ok I asked what was thug culture, I got the response which I expected gansta rap...k fine...but "gangsta rap" peaked out late 80s early 90s, you said violent crime is still celebrated in the rap culture and pointed out smack. Smack and other battle leagues are insignificant, a big battle rap event may get half a million youtube views at best...where as a big generic rap song may get close to 100 million views by itself.


If thug culture is perpetuated by rap music which is the only explanation I got from the media and this thread, then why are violent crimes in general down, when rap itself has spread its wings into almost every form of media in the mainstream? Do some rappers have it in their songs, sure, but like I said even when you look at the end of year charts none of the songs that garnered a lot of radio play, or digital downloads are those songs.


You say thug culture and current events may have pushed them to kill these cops...which brings be back to my first question...well what is thug culture...to which the response is gangsta rap...to which my response would be "lol is this the 80's". Thug culture is about as real as the violent video game culture being responsible for every death in the 2000s or violent tv and movie culture being responsible or every death in the 90s, or gangsta rap culture being responsible for the woes of the 80s, or rock and roll before that.

I'm done with the conversation in the thread because it's being spun way, way too much. The simple fact is that rap music glorifies/portrays violence and crime way more than country music. You keep glossing over this for some reason, instead of calling out the ridiculousness in those claims by other posters.


Also, many Smack battles have over 2 million views, so "500,000 at most" is such an ignorant statement. Regardless, battle rap is part of the current rap culture. Even if you ignore battle rap, mainstream rap contains more violent crime lyrics than country. Not debatable.

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i am

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Man, you're forcing me to play a card I hate. One of my best long time friends is a black man. Yeah, I know, it's a cliche, but in this case it's true. We lived across the street from each other in Riverside from the late 80s through 2005. Not a ghetto, but not the nice part of Riverside, either.

 

We talked about "Cop Killer", the song most folks are talking about when they claim "all" gangsta rap glorifies violence against police. He explained to me how everyone he knew understood it wasn't advocating shooting cops, it was just sung as a first person's account of resentment over police brutality, a well documented problem in L.A. at the time. He just laughed it off as just another example of "white folks assuming black folks are too stupid to interpret art." As Ice-T once said, "If you think I'm a cop killer, you must also think David Bowie is an astronaut." Since that conversation I've reviewed some rap lyrics and found a lot of things about which I was offended, but very little advocacy of killing policemen.

 

Do you realize how popular gangster movies were decades ago, when Al Capone and Pretty Boy Floyd were characterized as heroes of the common man?

 

I held a lot of preconceptions about African-Americans before meeting him and his family that were disproven time and again. Maybe I don't know as much as you about other socioeconomic groups, but I know more than you might expect.

I totally agree with what you're saying, but for people to say gangsta rap doesn't influence people is irresponsible. And that's what some are trying to say.

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And your sources are?  i ask because you portray every aspect of what i have observed by those institutions in your postings.

 

My sources are, by and large, life experience.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

I totally agree with what you're saying, but for people to say gangsta rap doesn't influence people is irresponsible. And that's what some are trying to say.

 

I think it reflects their experience more than it influences it.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

I'm glossing over country because I never mentioned anything about country, in fact I've used the word country so little, that doing a board search, I found I've used the word once in a thread about gay marriage...so why would I attack your strawman.  Once again my point has been and continues to be, if rap being more popular now, and more accessible now in 2015, and it's fomenting this "thug culture" then why are violent crimes down as a total, why are police homicides down as a total, where is this "thug culture?"  

 

Ok smacks youtube has 642 videos, of which only 41 have over a million views we're talking. were talking .06 of all of their videos, of that .06 only, 11 of those 41 have a date of a year or shorter which is a way to measure interest in the videos because they gained a million views over 6-12 months rather than 4-5 years like the other videos in that 41...we're talking .017% of all of their videos garners enough interest to reach a million views in less than a year.  On average they're half a million a best (though actually doing the math it's 288,613, but we'll call it half a million to make it not seem so obscure.) This isn't a large swath of even hip hop fans much less the general population, the smack page over 6 years has views on par with a single Drake song...so once again these aren't even a large minority of hip hop listeners.    

 

Why would you attack that strawman? Huh? My entire premise of this discussion has been a rebuttal to jtmoney and rollerjag implying that country music has a history of being as violent as rap. That is absurd. You trying to spin the discussion does not mean me reverting back to my original premise is a strawman.

 

Regarding URL, you are moving the goalposts. Earlier, you said that URL battles get "500,000 at most". Considering URL has 41 battles with over 1 million views, I'd say you are being willfully ignorant in this discussion.

 

 

Anyways, back to my original premise and not a strawman: rap music has much more violent songs, both in volume and substance, than country. This is pretty much common sense for anyone looking at things objectively. If you wish to debate something else with someone else, go for it.

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done with

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A million views over 5 years is still 200k a year on average no matter how you call it, but I digress, smack is clearly the direction of hiphop, Most people can name multiple actual songs from smack rappers, because they dominate the airwaves and downloads, even youtube vids.  

 

I've said before on the 2ndish page that I don't think anybody is even denying that there is violence in rap, but it's not 1980-1990, not everyone is claiming they're moving 200 bricks of coke a day, not everyone is claiming they've "caught" a 100 bodies, not everyone is saying to go out and kill a bunch of people.  

 

Talk about strawman......... I never said anything of the sort about URL. I even said that if you take out URL, there are still hundreds of mainstreamrap songs in the past 5 years the glorify violence way more than "Redneck Crazy" does. You're the one being willfully ignorant and saying completely false things like "URL battles get 500,000 views at most". You won't even admit to being wrong about that, which tells me how little respect you deserve is a discussion among adults.

 

Yes, it's not 1980-1990 anymore, so please go back and call out any poster citing Eric Clapton, Bob Marley, David Allen Coe, etc. Citing those guys is okay but citing 90s rap artists is blasphemous?

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this thread

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I was wrong

 

Yes, you were.

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i will

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Agreed, smack is the New York Yankees of hip hop in terms of popularity. 

 

1. Quit a discussion and then come running back like a middle school girl. :teehee:

2. No one said anything of the sort.

3. You, on the other hand, said "Smack gets 500,000 views at most".

Loaded Lux vs Calicoe 2 years ago.... 4,150,000 views

Tsu Surf vs Hitman Holla 6 months ago.... 2,200,000 views

39 other battles with over 1,000,000 views. 115 total battles over 500,000. "500,000 at most"....lol.

 

4. Why can Eric Clapton, Bob Marley, and David Allen Coe be cited but not 90s rappers? 3rd time asking this without a response from you. I'm not surprised.

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live on

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Because I mentioned Clapton, Marley, and whoever that last person is, hell why isn't Bach cited. 

 

Now you just aren't making sense. I suggest going back and getting your GED before you try to have an educated discussion with someone one here again. Goodnight.

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through everyone

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I'm not making sense because I'm not attacking your strawmen...k  Why would I mention any of those people when I never even said anything negative about them to begin with.

 

"Why would you attack that strawman? Huh? My entire premise of this discussion has been a rebuttal to jtmoney and rollerjag implying that country music has a history of being as violent as rap. That is absurd. You trying to spin the discussion does not mean me reverting back to my original premise is a strawman."

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that quoted

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The first post I even replied of yours makes no mention of country or anything else but rap, in fact even the post you replied to in that post makes no mention of country or rock.  

 

<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"Yup. I'm a huge rap fan and violent crime is still very celebrated in the culture.The Smack/URL scene is known for being primarily about "gun bars". Anyone who denies that is simply wrong."

<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;"> 

<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">derp derp thats the only reason why I have even been mentioning smack...derp derp.  

 

I know it's hard for you to do, but go back and read what was being discussed/debated when I brought up Smack. It was country vs rap. You entered that discussion and tried to spin it into something else. Then, when I reverted back to country vs rap, you call it a strawman. Pretty terrible use of logic on your end.

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me gg 

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Because in today's society, more people can familiarize with Tupac and not Tony Soprano..

I guess only thugs out there living thug life are gangsta rappers and the mob.

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