QB.

Game are won on the OL or DL.  Its the core of success.  Until this team has stable OL/DLs its going to struggle.

I like Minshew, he's not the long term answer.  He's sure fun to watch!

Raw rookie Burrow is performing pretty well behind, arguably, the worst OL in the league.

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Go check in on Cowboys, Jets and Giants fans at the moment.

Jets and Giants aren't being knee jerk about their awful teams at all. They are most likely the worst and 2nd worst team in the league.

Cowboys fans are spoiled, not surprised they'd be flailing at the moment, though they've played really close vs some good competition.

I'm speaking specifically to the back and forth of "we suck" "oh we're good" "oh we suck" mentality of our fans (or this board rather) instead of just letting the season play out. Every week it's a new declaration or a dug up thread of some old declaration that is now proven right or wrong. Each game is a testament to the entire season. Week 1 upset of clots, Jags might surprise. Week 2 close game vs tacks, the offense is GREAT, the D is the only problem. Week 3 Phins Minshew sucks OL sucks, defense sucks, WRs suck. Everything sucks. so on and so forth.

And in a few weeks if we manage to pull of some wins, a bunch of posters will flip back to super high feelings.
It's the most bi-polar manic stuff I've ever seen.

I don’t know how old you are but that’s pretty much life in a nutshell. None of us know for sure what the hell we are doing and will die not knowing what the hell we are doing. 

This board is a fun time killer hobby for most of us. We vent, we share opinions, sometimes right, sometimes very wrong. 

We all have at least one commonality, we want the Jags to win- but truthfully none of really have an idea how to make that happen. 

So just look at this place as entertainment and when it’s not fun anymore change the channel and browse something else. I took Jan-March off for a change of pace. 

The truth is no one truly knows at this point if Minshew or Tlaw are franchise guys....but it’s fun to speculate!

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Minshew be looking like a Brian Hoyer arm last night.  Cut bait and move on. Put in Luton

Gardner arm does not look like Brian Hoyer's, lol. He may not have the strongest arm but he makes better throws/has more strength than Brian. I'm not usually one that likes to harp on arm strength. I believe a QB can be sucessful even without having the strongest. 

But Brian Hoyer does have a pretty weak looking arm and has struggled to throw the ball in multiple instances. He actually looks like he's trying to wind up his arm when he throws sometimes. Gardner doesn't look like that.

And lol at people.continuing to talk about cutting/benching Garden. I believe he has the 2nd highest passer rating in.the AFC.

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Minshew be looking like a Brian Hoyer arm last night.  Cut bait and move on. Put in Luton

Gardner arm does not look like Brian Hoyer's, lol. He may not have the strongest arm but he makes better throws/has more strength than Brian. I'm not usually one that likes to harp on arm strength. I believe a QB can be sucessful even without having the strongest. 

But Brian Hoyer does have a pretty weak looking arm and has struggled to throw the ball in multiple instances. He actually looks like he's trying to wind up his arm when he throws sometimes. Gardner doesn't look like that.

And lol at people.continuing to talk about cutting/benching Garden. I believe he has the 2nd highest passer rating in.the AFC. 

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Minshew be looking like a Brian Hoyer arm last night.  Cut bait and move on. Put in Luton

Gardner arm does not look like Brian Hoyer's, lol. He may not have the strongest arm but he makes better throws/has more strength than Brian. I'm not usually one that likes to harp on arm strength. I believe a QB can be sucessful even without having the strongest. 

But Brian Hoyer does have a pretty weak looking arm and has struggled to throw the ball in multiple instances. He actually looks like he's trying to wind up his arm when he throws sometimes. Gardner doesn't look like that.

And lol at people.continuing to talk about cutting/benching Garden. I believe he has the 2nd highest passer rating in.the AFC.

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Gardner arm does not look like Brian Hoyer's, lol. He may not have the strongest arm but he makes better throws/has more strength than Brian. I'm not usually one that likes to harp on arm strength. I believe a QB can be sucessful even without having the strongest. 

But Brian Hoyer does have a pretty weak looking arm and has struggled to throw the ball in multiple instances. He actually looks like he's trying to wind up his arm when he throws sometimes. Gardner doesn't look like that.

And lol at people.continuing to talk about cutting/benching Garden. I believe he has the 2nd highest passer rating in.the AFC. 

Benching Minshew is just crazy talk. Even if we did draft Tlaw- I wouldn’t bench Minshew until Tlaw is ready. With a decent defense Minshew can win games and he’s the best QB we have right now. 

Minshew is not a bad QB and for a 6th rounder he’s an amazing QB. I could see him getting up a wildcard run if we had a better defense. 

For me this thread is more about if Minshew is a dynasty/franchise type QB. I just don’t see it. I do think he’s the best QB this franchise has seen in a very long time. With that said, I think this franchise deserves a Mahomes type guy and if we can grab one, with how Minshew is playing, we should do it.

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Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, whomever, none of these could perform with the current OL.    On several plays last night Mahomes had 5 seconds to throw against a good team.  Thats not on the QB.

Game are won on the OL or DL.  Its the core of success.  Until this team has stable OL/DLs its going to struggle.

I like Minshew, he's not the long term answer.  He's sure fun to watch!

Raw rookie Burrow is performing pretty well behind, arguably, the worst OL in the league.

And as good as he's been, Minshew's first four games beat Burrow in every single category except yards-per-game. In several categories, Minshew far outperforms Burrow. That's not a direct apples-to-apples comparison, but I think it should put in perspective that Minshew has shown quiet a bit at this point. We keep excusing flaws we see in other teams' rookies, but we have a young QB that's not getting the benefit of the doubt after a couple moments when he's subpar.

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The shortcomings this football team has.. They have very little to do with Minshew. He is getting too much of the blame but that is the nature of the QB position. We would be 3-1 at worst with a good defense.

He isn't perfect but he plays the position well. For everything this team and franchise has going on right now he has been one of the very few bright spots over the last 2 seasons.

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Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, whomever, none of these could perform with the current OL.    On several plays last night Mahomes had 5 seconds to throw against a good team.  Thats not on the QB.

Game are won on the OL or DL.  Its the core of success.  Until this team has stable OL/DLs its going to struggle.

I like Minshew, he's not the long term answer.  He's sure fun to watch!

Raw rookie Burrow is performing pretty well behind, arguably, the worst OL in the league.

I was thinking the same thing while watching the game this past Sunday... until I realized the defense that he was up against.

I think at this point Minshew will be fine.  Is he ever going to be a Mahomes?  Probably not.  I think that he has the potential to be a Phillip Rivers type QB.  Pretty good, just not enough to put him over the top.  It's not necessarily all on him, the supporting cast around him on both sides of the ball have a lot to do with it.

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

Raw rookie Burrow is performing pretty well behind, arguably, the worst OL in the league.

And as good as he's been, Minshew's first four games beat Burrow in every single category except yards-per-game. In several categories, Minshew far outperforms Burrow. That's not a direct apples-to-apples comparison, but I think it should put in perspective that Minshew has shown quiet a bit at this point. We keep excusing flaws we see in other teams' rookies, but we have a young QB that's not getting the benefit of the doubt after a couple moments when he's subpar.

As someone who lives in the Cincinnati area and has seen all of Burrow's games so far and 3 of 4 of Minshew's games, (I missed the Tennessee game,) I can tell you that I see a world of difference. In those first three games Cincinnati played, Burrow was under a ton of pressure on nearly every play. I didn't see any panic in him though. He stepped up in the pocket, remained cool and if the pressure got too close, he threw the ball out of bounds and didn't try to force things that weren't there. He has gotten consistently better with each passing week. A.J. Greene was given the franchise tag and that came with a lot of money. Despite this, Greene doesn't look anything close to being the player he once was. He's not getting separation at all. He was supposed to be Burrow's "go-to" receiver, but Burrow is seeing his decline and doesn't feel obligated to force the ball to him. He's utilizing all of his other receivers and going through his progressions quickly and making the right reads. It's been a long time since I've seen a rookie QB look so polished. 

With Minshew, he gets "happy feet" when he feels the pocket collapsing. It's like he goes into panic mode and he either cuts off his reads and starts scrambling until he is sacked or forces ill-advised passes. He tries to make something happen when it isn't there and often times, we are penalized, because he is holding the ball too long or he is dropped for a sack. For some reason, he forgets to chuck it out of bounds to avoid a loss. To be honest, I don't know what the deal is, but the consistency isn't there. He's been regressing, while Burrow has been ascending. If you watch their games throughout the season and take into account the talent level around them, that is apparent. I'd say the Bengals O-Line is vastly worse than ours, despite the outcome of Sunday's game. The receivers are pretty equal and I'd also say Robinson is every bit as good as Mixon at the RB position. That means the talent level of the people around them is almost even. Stats aside, you only need to see that one is getting better as the season goes on, while one is not.

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Y'all do too much box score scouting. Almost no stats mean anything after a measly 4 weeks.

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And as good as he's been, Minshew's first four games beat Burrow in every single category except yards-per-game. In several categories, Minshew far outperforms Burrow. That's not a direct apples-to-apples comparison, but I think it should put in perspective that Minshew has shown quiet a bit at this point. We keep excusing flaws we see in other teams' rookies, but we have a young QB that's not getting the benefit of the doubt after a couple moments when he's subpar.

As someone who lives in the Cincinnati area and has seen all of Burrow's games so far and 3 of 4 of Minshew's games, (I missed the Tennessee game,) I can tell you that I see a world of difference. In those first three games Cincinnati played, Burrow was under a ton of pressure on nearly every play. I didn't see any panic in him though. He stepped up in the pocket, remained cool and if the pressure got too close, he threw the ball out of bounds and didn't try to force things that weren't there. He has gotten consistently better with each passing week. A.J. Greene was given the franchise tag and that came with a lot of money. Despite this, Greene doesn't look anything close to being the player he once was. He's not getting separation at all. He was supposed to be Burrow's "go-to" receiver, but Burrow is seeing his decline and doesn't feel obligated to force the ball to him. He's utilizing all of his other receivers and going through his progressions quickly and making the right reads. It's been a long time since I've seen a rookie QB look so polished. 

With Minshew, he gets "happy feet" when he feels the pocket collapsing. It's like he goes into panic mode and he either cuts off his reads and starts scrambling until he is sacked or forces ill-advised passes. He tries to make something happen when it isn't there and often times, we are penalized, because he is holding the ball too long or he is dropped for a sack. For some reason, he forgets to chuck it out of bounds to avoid a loss. To be honest, I don't know what the deal is, but the consistency isn't there. He's been regressing, while Burrow has been ascending. If you watch their games throughout the season and take into account the talent level around them, that is apparent. I'd say the Bengals O-Line is vastly worse than ours, despite the outcome of Sunday's game. The receivers are pretty equal and I'd also say Robinson is every bit as good as Mixon at the RB position. That means the talent level of the people around them is almost even. Stats aside, you only need to see that one is getting better as the season goes on, while one is not.

I think we’re forgetting how good his first few games were. He showed many of the exact things you’re crediting Burrow with having showed. His OL was horrible, too. I’m not making a case for him being better. I’m just saying that he showed a lot early on (and recently), so him showing those flaws don’t somehow negate everything he’s shown. 

Y'all do too much box score scouting. Almost no stats mean anything after a measly 4 weeks.

That isn’t at all the point.

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Like Burrow won't have happy feet after he gets his [BLEEP] handed to him for the next 6 weeks. That kid's gonna be Carr-Bombed before the year is out.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

As someone who lives in the Cincinnati area and has seen all of Burrow's games so far and 3 of 4 of Minshew's games, (I missed the Tennessee game,) I can tell you that I see a world of difference. In those first three games Cincinnati played, Burrow was under a ton of pressure on nearly every play. I didn't see any panic in him though. He stepped up in the pocket, remained cool and if the pressure got too close, he threw the ball out of bounds and didn't try to force things that weren't there. He has gotten consistently better with each passing week. A.J. Greene was given the franchise tag and that came with a lot of money. Despite this, Greene doesn't look anything close to being the player he once was. He's not getting separation at all. He was supposed to be Burrow's "go-to" receiver, but Burrow is seeing his decline and doesn't feel obligated to force the ball to him. He's utilizing all of his other receivers and going through his progressions quickly and making the right reads. It's been a long time since I've seen a rookie QB look so polished. 

With Minshew, he gets "happy feet" when he feels the pocket collapsing. It's like he goes into panic mode and he either cuts off his reads and starts scrambling until he is sacked or forces ill-advised passes. He tries to make something happen when it isn't there and often times, we are penalized, because he is holding the ball too long or he is dropped for a sack. For some reason, he forgets to chuck it out of bounds to avoid a loss. To be honest, I don't know what the deal is, but the consistency isn't there. He's been regressing, while Burrow has been ascending. If you watch their games throughout the season and take into account the talent level around them, that is apparent. I'd say the Bengals O-Line is vastly worse than ours, despite the outcome of Sunday's game. The receivers are pretty equal and I'd also say Robinson is every bit as good as Mixon at the RB position. That means the talent level of the people around them is almost even. Stats aside, you only need to see that one is getting better as the season goes on, while one is not.

I think we’re forgetting how good his first few games were. He showed many of the exact things you’re crediting Burrow with having showed. His OL was horrible, too. I’m not making a case for him being better. I’m just saying that he showed a lot early on (and recently), so him showing those flaws don’t somehow negate everything he’s shown. 

You're missing the point. He may have been good in the first two games, but it's obvious he has regressed and Burrow got better. That is the major difference. A good QB will continue to grow and improve. I'm not seeing that from Minshew. A mediocre QB will have good games where you think you have a franchise QB and then turn around and make mistakes that you thought they had started to get past. That is what I see with Minshew. I'm not saying he's bad at all. I'm just saying that I'm not seeing the improvement and consistency that a franchise QB is supposed to show. Maybe our O-Line was complete garbage last year, but this season they've worked their way up to average, so you can't lay blame on the O-Line. It doesn't matter if Minshew has flashed brilliance at times. It only matters if he can be good consistently and I certainly haven't seen that. Consistency is key. We've NEVER had that in a QB. Not even Brunell.

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I’m comparing how good Minshew’s first four games were and how some are ready to move on from him while also using Burrow’s first four games as proof he’s a future star. We don’t know where Burrow will go. I do remember that Minshew was poised until he kept getting hit repeatedly. That’s when we started seeing the happy feet occasionally.

As for this year? I don’t know what his excuse is but good QBs sometimes regress before getting better. It isn’t like he’s a bad QB.

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In the eye test, there's a world of difference between Minshew and Burrow. On field and off. Burrow is much more composed. He seems confident knowing things will only get better with the team around him so he's playing as good as he can with what he has. He makes good decisions on the field and looks relaxed and comfortable on the sidelines.

Minshew has a better OL in front of him than last year yet he looks jumpy and unsure. His accuracy is declining. But most of all, you can see the stress on his face. He looks overwhelmed at times in play and on the sidelines. Having a defense that hangs a TD around his neck every quarter isn't helping his plight and I have no doubt he's demoralized. He probably views his performance on offense as nothing more than a futile effort to stay in the game rather than gaining a lead and keeping it. Jay Gruden just needs to corner Todd Wash in the locker room and kick his [BLEEP]. That guy is ruining everything.

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Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, whomever, none of these could perform with the current OL.    On several plays last night Mahomes had 5 seconds to throw against a good team.  Thats not on the QB.

Game are won on the OL or DL.  Its the core of success.  Until this team has stable OL/DLs its going to struggle.

I like Minshew, he's not the long term answer.  He's sure fun to watch!

Raw rookie Burrow is performing pretty well behind, arguably, the worst OL in the league.

Sometimes your eyes can fool you. For perspective after four games, here are some statistical rankings comparisons between Minshew, Murray, and Burrows courtesy ESPN.

• Completion % - Minshew 6th, Murray 13th, Burrow 21st
  
• Total yards - Minshew 7th, Burrow 10th, Murray 21st
  
• Per attempt yardage - Minshew 16th, Murray 27th, Burrow 29th
  
• TDs - Minshew tied 7th, Murray tied 11th, Burrow tied 16th
  
• QBR  - Murray 13th, Minshew 19th, Burrow 24th
  
• Rating - Minshew 13th, Burrow 22nd, Murray 23rd
  

I know, I know there will be people who will explain why the ratings don't mean anything and that Minshew's placement in the statistical rankings are meaningless but they do show that clearly there's *something* there.

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I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

Minshew be looking like a Brian Hoyer arm last night.  Cut bait and move on. Put in Luton

Really? After 4 games? Lol.

This is the "play an entire season with Curtis Painter at QB, there's a stud in the darft next year" approach.

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