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Jaguars Defensive rankings

#61

(09-28-2022, 09:34 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote:
(09-28-2022, 08:56 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: If your franchise literally just broke the all time record for most money spent in free agency, you'd better hope you aren't going to follow that up with more big spending. 

Extensions/new contracts for our better talent approaching end of contract or massively outplaying their contract should be a priority.

As far as addressing needs on the roster through FA and the draft:
  •  we may need depth or competition at interior OL depending on how Bartch and Fortner finish the year I see them drafting a couple guys here. As far as T is concerned, Jawaan is going to need to be paid as well at this rate
  • we will likely go after an X receiver - will that be draft or FA? I'd say probably draft if only because of cost
  •  we have to add tight ends or re-sign Arnold, Engram and Manhertz - all are impending FAs. Engram will want to stay. If we can keep at least him and Arnold. If not, may need to draft one to save $$$ We also have Farrell who they seem to like as a developmental guy
  •  we have to add depth at safety , maybe competition too Rayshawn is likely gone so I see a high draft pick here
  • James Robinson needs a deal ASAP YES
  • Marvin Jones will likely be gone - do you pay a guy his age to keep continuity? Probably not Probably leaves. Age and capable player behind him in Tim Jones
  • Role players like Gotsis, Arden Key and Smoot are all set to depart unless paid This is where it gets rough. We have to keep hopefully 2/3
  • If they want that QB room intact they'll have to pay Beathard I have zero concerns here. I'd just draft a late rounder as a backup

Obviously, they still need to spend some money on some of this ^ but it will have to be a fraction of what they spent in 2022

Will be interesting to see who they let walk and who they pay to stay

Added some thoughts to your points.

I think Griffin, Jenkins, RRH are all gone. Plus some back end guys are likely out. Those 3 can free up the cap space for Allen and JRob.

Agree on Jenkins and Griffin, with the way RRH has played i don't thinknhe goes anywhere, especially seeing that probably a couple of Smoot, Key, and Gotsis will be gone.  I think it's possible if Taylor continues to play at a high level we franchise him and then the following year a pick which one we want between Cam or Taylor and then Little fills in the opposite.  We could move on from Cam after next year if we wanted so we could cut Cam and extend Taylor and Little can go back to his natural position LT if Taylor out plays Cam.  I think safety and TE are 2 of the positions we draft early in next years draft if the value is there.  Still need to see what the draft looks like at the end of the year.  If we do tag Taylor I think we stick with the oline we have now for next year as well.  WR, TR, and S is a few positions I think we target early in the draft if the value is there
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#62

(09-28-2022, 09:45 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote:
(09-28-2022, 09:34 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: Added some thoughts to your points.

I think Griffin, Jenkins, RRH are all gone. Plus some back end guys are likely out. Those 3 can free up the cap space for Allen and JRob.

Agree on Jenkins and Griffin, with the way RRH has played i don't thinknhe goes anywhere, especially seeing that probably a couple of Smoot, Key, and Gotsis will be gone.  I think it's possible if Taylor continues to play at a high level we franchise him and then the following year a pick which one we want between Cam or Taylor and then Little fills in the opposite.  We could move on from Cam after next year if we wanted so we could cut Cam and extend Taylor and Little can go back to his natural position LT if Taylor out plays Cam.  I think safety and TE are 2 of the positions we draft early in next years draft if the value is there.  Still need to see what the draft looks like at the end of the year.  If we do tag Taylor I think we stick with the oline we have now for next year as well.  WR, TR, and S is a few positions I think we target early in the draft if the value is there

RRH would be strictly a cap casualty. Unless he wants to restructure. We can save $8m by releasing him next year.
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#63

(09-28-2022, 05:44 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote:
(09-27-2022, 10:25 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: Just re-watched and there were 3 or 4 dropped INTs in the second half alone by our defense. On the flip side of that, Derwin James dropped one for them

I noticed this too. Trevor threw 3 or 4 late ossses that were dangerous

I wouldn't consider any of Trevor's throws this year to be dangerous except for the INT, but there is shared blame on that.  On the INT he was hit as he threw and the quick pressure was allowed by Cam who became a turnstile on that final drive.  I think Trevor for the vast majority of throws has been very smart and accurate with placement.  If you go back and watch the ones that were defensed it was because of great effort by the DB where they were laying out for the ball and just barely getting there.  To me, dangerous is almost hitting the defender in the breadbox or otherwise throwing easily interceptable balls.  The other team is allowed to make good plays from time to time.  It's not a sleight to the QB when they do.
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#64

(09-28-2022, 10:05 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote:
(09-28-2022, 05:44 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: I noticed this too. Trevor threw 3 or 4 late ossses that were dangerous

I wouldn't consider any of Trevor's throws this year to be dangerous except for the INT, but there is shared blame on that.  On the INT he was hit as he threw and the quick pressure was allowed by Cam who became a turnstile on that final drive.  I think Trevor for the vast majority of throws has been very smart and accurate with placement.  If you go back and watch the ones that were defensed it was because of great effort by the DB where they were laying out for the ball and just barely getting there.  To me, dangerous is almost hitting the defender in the breadbox or otherwise throwing easily interceptable balls.  The other team is allowed to make good plays from time to time.  It's not a sleight to the QB when they do.

To me he’s thrown several late passes that were dangerous.
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#65

(09-28-2022, 09:34 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote:
(09-28-2022, 08:56 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: If your franchise literally just broke the all time record for most money spent in free agency, you'd better hope you aren't going to follow that up with more big spending. 

Extensions/new contracts for our better talent approaching end of contract or massively outplaying their contract should be a priority.

As far as addressing needs on the roster through FA and the draft:
  •  we may need depth or competition at interior OL depending on how Bartch and Fortner finish the year I see them drafting a couple guys here. As far as T is concerned, Jawaan is going to need to be paid as well at this rate
  • we will likely go after an X receiver - will that be draft or FA? I'd say probably draft if only because of cost
  •  we have to add tight ends or re-sign Arnold, Engram and Manhertz - all are impending FAs. Engram will want to stay. If we can keep at least him and Arnold. If not, may need to draft one to save $$$ We also have Farrell who they seem to like as a developmental guy
  •  we have to add depth at safety , maybe competition too Rayshawn is likely gone so I see a high draft pick here
  • James Robinson needs a deal ASAP YES
  • Marvin Jones will likely be gone - do you pay a guy his age to keep continuity? Probably not Probably leaves. Age and capable player behind him in Tim Jones
  • Role players like Gotsis, Arden Key and Smoot are all set to depart unless paid This is where it gets rough. We have to keep hopefully 2/3
  • If they want that QB room intact they'll have to pay Beathard I have zero concerns here. I'd just draft a late rounder as a backup

Obviously, they still need to spend some money on some of this ^ but it will have to be a fraction of what they spent in 2022

Will be interesting to see who they let walk and who they pay to stay

Added some thoughts to your points.

I think Griffin, Jenkins, RRH are all gone. Plus some back end guys are likely out. Those 3 can free up the cap space for Allen and JRob.

Good stuff.

I think I'd try to keep RRH for his final contract year at 7mil. He is collapsing pockets from the inside and made one of the best guards in the league look weak in week 2. 

Jenkins - I'll reserve judgement till the end off the season, but he'll need to impress since his 2-year out clause would save the team money and he has struggled at times. Maybe he saves himself before the year is over. We'll see. 

Griffin is in the same boat. Williams could play opposite Campbell and the team could draft or sign a nickel if a developing guy can't step up. He's got to play well this season to stick around. He's been solid so far, but that secondary has had lots of help from the pass rush. 

I'm not tripping about the cap just yet. Lots of black magic can be conjured to work around it and the number may increase more than usual due to national inflation. We can't keep them all, but injuries and individual performances down the stretch may make decisions easier.
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#66

I also don't see the Jaguars signing any premium free agents next year.  They need to focus on resigning their own players.  I'm hoping the salary cap goes up significantly next year as I understand the Jaguars are pretty tight against it. 

Technically all of our defensive starters next year are under contract.  However, as stated, some important rotational players such as Smoot, Key and Gotsis are not.  It will also be interesting to see if Jenkins, Griffin or RRH are salary cap casualties.  My guess is yes for Jenkins.  Safety is not a premium position and can be pretty easily found in the draft.  I'm less sure on Griffin or RRH.

On offense, right tackle will be interesting.  It's great that Taylor is playing well, but he's also a free agent.  If he continues to play well, will the Jaguars pay him or will they go with Little who costs them little (no pun intended)?

As for tight end, I'm hoping they resign Engram.  He's a great security blanket for Trevor and I don't see the drop issue that has plagued him in the past.  I hope he's not too expensive and he wants to return so he can remain in Pederson's offense.  Manhertz's return wouldn't surprise me either.  I don't think he will be expensive and the team seems to like him as a blocking tight end.  My guess is Arnold leaves.  The team doesn't seem to utilize him much.  I think he'll want out and the team drafts a mid round tight end to serve as backup and develop for the future.

I do think they acquire an X wide receiver.  I think they do so in the draft, maybe in round one.  

I think they let Marvin Jones go.  The Jaguars have a tough salary cap position and resigning an aging player doesn't seem like the best use of it. 

Unless he significantly improves, I would definitely try to upgrade left guard in the draft and move Bartch to depth.  The great thing is that it is a position that often drops in the draft.  They can likely upgrade in the second or third round and maybe even later.  If the rookie needs time to develop, we can start Bartch temporarily and the draft pick can provide depth until he's ready.  With Fortner, right now, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and am assuming the rookie will show improvement.

James Robinson is a restricted free agent, so we can keep him if we want him and we do.  However, I would try to keep him happy and sign him to a four year deal.

It is finally a good time to be a Jaguars fan.....
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#67

WOW draft talk after the 3rd game ??

D has been playing really well.

One influencing factor is Time of possession. The first game was our lowest at 26 minutes, (close but lost) the last 2 we have had the ball a scandalous 38+ minutes. These short pass drives when executed well can do that for you. Last year we ranked 31st in the league with an average of 27 minutes.

A second one is the plan Trent and Doug came up with in the off season. Six of our starting 11 were not on this team last year. The 4 FA signings (5 if you count Key) all are having an impact. The rookies Lloyd and Muma were icing on the cake. I remember Baalkie's explanation on draft day when asked about the trade up then taking Muma. He said Doug and he decided they had an opportunity to make one side of the ball really good and they took it.

A third factor is the type of player they are targeting. They removed 10-12 players from the board. Now they re not going full clean Gene on us...
https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2013/4/23/...r-concerns

The last factor is you can see there is a multi year plan they are following. Sure it changes as opportunities arise like the 2022 draft. The change for us is prior to this there has not been this kind of plan. LOL
A new broom always sweeps clean.
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#68

(09-28-2022, 08:56 AM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(09-27-2022, 02:39 PM)NoShoes Wrote: I think our big FA days are over. Commit to resigning our own and build through draft.

Allen and Robinson need contracts. Taylor may get franchised if he continues.

Need to set aside cap space for Trevor too

If your franchise literally just broke the all time record for most money spent in free agency, you'd better hope you aren't going to follow that up with more big spending. 

Extensions/new contracts for our better talent approaching end of contract or massively outplaying their contract should be a priority.

As far as addressing needs on the roster through FA and the draft:
  •  we may need depth or competition at interior OL depending on how Bartch and Fortner finish the year
  • we will likely go after an X receiver - will that be draft or FA? 
  •  we have to add tight ends or re-sign Arnold, Engram and Manhertz - all are impending FAs
  •  we have to add depth at safety , maybe competition too
  • James Robinson needs a deal ASAP
  • Marvin Jones will likely be gone - do you pay a guy his age to keep continuity? Probably not
  • Role players like Gotsis, Arden Key and Smoot are all set to depart unless paid
  • If they want that QB room intact they'll have to pay Beathard

Obviously, they still need to spend some money on some of this ^ but it will have to be a fraction of what they spent in 2022

Will be interesting to see who they let walk and who they pay to stay

It's funny how much difference one year makes in the NFL. Following last season, it was hard to find more than a couple players that would be critical to keep. It looks like Pederson and Baalke will have no choice but to let some good players go. Things are likely to change a lot between now and the end of this season, however these are the decisions I'd make now for 2023:

1. Pay Josh Allen and James Robinson. It's hard to pay running backs, but hopefully a deal can be reached. The guy is definitely special and has earned a big increase in pay.

2. MJJ, Shaq Griffin and Rayshawn Jenkins should not be re-signed. Griffin is an amazing guy in the locker-room and community, but just an average corner being greatly overpaid. Jenkins has started this season playing great and it would hurt to let him go if he continues playing at his current pace. He simply makes too much for someone at the safety position unless they are Ed Reed.

3. Arden Key and Engram both got one year prove it deals. Engram has clearly proven that he can be a very effective tight end in Doug Pederson's offense. Unless he regresses, I'd do everything possible to keep him. Manhertz and Arnold have been ok, but the team can save some money by letting them go. As far as Arden Key goes, I see him signing a good deal with another team following this season. Smoot was an original Jaguar and has improved every year so he will remain on the team.

4. Robertson-Harris has been dominant so far and the team should try to keep him despite the hefty salary he will expect. 

5. Jawaan Taylor will be the toughest decision. He has been very good in pass protection so far. If he continues to shine, I believe the Jaguars won't be able to afford what other teams will offer him. There is no guarantee he'll play like this next season after he gets paid. Ideally, Walker Little will improve and allow the team to let Taylor go.

6. If the above moves are made, the draft will need to address the following positions in order of importance: Cornerback, safety, offensive line and X wide receiver. The receiver would have been top priority to begin this season, but the current group has far exceeded everyone's expectations. Tim Jones or Kendrick Pryor can replace MJJ, although his reliability will be missed.

7. Free agency should be pretty dull compared to previous seasons as the priority should be on paying Allen, Robinson, Engram and possibly Taylor or RRH. 

If Baalke is as successful with the 2023 draft class as he was this past draft the Jaguars should be set up to be a genuine playoff contender with the possibility of even winning 1 or 2 playoff games next year.
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#69

(09-28-2022, 11:27 PM)Jag149 Wrote: WOW draft talk after the 3rd game ??

D has been playing really well.

One influencing factor is Time of possession. The first game was our lowest at 26 minutes, (close but lost) the last 2 we have had the ball a scandalous 38+ minutes. These short pass drives when executed well can do that for you. Last year we ranked 31st in the league with an average of 27 minutes.

A second one is the plan Trent and Doug came up with in the off season. Six of our starting 11 were not on this team last year.  The 4 FA signings (5 if you count Key) all are having an impact.  The rookies Lloyd and Muma were icing on the cake. I remember Baalkie's explanation on draft day when asked about the trade up then taking Muma. He said Doug and he decided they had an opportunity  to make one side of the ball really good and they took it.

A third factor is the type of player they are targeting.  They removed 10-12 players from the board. Now they re not going full clean Gene on us...
https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2013/4/23/...r-concerns

The last factor is you can see there is a multi year plan they are following.  Sure it changes as opportunities arise like the 2022 draft.  The change for us is prior to this there has not been this kind of plan.  LOL

This is a much different type of draft talk than we used to have around here this time of year though lol
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#70

(09-29-2022, 08:35 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote:
(09-28-2022, 11:27 PM)Jag149 Wrote: WOW draft talk after the 3rd game ??

D has been playing really well.

One influencing factor is Time of possession. The first game was our lowest at 26 minutes, (close but lost) the last 2 we have had the ball a scandalous 38+ minutes. These short pass drives when executed well can do that for you. Last year we ranked 31st in the league with an average of 27 minutes.

A second one is the plan Trent and Doug came up with in the off season. Six of our starting 11 were not on this team last year.  The 4 FA signings (5 if you count Key) all are having an impact.  The rookies Lloyd and Muma were icing on the cake. I remember Baalkie's explanation on draft day when asked about the trade up then taking Muma. He said Doug and he decided they had an opportunity  to make one side of the ball really good and they took it.

A third factor is the type of player they are targeting.  They removed 10-12 players from the board. Now they re not going full clean Gene on us...
https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2013/4/23/...r-concerns

The last factor is you can see there is a multi year plan they are following.  Sure it changes as opportunities arise like the 2022 draft.  The change for us is prior to this there has not been this kind of plan.  LOL

This is a much different type of draft talk than we used to have around here this time of year though lol

Yea, I agree it is vastly different, like 180 degrees.  Just had to throw that in ... my bad.  LOL
A new broom always sweeps clean.
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#72

Jags #1 against the run. Pretty crazy…
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#73

The defense is good at shutting down the run. That was the goal during the off season. I know Allen and Walker are getting close, in particular, Allen, his pressures are pretty high. I just like one of these NT's needs to take that next step forward getting into this 2nd month of football and start enabling Allen and Walker to actually HIT home at the QB.
[Image: 4SXW6gC.png]

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."
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#74

(10-01-2022, 06:55 AM)Caldrac Wrote: The defense is good at shutting down the run. That was the goal during the off season. I know Allen and Walker are getting close, in particular, Allen, his pressures are pretty high. I just like one of these NT's needs to take that next step forward getting into this 2nd month of football and start enabling Allen and Walker to actually HIT home at the QB.

I’d like to see extra attention given to Allen and then have Walker go off one game.
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#75
(This post was last modified: 10-01-2022, 09:37 AM by Caldrac. Edited 2 times in total.)

(10-01-2022, 08:56 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote:
(10-01-2022, 06:55 AM)Caldrac Wrote: The defense is good at shutting down the run. That was the goal during the off season. I know Allen and Walker are getting close, in particular, Allen, his pressures are pretty high. I just like one of these NT's needs to take that next step forward getting into this 2nd month of football and start enabling Allen and Walker to actually HIT home at the QB.

I’d like to see extra attention given to Allen and then have Walker go off one game.

It's coming. Could be tomorrow. Need to kind of come up with a "trap" method in the pocket. Need Allen to squeeze Hurts up into the pocket or at least try to flush him out towards Walker and that's when Walker can actually use his finesse more and dial back his strength. 

He's quick. Tested off the charts at the combine. We know he can bulldoze his blockers but now I want to see his footwork. This game, the games against Baltimore, Kansas City & Denver are all going to test this aspect of Allen and Walker especially. Hurts, Jackson, Mahomes and Wilson are too damn good with their legs at times.
[Image: 4SXW6gC.png]

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."
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#76

Quote:Rank 3 - Foye Oluokun Jacksonville Jaguars · Year 5

[*]Tackling score: 94
[*]Coverage score: 62
[*]Pass rush score: 75
[*]OVERALL SCORE: 84

The reigning NFL tackles leader was one of several players to cash in with the Jaguars this offseason, signing a three-year, $45 million contract after a breakout year for the Falcons. Oluokun has kept up his production 2022, but his tackles have been even more impactful, with the 27-year-old recording a league-high 45 defensive stops (tackles resulting in a successful play for the defense). The Yale product has shown off improved range this season, generating 10 hustle stops through eight games (tied for third in the NFL), nearly matching last season’s total (11). If the best ability is availability, Oluokun has that in spades. He hasn’t missed a defensive snap since Week 12 of last season, playing 921 consecutive snaps. That active defensive ironman streak trails only Xavier McKinney (1,424) and C.J. Mosley (1,006). While his coverage abilities still have a lot of room for improvement, the fifth-year linebacker has brought some much-needed stability to the second level of Jacksonville's defense.
[*]
https://twitter.com/NFLGameDay/status/15...2584858624
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#77

Griffin, Chaisson and Gotsis are considered out in My Opinion BUT Jenkins may have a reprieve, he'll only be separated if the Jaguars need the cap space.

Time Will Tell.

NH3...
"AZANE"
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#78

(11-05-2022, 01:14 PM)NH3 Wrote: Griffin,  Chaisson and Gotsis are considered out in My Opinion BUT Jenkins may have a reprieve, he'll only be separated if the Jaguars need the cap space.

Time Will Tell.

NH3...

Gotsis is a cheap rotation player, can't see any reason to get rid of him. Griffin/Chaison can go for all I care.
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#79

You can already give Griffin’s number to somebody else. He won’t play another down for Jacksonville. I just don’t see how they can retain Jenkins unless he is a backup player that will run down under some kicks. Maybe I’m just too hard on the guy but other than the FF against the Colts I just haven’t seen anything out of him.

Big Ups to my guy Oluokon coming in ranked #3. Lloyd will be a year better in 2023. We need a pass rusher and a lock down CB. And some how find a safety to replace Jenkins. I’m still on the fence with Cisco. He’s just a guy at the moment.
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#80

Need a stud DT to stop Henry
You know you're dealing with a belief system when you get an emotional response. 
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