Thats fine if YOU dont. But I dont like the idea of hiring another Gus who was a highly touted DC that never lived up to expectations. Sure, Shanahan, McDaniels, Patricia, etc. Could end up being a good HC, but theres a chance they dont.


We know what Mike Smith and Tom Coughlin bring to a team.

Theres a chance Coughlin and Smith dont end up being good for the team either. Im not saying theyre bad options, i actually think theyre both pretty good options. i just think the desire for them versus any of these coordinators comes from an archaic idea of what a football coach is and not actually what they all do and dont do well. The arguments against the entire idea of a first time coach is all projecting stuff gus didnt do well onto them which is kinda poor imo, it should just be about what they have shown thus far to do well and poorly as coordinators.

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Easily. It will never make any sense to me that people think they know who will be fired before those men are fired unless their employers have already announced it before the last game. Everyone thought Chuck Pagano was on his way out and many people also expected Jeff Fisher to be fired the same year. Lovie Smith's termination shocked everyone. Rumors swirled about Jim Caldwell losing his job, but he was retained. Marty Schottenheimer was fired after a 14-2 season and Steve Mariucci was fired after taking San Francisco to the playoffs. Speculating who will or won't be fired on January 2 before January 2 is a waste of time for me.

 

Mike Smith and Tom Coughlin are not currently head coaches, so they wouldn't have to be fired if you wanted either one, and there are a lot of coordinators being mentioned. Is there some head coach you think might be fired that you want instead? Is that why you are waiting to express an opinion? You can't express an opinion on the names being mentioned here because someone (e.g. Marvin Lewis) might be fired?


 

If your contention is that any coach could be fired, then let me be the first to say that if the Patriots fire Bill Belichick, I really really want the Jags to hire him.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Thats fine if YOU dont. But I dont like the idea of hiring another Gus who was a highly touted DC that never lived up to expectations. Sure, Shanahan, McDaniels, Patricia, etc. Could end up being a good HC, but theres a chance they dont.


We know what Mike Smith and Tom Coughlin bring to a team.

 

 

Mediocrity.

 

Tom Coughlin won two Superbowls. Mike Smith was named coach of the year and made the playoff four out of seven years. He even won a playoff game, which puts him ahead of Marvin Lewis. Who do you see as available (or likely available) that has a record better than their "mediocrity."

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Mediocrity.

2008-2012 with multiple double digit wins and at worst a 9 win season with little talent on defense?


Sign me up for mediocrity I guess.


As for Coughlin, you know better than that...if not then theres not much else to say to you.


We havent had a winning season since what, 2007? Top 5 in draft last 5 seasons and on pace to be top 3 this season. Weve been [BLEEP] and worse than mediocrity for a decade.

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Yeah, coach of the year in 2008. Mike Smith is the definition of mediocrity I tell ya!

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Theres a chance Coughlin and Smith dont end up being good for the team either. Im not saying theyre bad options, i actually think theyre both pretty good options. i just think the desire for them versus any of these coordinators comes from an archaic idea of what a football coach is and not actually what they all do and dont do well. The arguments against the entire idea of a first time coach is all projecting stuff gus didnt do well onto them which is kinda poor imo, it should just be about what they have shown thus far to do well and poorly as coordinators.

No one knows for a fact these guys will work out sure. But I sure as hell like my chances a lot more if wr get a guy who has proven it before than a coordinator who has never been a head coach or flamed out in a big way before (McDaniels).

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People would/did say the same thing about Lovie Smith too. Tons of wins, lots of playoff appearances, a super bowl appearance with friggin REX GROSSMAN as his QB. 

 

Run out of town after one terrible year in Tampa Bay. The experienced, proven retread is no guarantee either.  

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Yeah, coach of the year in 2008. Mike Smith is the definition of mediocrity I tell ya!

Love Smith, coach of the year in 2005. Disaster in Tampa Bay and fired after one season. 

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No one knows for a fact these guys will work out sure. But I sure as hell like my chances a lot more if we get a guy who has proven it before than a coordinator who has never been a head coach or flamed out in a big way before (McDaniels).

 

Good coaches can flame out when they are hired by the wrong teams, but I don't want McDaniels either. He is made to just be an OC.

 

I know Mike Smith is a defensive guy, but his success in Atlanta makes him a better candidate than any offensive assistant who is likely to be available.

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Love Smith, coach of the year in 2005. Disaster in Tampa Bay and fired after one season. 

 

Two seasons. Everybody was shocked when the Buccaneers fired him.

 

Mike Smith was far more than Coach of the Year in Atlanta.

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Love Smith, coach of the year in 2005. Disaster in Tampa Bay and fired after one season.

Lovie Smith has run a defense that has shown little success for a ling time and never adapted and is now out of the NFL.


Mike Smith was a tremendous DC in JAX fot several years, had 5 straight winning seasons with great success right after thr whole Mike Vick debacle in ATL showing he can get his team to focus and not worry about outside problems. Now hes in TB where theyve been [BLEEP] on defense for several years and now is looking like. A top 5 unit and a large part in their current success.


Sorry, but I dont see the same thing here at all unless we're just looking at the coach of the year and playoff appearences aspect. As a coach Mike Smith is without a doubt in another league.

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Mike Smith and Tom Coughlin are not currently head coaches, so they wouldn't have to be fired if you wanted either one, and there are a lot of coordinators being mentioned. Is there some head coach you think might be fired that you want instead? Is that why you are waiting to express an opinion? You can't express an opinion on the names being mentioned here because someone (e.g. Marvin Lewis) might be fired?


 

If your contention is that any coach could be fired, then let me be the first to say that if the Patriots fire Bill Belichick, I really really want the Jags to hire him.

 

No, I don't think any coach can get fired. I was just saying nobody knows which current head coaches will be available. Remember the Mike McCarthy thread? I posted in it if for some reason he loses his job, the Jaguars should interview him. That rumor did not last long because Green Bay started looking like a playoff team again. Now it would be a huge shocker, but is still possible if Green Bay misses the playoffs. One name that came up this season is John Fox, who led both the Panthers and Broncos to Super Bowls, which is impressive even though both teams lost.

 

I already stated my opinion about Tom Coughlin and Mike Smith. Their resumes show they are the most qualified candidates at this time. D6 can say all he wants about Teryl Austin and Jim Bob Cooter, but they have never been head coaches. Same goes for Matt Patricia. Josh McDaniels busted out of Denver in less than two years and has not been a head coach since then. We failed with a rookie. Does it make sense to replace him with another rookie? So far Mike Smith is the only coordinator being discussed who has multiple playoff appearances as a head coach.

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Tom Coughlin won two Superbowls. Mike Smith was named coach of the year and made the playoff four out of seven years. He even won a playoff game, which puts him ahead of Marvin Lewis. Who do you see as available (or likely available) that has a record better than their "mediocrity."

 

 

I want a young, up and coming Coordinator (preferably on the offensive side,) who has proven their worth in their former positions, but someone who won't bring in some gimmicky schemes. I want a coach who will bring some youth, yet hold the players accountable when they make mistakes. No more "rah rah" guys who candy coat pathetic performances. I don't want some old re-tread who had success many years ago, but faltered down the stretch. Taking a former head coach is like choosing a so-so veteran free agent player over an unproven 1st round pick with tons of potential. I'll take the rookie every time.

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I want a young, up and coming Coordinator
(preferably on the offensive side,) who has proven their worth in their former positions, but someone who won't bring in some gimmicky schemes. I want a coach who will bring some youth, yet hold the players accountable when they make mistakes. No more "rah rah" guys who candy coat pathetic performances. I don't want some old re-tread who had success many years ago, but faltered down the stretch. Taking a former head coach is like choosing a so-so veteran free agent player over an unproven 1st round pick with tons of potential. I'll take the rookie every time.

 

So you would rather have a guy from Detroit who just came off a division title in his only winning season as a coordinator and is younger (32) than some of the players? I want to make sure my next head coach can control 53 grown-up men.

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I want a young, up and coming Coordinator (preferably on the offensive side,) who has proven their worth in their former positions, but someone who won't bring in some gimmicky schemes. I want a coach who will bring some youth, yet hold the players accountable when they make mistakes. No more "rah rah" guys who candy coat pathetic performances. I don't want some old re-tread who had success many years ago, but faltered down the stretch. Taking a former head coach is like choosing a so-so veteran free agent player over an unproven 1st round pick with tons of potential. I'll take the rookie every time.

im fine with most of this but that comparison is pretty terrible.

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So you would rather have a guy from Detroit who just came off a division title in his only winning season as a coordinator and is younger (32) than some of the players? I want to make sure my next head coach can control 53 grown-up men.

At 32 hes older than everyone that is starting besides mercedes(i dont even know how old mercedes is actually) and most of the rest of the roster.


And he doesnt need to be really old to "control" guys he just needs to have a plan in place that guys will believe in and cultivate their talents with.

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I am not stumping for Cooter personally. I like him but I think it's a bit too early.

 

If we couldn't get Shanahan or maybe Patricia and McDermott then I would probably want the experienced/second chance dude. 

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The head coach needs to understand how the entire organization works as a team. He doesn't need to know what play to call on 3rd and 7, or what defense to call on the 15 yard line down by 6 points in the 4th quarter. That's up to his assistants.

 

He needs to organize a team. Motivate the players, instruct the assistants, game plan, find the weaknesses in the opponent, the strengths in his own team, operate the machine during the game.

 

I'm good with Mike Smith, he's been to the Championship game, far more than we've been in 16 years. You don't get there by luck.

 

Regards..................the Chiefjag

 

That's correct.   The head coaching job is to make the whole thing work, and if it's not working, to be smart enough and experienced enough to figure out why it's not working.  

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McDaniels only successes have come with Tom Brady as his QB.  I'm not sure how anyone can specifically separate and identify his successes there.  You can clearly identify that he was a failure in Denver though.  I'd be very leery about a McDaniels hire.  

One more thing is obvious, too.  He has only succeeded under Bellichek and with Brady. No, thank you to another NE coordinator.

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Fix the O-Line!

Love Smith, coach of the year in 2005. Disaster in Tampa Bay and fired after one season.

Tampa saw what would happen to their shiny new QB if the kept him under the overmatched defensive minded head coach. There's a real parallel to what happened here and we are the bad case example.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato