But Caldwell is an idiot. I mean, he didn't even resign Derek Cox? He must have no idea how to build a football team. Could you imagine Cox and Ball on the field at the same time? We would have the best secondary in the league, easily.

Hahahaha, That would have been great. If only Harry Colon was younger we could have had one hell of a secondary.

---

60% of the time, It works Everytime...



 

Blackmon and Ball have done fine as replacements, point is without gutting the secondary we could've focused on the lines.

 

Once again, the "gutting" that you're talking about involving Derek Cox didn't happen.  He wasn't coming back to Jacksonville.  Go back and read some of the reports.  The Jags extended an offer and his agent made it pretty clear they were exploring other options.  So, the team did attempt to retain him.  They just weren't going to overspend for his services based on first-hand knowledge about his injury history. 

 

You can retort with the usual "he signed a cheap deal with San Diego" all you want.  However, he could have countered whatever the Jaguars were offering.  He and his agent chose not to continue discussions, and they signed with the first team that put an offer on the table. 

 

That's not the fault of the Jaguars front office as you'd like to portray it.  He made the decision to go to San Diego, probably because he felt they were closer to being a playoff contending team than the Jaguars are.  There's nothing wrong with that.  But, let's not try to blame this front office for not keeping him here because that's really disingenuous. 

---

Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Once again, the "gutting" that you're talking about involving Derek Cox didn't happen.  He wasn't coming back to Jacksonville.  Go back and read some of the reports.  The Jags extended an offer and his agent made it pretty clear they were exploring other options.  So, the team did attempt to retain him.  They just weren't going to overspend for his services based on first-hand knowledge about his injury history. 

 

You can retort with the usual "he signed a cheap deal with San Diego" all you want.  However, he could have countered whatever the Jaguars were offering.  He and his agent chose not to continue discussions, and they signed with the first team that put an offer on the table. 

 

That's not the fault of the Jaguars front office as you'd like to portray it.  He made the decision to go to San Diego, probably because he felt they were closer to being a playoff contending team than the Jaguars are.  There's nothing wrong with that.  But, let's not try to blame this front office for not keeping him here because that's really disingenuous. 

 

Landry, Cox, Middleton, Mathis, Ross, Rutland all guys in the secondary we either cut or didn't resign. I'm fine with that but when you let go, release, or move on from 6 of 9 DB in one offseason you essentially gutted that position.

---

Landry, Cox, Middleton, Mathis, Ross, Rutland all guys in the secondary we either cut or didn't resign. I'm fine with that but when you let go, release, or move on from 6 of 9 DB in one offseason you essentially gutted that position.

Whether it was this year or in 2 years the position needed to be overhauled. Why not do it in a year where that position in deep in the nfl draft,

---

Whether it was this year or in 2 years the position needed to be overhauled. Why not do it in a year where that position in deep in the nfl draft,

 

big difference replacing 6 DB in one year vs 2 years. look it's working out I'm good with that, we found Blackmon at the last minute and he's been able to go from day one couldn't ask for anything more. Do I still think not resigning Cox was a bad move, yes, and no I don't buy the typical "he didn't want to come back" line, it's all about the $$$.

 

A bigger issue I have with Dave is how he handled the Monroe situation, hopefully we find a Blackmon type player to fill the whole on the line but that still leaves issues at G and C.

 

So far Dave has only treaded water, we haven't gotten better under him YET, down the road it's a possibility but as of right now half way into season 1 we're the same level of talent pretty much across the board.

---

he got benched again last week, after the long julius thomas td.  i remember him getting benched the start of his 2nd year and performed well afterwards.  hes the only one not finding as much success as our other FA and he was the most expensive one lol. hopefully he turns it around.

---

It's funny some people blasted Caldwell for not resigning him lol.

 

Didn't people say that before Caldwell drafted five defensive backs?

---

 

But Caldwell is an idiot. I mean, he didn't even resign Derek Cox? He must have no idea how to build a football team. Could you imagine Cox and Ball on the field at the same time? We would have the best secondary in the league, easily.

 


That is funny...I thought for a moment you were being serious!

---

Potroast and Daryl Smith are still the only players I miss from our defense.

 

I admit, I wanted us to retain Cox by any means, but that makes me glad I'm not the GM of this team.

---

THERE IS A SKELETON INSIDE OF YOU.

 

RIGHT NOW. THIS IS NOT A JOKE.

big difference replacing 6 DB in one year vs 2 years. look it's working out I'm good with that, we found Blackmon at the last minute and he's been able to go from day one couldn't ask for anything more. Do I still think not resigning Cox was a bad move, yes, and no I don't buy the typical "he didn't want to come back" line, it's all about the $$$.


A bigger issue I have with Dave is how he handled the Monroe situation, hopefully we find a Blackmon type player to fill the whole on the line but that still leaves issues at G and C.


So far Dave has only treaded water, we haven't gotten better under him YET, down the road it's a possibility but as of right now half way into season 1 we're the same level of talent pretty much across the board.

At this point, your opinion should be changing. Cox has been a huge disappointment this year. So much so he may not be a charger next year. Sometimes you just have to man up and say, well I got that one wrong.

---

At this point, your opinion should be changing. Cox has been a huge disappointment this year. So much so he may not be a charger next year. Sometimes you just have to man up and say, well I got that one wrong.

 

I've got no problem with that, if Cox has regressed then it was a good move by Caldwell. It doesn't change my thoughts on how we've started this rebuild, I have problems with the blow it up part of things. Like I said above attempting to replace 6 of 9 DB on the roster is crazy, especially when you already have problems at DE, OG, C, RT, LB to begin with.

 

I don't think this defense is any better then last years, and I don't see anyone we can build around, hopefully the rookies develop but that's a big if.

 

Bottom line we came into this year with needs all over the roster, we're coming out of this season with needs in those SAME exact positions across the board it makes this first year of a rebuild hard to swallow.

---

Derek Cox is literally one of the worst cornerbacks in football, his running mate Shareece Wright is also one of the worst.

---

Derek Cox is literally one of the worst cornerbacks in football, his running mate Shareece Wright is also one of the worst.

 

Ok, if you say so boss.....

---

Sounds like he is their Aaron Ross.

---

;

;

I've got no problem with that, if Cox has regressed then it was a good move by Caldwell. It doesn't change my thoughts on how we've started this rebuild, I have problems with the blow it up part of things. Like I said above attempting to replace 6 of 9 DB on the roster is crazy, especially when you already have problems at DE, OG, C, RT, LB to begin with.

 

I don't think this defense is any better then last years, and I don't see anyone we can build around, hopefully the rookies develop but that's a big if.

 

Bottom line we came into this year with needs all over the roster, we're coming out of this season with needs in those SAME exact positions across the board it makes this first year of a rebuild hard to swallow.

Gratz isn't a big if. He has played well. Alan Ball is 28 so certainly should have more years left. I think we are certainly better at DB then we were last year.


Sen'Derrick has played really well and is 26. That's another position we are getting much better play out of then we did last year. Defensively we still have a lot of holes, but the DB position arrow is pointing up and that is a position they gutted. That is a good thing. I think it is disingenuous to say we have no one to build around on defense. And you again are incorrect about having the same exact needs. We are in a better position today at DB then we were last year. So we don't have the same exact needs at that position as we had last year. We also had terrible play at DT last year. We have at least one guy playing at a high level this year. We still have to fill LB spot (and maybe two if Poz isn't back next year) and really need Cyprien to take the next step next year. Also DE is still an area of need but we didn't address that last year.

---

Gratz isn't a big if. He has played well. Alan Ball is 28 so certainly should have more years left. I think we are certainly better at DB then we were last year.


Sen'Derrick has played really well and is 26. That's another position we are getting much better play out of then we did last year. Defensively we still have a lot of holes, but the DB position arrow is pointing up and that is a position they gutted. That is a good thing. I think it is disingenuous to say we have no one to build around on defense. And you again are incorrect about having the same exact needs. We are in a better position today at DB then we were last year. So we don't have the same exact needs at that position as we had last year. We also had terrible play at DT last year. We have at least one guy playing at a high level this year. We still have to fill LB spot (and maybe two if Poz isn't back next year) and really need Cyprien to take the next step next year. Also DE is still an area of need but we didn't address that last year.

 

Allan Ball's not someone we're going to build around, Marks has filled in nicely but I don't expect him to be the center piece of any defensive unit? He's just a guy as they say. Last year we had one young CB in Cox and a stop gap players in Mathis/Ross we've essentially got the same things, a young guy in Gratz and older stop gap players in Ball/Blackmon. I'll admit I prefer Ball/Blackmon over Mathis/Ross all day but it doesn't change the need for another corner to build around going forward.

 

Every other position it's the same story, still have problems at QB (obviously nothing could be done about that last year), RT, OG, C, DE, OLB, and then naturally had needs develop at RB and TE.

 

My beef has always been gutting the secondary wasn't necessary, we had so many other issues to address.

---

 

My beef has always been gutting the secondary wasn't necessary, we had so many other issues to address.

 

I'm afraid I have to differ with you a bit on this one, EC85. 

 

I think you should consider that the secondary is the one component of Bradley's defensive scheme that most requires personnel well-suited to a particular style of play.   It's what sets his scheme apart from others the most.  It makes perfect sense that they would go out of their way to fill it with young players that fit the Bradley mold, IMO. Sure they had tons of other positions to address - but making the secondary a priority will have this defense looking a lot more like it's intended to look sooner rather than later.  

(not to mention that draft class was rich in DBs) 

 

Sure, Ball is no all-pro, but he's performing better than his salary would indicate and certainly better than Cox has been in SD.   Cox strikes me as a really talented kid who lacks self-motivation.  Remember when he was benched for a few games in his second or third year?  It wasn't because he just wasn't playing well. It was because he was phoning it in.  That personality trait may have removed him from consideration by the new regime with their competition mantra.   

 

Who knows how they will approach next season, but I think we've got a very good corner in Gratz, and a very good nickel in Blackmon.  (Harris has played well at nickel too and he obviously survived the gutting.)   Obviously the rookie safeties have to grow into their new shoes a bit - but I'm staring to see a little bit of progress there. I think they'll be ready by next season if not by the end of this one.  If that pans out - you are left with one corner spot to fill. They could have a slightly above average stop-gap with Ball - elevate McCray from special teams if he's ready or sign a better FA.  

 

I agree that it's hard to watch the interior O-line struggle and other positions continue to suffer - but they upgraded the secondary with more promising, younger players and they saved money doing it.  Keeping Mathis or Ross would have been madness IMO. They both played very, very poorly last year.  

 

I think the other positions you listed were not addressed partly due to lack of the right price and/or age of the free agent, or wrong value at their draft position.  Sorry for the long post - but I guess I like what's happening with the secondary even though it's a work in progress.  I hope we see other areas overhauled in similar fashion. 

---

I'm afraid I have to differ with you a bit on this one, EC85. 

 

I think you should consider that the secondary is the one component of Bradley's defensive scheme that most requires personnel well-suited to a particular style of play.   It's what sets his scheme apart from others the most.  It makes perfect sense that they would go out of their way to fill it with young players that fit the Bradley mold, IMO. Sure they had tons of other positions to address - but making the secondary a priority will have this defense looking a lot more like it's intended to look sooner rather than later.  

(not to mention that draft class was rich in DBs) 

 

Sure, Ball is no all-pro, but he's performing better than his salary would indicate and certainly better than Cox has been in SD.   Cox strikes me as a really talented kid who lacks self-motivation.  Remember when he was benched for a few games in his second or third year?  It wasn't because he just wasn't playing well. It was because he was phoning it in.  That personality trait may have removed him from consideration by the new regime with their competition mantra.   

 

Who knows how they will approach next season, but I think we've got a very good corner in Gratz, and a very good nickel in Blackmon.  (Harris has played well at nickel too and he obviously survived the gutting.)   Obviously the rookie safeties have to grow into their new shoes a bit - but I'm staring to see a little bit of progress there. I think they'll be ready by next season if not by the end of this one.  If that pans out - you are left with one corner spot to fill. They could have a slightly above average stop-gap with Ball - elevate McCray from special teams if he's ready or sign a better FA.  

 

I agree that it's hard to watch the interior O-line struggle and other positions continue to suffer - but they upgraded the secondary with more promising, younger players and they saved money doing it.  Keeping Mathis or Ross would have been madness IMO. They both played very, very poorly last year.  

 

I think the other positions you listed were not addressed partly due to lack of the right price and/or age of the free agent, or wrong value at their draft position.  Sorry for the long post - but I guess I like what's happening with the secondary even though it's a work in progress.  I hope we see other areas overhauled in similar fashion. 

 

Don't apologize great post man,

 

as for the scheme I've heard that before, and I understand in the long run it might work out, maybe this was the way to go. I agree there was no way we'd be ok with Mathis/Ross for another year, and Blackmon has been a huge surprise.

 

I'm just looking at the big picture, some would argue I'm missing the big picture, but my concern has been and still remains the same; Spending the first offseason of the rebuild on the secondary left us with some major areas of concern all across the roster. I'm giving them a chance to do their thing, I think with a solid offseason of training, some FA, and a good draft we can address most of these concerns. Heck 10 draft picks can quickly change a teams roster, if we find just 4 starters out of that class we're in good shape.

 

Obviously we've got to find the QB of the future, but in addition to that we have to do something about the RT (maybe Pasturz can be that guy), OG and C. At minimum we have to find someone to play next to Marks (DT can be had in the later rounds of the draft), and we have to find that pass rusher to give this secondary a chance.

---

Allan Ball's not someone we're going to build around, Marks has filled in nicely but I don't expect him to be the center piece of any defensive unit? He's just a guy as they say. Last year we had one young CB in Cox and a stop gap players in Mathis/Ross we've essentially got the same things, a young guy in Gratz and older stop gap players in Ball/Blackmon. I'll admit I prefer Ball/Blackmon over Mathis/Ross all day but it doesn't change the need for another corner to build around going forward.

 

Every other position it's the same story, still have problems at QB (obviously nothing could be done about that last year), RT, OG, C, DE, OLB, and then naturally had needs develop at RB and TE.

 

My beef has always been gutting the secondary wasn't necessary, we had so many other issues to address.

 

Well, reread your post.  You said we have the exact same needs as last year and that is not true. 

 

Every player does not have to be 24 in order for you to build around them.  Marks is young and isn't just a guy.  Just a guy doesn't dominate games.  He has.  Ball has played at a high level.  And we are 13th against the pass with no pass rush.  No matter how you slice it, that is pretty impressive and significantly better then last years unit.  

 

We will, IMO, be more aggressive in free agency this year and cover more ground at certain positions.  This was a year to gut and see what you have.  Next year I believe we will see more pieces put in place.  

 

It was necessary.  They were terrible last year.  And Cox has proven to be one of the best moves Caldwell has made (in not resigning him by over paying).  All you have to do is look at the results.  

---

Don't apologize great post man,

 

as for the scheme I've heard that before, and I understand in the long run it might work out, maybe this was the way to go. I agree there was no way we'd be ok with Mathis/Ross for another year, and Blackmon has been a huge surprise.

 

I'm just looking at the big picture, some would argue I'm missing the big picture, but my concern has been and still remains the same; Spending the first offseason of the rebuild on the secondary left us with some major areas of concern all across the roster. I'm giving them a chance to do their thing, I think with a solid offseason of training, some FA, and a good draft we can address most of these concerns. Heck 10 draft picks can quickly change a teams roster, if we find just 4 starters out of that class we're in good shape.

 

Obviously we've got to find the QB of the future, but in addition to that we have to do something about the RT (maybe Pasturz can be that guy), OG and C. At minimum we have to find someone to play next to Marks (DT can be had in the later rounds of the draft), and we have to find that pass rusher to give this secondary a chance.

 

???  You are doing the exact opposite.  

---