Jaguars vs. Colts


I thought I would start with the consensus Division top dog….


 

I need someone to compare position by position for us.  This will give us (me) a fair look at the Jaguars roster compared to another team.


For example:  Bortles vs. Luck = Luck


But what about Yeldon vs Gore?  Robinson vs Johnson?  You get the idea.


 

How does our lineup compare to the Colts?


 

Keep in mind, 4-3 vs 3-4 is tough to match up, but do your best.


The projected lineup came from Todayspigskin.com, because it’s the first one I found, and this is supposed to be simple, fun and more importantly, fill the void we are in.  


 

http://www.todayspigskin.com/afc-today/a...lis-colts/


 

QB          Blake Bortles                     QB          Andrew Luck


RB           T.J. Yeldon                       RB           Frank Gore


WR         Allen Robinson                  WR         Andre Johnson


WR         Marqise Lee                      WR         T.Y. Hilton


TE           Julius Thomas                  TE           Dwayne Allen


TE           Marcedes Lewis               TE           Coby Fleener


LT            Luke Joeckel                    LT            Anthony Castonzo


LG           Zane Beadles                   G:           Jack Mewhort


C             Stefen Wisniewski             C:            Jonotthan Harrison


RG          Brandon Linder                 G:           Todd Herremans


RT           Jeremy Parnell                 RT           Gosder Cherilus


                                                               

DE           Tyson Alualu                    DE:         Arthur Jones


DT           Jared Odrick                    NT:         Josh Chapman


DT           Sen’Derrick Marks           DE:         Kendall Langford


DE           Chris Clemons                 OLB        Trent Cole


OLB        Dan Skuta                        ILB          D’Qwell Jackson


MLB       Paul Posluszny                 ILB          Jerrell Freeman


OLB        Telvin Smith                     OLB        Robert Mathis


CB           Demetrius McCray          CB:         Vontae Davis


SS           Jonathan Cyprien            SS:          Mike Adams


FS           Josh Evans                      FS:          Dwight Lowery


CB           Dwayne Gratz                 CB:         Greg Toler

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I don't believe Alualu, Evans, or Gratz will be starters this year.

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"Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes. That way, if he gets angry, he's a mile away and barefoot."

Odrick will start at end over Alualu and Miller was start at DT

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Andrew Luck >>>Blake Bortles

 

The rest is just background noise.

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Andrew Luck >>>Blake Bortles

 

The rest is just background noise.

 

I tried to make this case: There is not much of a difference it terms of roster between the two teams when comparing the 2012 Colts to the 2014 Jaguars. When Luck was a rookie, he played with Reggie Wayne, and had Robert Mathis on defense -- but aside from those two potential HOF players, the rest of the team was very much in flux. The O-line was horrible, leading to Luck being the most hit QB. The running backs were Donald Brown and Vick Ballard. The receivers (aside from Wayne) consisted of rookies T.Y. Hilton, Lavon Brazill, and Griff Whalen. Donnie Avery was a veteran FA addition. The TE's Dwayne Allen and Coby Fleener were rookies. That team very much resembled the 2014 Jaguars. A lot of young potential talent. The overall defensive ranking was at 20th or below.

 

The difference was that Luck was able to rise above all of those challenges and lead a somewhat talent-less Colts team to the playoffs. Some may point to Bruce Arians as a big difference but let me point out that Roethlisberger was beaten to hell because of Arian's down-field passing system and Arians was released by Pittsburgh because of it. As mentioned earlier, Luck was hit a lot because of poor O-line play and Arian's system. Luck was beaten to hell, and in Arizona, so was Palmer (injured), and Drew Stanton (injured).

 

All this is to say that despite all of the criticism Luck receives, he may not get enough credit for all the good that he has done. Imagine if Bortles led the Jaguars to an 11-5 season. Bortles has faced many of the same obstacles his rookie year.

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Andrew Luck is a couple of retirements away from being the best QB in the NFL. There's no competition there.

 

If I had to build a starting lineup out of the players you gave me there (with a couple of additions for guys who should be on that list but aren't), it'd look like this:

 

QB - Luck

RB - Yeldon

WR - Robinson

WR - Hilton

TE - Thomas

TE - Fleener

LT - Castonzo

LG - Mewhort

C - Wisniewski

RG - Linder

RT - Cherilus

 

LE - Odrick (will start over Alualu)

DT - Marks

DT - A. Jones (moved inside from end; Colts play a 3-4)

RE - Clemons

LOLB - Cole

MLB - Jackson

OLB - T. Smith

CB - V. Davis

SS - Cyprien

FS - S. Brown (will start over Evans)

CB - Colvin (will start over Gratz and McCray)

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McCray was the lone long term productive starter in 2014. I do see Colvin as the Nickel Back and pushing for that starter's positions but it won't be McCray's position...

 

IJS...

 

NH3...

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"AZANE"

Neither will be...

 

NH3...

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"AZANE"

Here is my attempt on offense

luck

hilton

AR15

montcrief

thomas

castonzo

Beadle

Wiz

Linder

Parnell

(Yes the whole jags o line plus Anthony)


Defense I'd run a 3-4 of

Odrick miller/jones marks on the line

Telvin and Cole as OLB, POZ and Jackson IILB

Davis and McCray outside, Covington nickel

lowery and Adams at safety with cyp as a backup on both.


Colts probably have the advantage in all 3 ST spots but at P/K it's a tossup.

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Bryan Anger > Entire Colts Roster

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"It was Blake Bortles the whole time. They believe in this kid. He reminds me a bit of a young Ben Roethlisberger." ~Mike Mayock

I tried to make this case: There is not much of a difference it terms of roster between the two teams when comparing the 2012 Colts to the 2014 Jaguars. When Luck was a rookie, he played with Reggie Wayne, and had Robert Mathis on defense -- but aside from those two potential HOF players, the rest of the team was very much in flux. The O-line was horrible, leading to Luck being the most hit QB. The running backs were Donald Brown and Vick Ballard. The receivers (aside from Wayne) consisted of rookies T.Y. Hilton, Lavon Brazill, and Griff Whalen. Donnie Avery was a veteran FA addition. The TE's Dwayne Allen and Coby Fleener were rookies. That team very much resembled the 2014 Jaguars. A lot of young potential talent. The overall defensive ranking was at 20th or below.

 

The difference was that Luck was able to rise above all of those challenges and lead a somewhat talent-less Colts team to the playoffs. Some may point to Bruce Arians as a big difference but let me point out that Roethlisberger was beaten to hell because of Arian's down-field passing system and Arians was released by Pittsburgh because of it. As mentioned earlier, Luck was hit a lot because of poor O-line play and Arian's system. Luck was beaten to hell, and in Arizona, so was Palmer (injured), and Drew Stanton (injured).

 

All this is to say that despite all of the criticism Luck receives, he may not get enough credit for all the good that he has done. Imagine if Bortles led the Jaguars to an 11-5 season. Bortles has faced many of the same obstacles his rookie year.

 

I agree about Luck being the reason for the success of the colts, because their roster isn't significantly better than the Jaguars. Vontae Davis is a decent corner, Ty Hilton is a decent WR, and Mathis is still a decent pass rusher, but without Luck none of them would be having the success they do.

 

Mathis wouldn't be as successful as a pass rusher if the colts weren't playing from ahead.

Davis wouldn't have as many chances at INTs if the colts pass rush weren't able to just rush the passer.

Ty Hilton would be a good player, but not nearly the statistical wonder he's been without a top tier QB throwing him the ball.

 

Of course the biggest advantage to Luck and the colts so far is that the rest of the division spent the last 5+ years like a headless chicken doing a dreadful job at talent acquisition.

 

If the texans had been smart enough to take Russell Wilson or Bortles that story could be changing right now, as the rest of their roster is good enough to compete with the colts if they had a QB, but as of right now the colts still have no realistic challengers unless the Jaguars step up this season.

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So what I'm hearing (or want to hear) is that on paper in July….the 2015 roster looks competitive.  QB being the major difference at this time, but for the rest of the positions, perhaps even Advantage Jaguars.


I'm not sure we would have said the same thing in 2014, 2013,…

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So what I'm hearing (or want to hear) is that on paper in July….the 2015 roster looks competitive.  QB being the major difference at this time, but for the rest of the positions, perhaps even Advantage Jaguars.


I'm not sure we would have said the same thing in 2014, 2013,…

 

You're overstating the "competitiveness" of the roster, right now it has some promise, but it's not at a point where it can be seen as competitive on its own. You can't count on having an elite QB like Luck to carry a team, and that's really what everyone is saying, an elite QB carries a team. If Bortles breaks out and turns into a true elite QB that can carry the team then the Jaguars have a legit shot at getting blown out by the pats in the playoffs just like the colts did.

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I'm not sure I'm overstating anything.  I'm simply trying to determine if the Jaguars roster is comparable to that of any other NFL team.


It is difficult to not be bias. So by looking at position groups and comparing to other teams, I can (hope to) get a more realistic view of our roster.


I'm not trying to determine wins or pro bowls.


 

From the limited feedback we have seen, it appears (again on paper and in July) that the Jaguars have a roster that looks similar to that of the colts.  Better at some positions not better at others.


Also Again…I'm not sure we would have said that in 2013 or 2014.


It’s obvious that some positions have a much greater impact on the overall performance of a team,  i.e. Quarterback.  But that wasn’t my point.


 

That said, let’s compare rosters to a middle of the pack team.  Miami went 8-8 last year.  We would have been thrilled at 8-8. BTW we play the in week 2. At Home  :yes:
 

How do we compare to this projected roster (from
http://www.todayspig.com)



 

QB: Ryan Tannehill


RB: Lamar Miller


WR: DeVante Parker


WR: Jarvis Landry


WR: Kenny Stills


TE: Jordan Cameron


LT: Branden Albert


LG: Jamil Douglas


C: Mike Pouncey


RG: Billy Turner


RT: Ja’Wuan James


 

 

DE: Cameron Wake


DT: Ndamukong Suh


DT: Earl Mitchell


DE: Olivier Vernon


SLB: Chris McCain


MLB: Koa Misi


WLB: Jelani Jenkins


CB: Brent Grimes


CB: Jamar Taylor


S: Louis Delmas


S: Reshad Jones

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DE           Tyson Alualu                    DE:         Arthur Jones


DT           Jared Odrick                    NT:         Josh Chapman


DT           Sen’Derrick Marks           DE:         Kendall Langford


DE           Chris Clemons                 OLB        Trent Cole


OLB        Dan Skuta                        ILB          D’Qwell Jackson


MLB       Paul Posluszny                 ILB          Jerrell Freeman


OLB        Telvin Smith                     OLB        Robert Mathis


CB           Demetrius McCray          CB:         Vontae Davis


SS           Jonathan Cyprien            SS:          Mike Adams


FS           Josh Evans                      FS:          Dwight Lowery


CB           Dwayne Gratz                 CB:         Greg Toler

 

One thing that stands out is how old the Colts defense is. Alot of starters over the age of 30. Old and slow is not a good thing in the modern NFL.

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