This will almost certainly be his last year in a Jags jersey unless Jags part ways with Jackson or Calais so let's hope he goes insane this season.

Nvm he has an option, forgot about that.

---

He had tons of speeding tickets. Was arrested in 2016 for assaulting an officer/resisting arrest at the Miami beach. Had the incident with the two ladies (not a crime but you wouldn't see Calais Campbell in that kind of situation) and had the incident where he assaulted the man.    

By all accounts he is maturing and guys like Calais will only help him grow but yeah that off the field stuff is not good at all. It's not holier than thou to say that either.

Sure it is. Obviously wasn't that much of a big deal to the NFL because he wasn't suspended for any of the above situations. Tons of speeding tickets? Whoooooaaaaaaa man. Whooooooaaaaaa. We've got a bad apple there. And how do you know about that regarding Calais Campbell? Just because he hasn't been busted or caught doesn't mean he's some type of Saint... that's a terrible assumption. Marvin Harrison was considered a silent saint during his career with the clots and he was linked to a shooting outside a bar in Philadelphia at one point during or post his career. 

Ray Lewis was linked to a double murder yet it's rarely mentioned today and other than that incident he was considered a decent player on and off the field. Same can be said for Jimmy Smith here in Jacksonville where he had maybe one or two run ins with being busted for cocaine yet he had been doing it during his career for apparently a long time. 

And it is holier than thou to make such claims because I can assure you not all of us are perfect or saints around here and it's easier to crucify somebody at a young age that probably sees more money up front in ONE day compared to what some of us will be lucky to see in ONE lifetime. You also compared him to Campbell. A guy that's over 30 now to a kid, whose not even 24 and had all of those issues occur two years ago when he was barely old enough to drink. Poor comparison. And I am not absolving Dante from being a bonehead with a few spotty decisions here and there. But people act like he's been suspended for multiple games by the NFL and he's some headcase like Justin Blackmon or that dirt bag at DE that got another chance in Dallas....

If he doesn't have a perfectly innocent off season, I would not pay him on a long term deal. That doesn't mean he won't become a better person, but it would certainly be a gamble to give someone with such little self-control so much money.

Per article: https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf...491824001/

According to a police spokesperson, Fowler was driving through an apartment complex in his hometown, “when a man walking in the complex made a comment about Fowler's driving.”
Fowler then allegedly got out of the car, exchanged words with the man and struck him, knocking off his glasses. Fowler allegedly stepped on them.
“He then took the victim's grocery bag, with recently purchased liquor, and threw it in a lake,” according to the spokesperson.
Police arrested Fowler without incident and, according to a complaint / arrest affidavit, the victim did not claim any injuries. An independent witness observed and corroborated the victim’s account, according to the affidavit.

That is some childish [BLEEP], not excited to hand someone that sensitive 5 years 60 million.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27242...icket-stop

https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2017/7/19/...-20-months

http://www.tmz.com/2016/02/24/dante-fowl...ght-video/

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27287...uly-arrest

If he has another off season like the last two, good riddance!

---

I’d consider his personal problems more troublesome and immature than serious concerns. 

I think he’s still getting better and whether his actual sacks go up or down or whatever, he’ll be a good player. Hopefully for us for a few more seasons.

---

Williams over Fowler any day still.

---

He had tons of speeding tickets. Was arrested in 2016 for assaulting an officer/resisting arrest at the Miami beach. Had the incident with the two ladies (not a crime but you wouldn't see Calais Campbell in that kind of situation) and had the incident where he assaulted the man.    

By all accounts he is maturing and guys like Calais will only help him grow but yeah that off the field stuff is not good at all. It's not holier than thou to say that either.

Sure it is. Obviously wasn't that much of a big deal to the NFL because he wasn't suspended for any of the above situations. Tons of speeding tickets? Whoooooaaaaaaa man. Whooooooaaaaaa. We've got a bad apple there. And how do you know about that regarding Calais Campbell? Just because he hasn't been busted or caught doesn't mean he's some type of Saint... that's a terrible assumption. Marvin Harrison was considered a silent saint during his career with the clots and he was linked to a shooting outside a bar in Philadelphia at one point during or post his career. 

Ray Lewis was linked to a double murder yet it's rarely mentioned today and other than that incident he was considered a decent player on and off the field. Same can be said for Jimmy Smith here in Jacksonville where he had maybe one or two run ins with being busted for cocaine yet he had been doing it during his career for apparently a long time. 

And it is holier than thou to make such claims because I can assure you not all of us are perfect or saints around here and it's easier to crucify somebody at a young age that probably sees more money up front in ONE day compared to what some of us will be lucky to see in ONE lifetime. You also compared him to Campbell. A guy that's over 30 now to a kid, whose not even 24 and had all of those issues occur two years ago when he was barely old enough to drink. Poor comparison. And I am not absolving Dante from being a bonehead with a few spotty decisions here and there. But people act like he's been suspended for multiple games by the NFL and he's some headcase like Justin Blackmon or that dirt bag at DE that got another chance in Dallas....

Holy moly. You need to relax a little bit. No idea how you took all of this from me saying his off the field stuff is "not good at all".    

You are the only one here bringing up murderers. Nobody is crucifying him. Nobody is saying he's some kind of scumbag. Simply that there are off the field issues.  

Don't take someone saying he has off the field concerns as as a huge character assassination. It's not. It's not holier than thou to comment on a players off the field history either. Calling a guy like Blackmon (who unfortunately was a terrible alcoholic) a head-case does sound holier than thou to me though. 

By all accounts he's a great personality and really worked his [BLEEP] off this offseason/season. As another poster said his issues are more to do with maturity and poor judgement than anything else.

And the Calais comparison was simply to do with the nature of the incident with the two ladies. It wasn't illegal. It wasn't even that "bad". It's just some people have a habit of getting in poor situations. Calais would be an example of a guy I'd consider to be pretty good at avoiding "poor situations" for himself.

---

Sure it is. Obviously wasn't that much of a big deal to the NFL because he wasn't suspended for any of the above situations. Tons of speeding tickets? Whoooooaaaaaaa man. Whooooooaaaaaa. We've got a bad apple there. And how do you know about that regarding Calais Campbell? Just because he hasn't been busted or caught doesn't mean he's some type of Saint... that's a terrible assumption. Marvin Harrison was considered a silent saint during his career with the clots and he was linked to a shooting outside a bar in Philadelphia at one point during or post his career. 

Ray Lewis was linked to a double murder yet it's rarely mentioned today and other than that incident he was considered a decent player on and off the field. Same can be said for Jimmy Smith here in Jacksonville where he had maybe one or two run ins with being busted for cocaine yet he had been doing it during his career for apparently a long time. 

And it is holier than thou to make such claims because I can assure you not all of us are perfect or saints around here and it's easier to crucify somebody at a young age that probably sees more money up front in ONE day compared to what some of us will be lucky to see in ONE lifetime. You also compared him to Campbell. A guy that's over 30 now to a kid, whose not even 24 and had all of those issues occur two years ago when he was barely old enough to drink. Poor comparison. And I am not absolving Dante from being a bonehead with a few spotty decisions here and there. But people act like he's been suspended for multiple games by the NFL and he's some headcase like Justin Blackmon or that dirt bag at DE that got another chance in Dallas....

If he doesn't have a perfectly innocent off season, I would not pay him on a long term deal.  That doesn't mean he won't become a better person, but it would certainly be a gamble to give someone with such little self-control so much money.

Per article:  https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf...491824001/

According to a police spokesperson, Fowler was driving through an apartment complex in his hometown, “when a man walking in the complex made a comment about Fowler's driving.”
Fowler then allegedly got out of the car, exchanged words with the man and struck him, knocking off his glasses. Fowler allegedly stepped on them.
“He then took the victim's grocery bag, with recently purchased liquor, and threw it in a lake,” according to the spokesperson.
Police arrested Fowler without incident and, according to a complaint / arrest affidavit, the victim did not claim any injuries. An independent witness observed and corroborated the victim’s account, according to the affidavit.

That is some childish [BLEEP], not excited to hand someone that sensitive 5 years 60 million.  

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27242...icket-stop

https://www.bigcatcountry.com/2017/7/19/...-20-months

http://www.tmz.com/2016/02/24/dante-fowl...ght-video/

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27287...uly-arrest

If he has another off season like the last two, good riddance!

Where did you get the 5 year with 60 million dollar figure from?

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Sure it is. Obviously wasn't that much of a big deal to the NFL because he wasn't suspended for any of the above situations. Tons of speeding tickets? Whoooooaaaaaaa man. Whooooooaaaaaa. We've got a bad apple there. And how do you know about that regarding Calais Campbell? Just because he hasn't been busted or caught doesn't mean he's some type of Saint... that's a terrible assumption. Marvin Harrison was considered a silent saint during his career with the clots and he was linked to a shooting outside a bar in Philadelphia at one point during or post his career. 

Ray Lewis was linked to a double murder yet it's rarely mentioned today and other than that incident he was considered a decent player on and off the field. Same can be said for Jimmy Smith here in Jacksonville where he had maybe one or two run ins with being busted for cocaine yet he had been doing it during his career for apparently a long time. 

And it is holier than thou to make such claims because I can assure you not all of us are perfect or saints around here and it's easier to crucify somebody at a young age that probably sees more money up front in ONE day compared to what some of us will be lucky to see in ONE lifetime. You also compared him to Campbell. A guy that's over 30 now to a kid, whose not even 24 and had all of those issues occur two years ago when he was barely old enough to drink. Poor comparison. And I am not absolving Dante from being a bonehead with a few spotty decisions here and there. But people act like he's been suspended for multiple games by the NFL and he's some headcase like Justin Blackmon or that dirt bag at DE that got another chance in Dallas....

Holy moly. You need to relax a little bit. No idea how you took all of this from me saying his off the field stuff is "not good at all".    

You are the only one here bringing up murderers. Nobody is crucifying him. Nobody is saying he's some kind of scumbag. Simply that there are off the field issues.  

Don't take someone saying he has off the field concerns as as a huge character assassination. It's not. It's not holier than thou to comment on a players off the field history either. Calling a guy like Blackmon (who unfortunately was a terrible alcoholic) a head-case does sound holier than thou to me though. 

By all accounts he's a great personality and really worked his [BLEEP] off this offseason/season. As another poster said his issues are more to do with maturity and poor judgement than anything else.

And the Calais comparison was simply to do with the nature of the incident with the two ladies. It wasn't illegal. It wasn't even that "bad". It's just some people have a habit of getting in poor situations. Calais would be an example of a guy I'd consider to be pretty good at avoiding "poor situations" for himself.

Most alcoholics have a mental issue and turn to the bottle to drink something away or completely off their minds. As most addicts do with whatever they're addicted to. He had a problem and Gene Smith got duped by Tampa Bay's front office at the time after they saw him go into the same bar too many times in one week. That's not a "holier than thou" statement though. Holier than thou is saying that you, as an individual, are somehow better or morally less corruptible than the next man or woman who are all battling personal demons, etc. 

That was my point. People throwing stones at this kid for something that's happened a year or two ago when he's still a kid mentally. He'll be 24 right around when pre-season starts and he missed his entire rookie year while seeing a guy like Ngakoue come in and handle business on the field last year better than he could. So I am sure there's a lot going on through his head and he's probably had a few lapses in maturity because he's just that, a kid. 

But I think he'll get it. He seems to be getting it now.

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

Holy moly. You need to relax a little bit. No idea how you took all of this from me saying his off the field stuff is "not good at all".    

You are the only one here bringing up murderers. Nobody is crucifying him. Nobody is saying he's some kind of scumbag. Simply that there are off the field issues.  

Don't take someone saying he has off the field concerns as as a huge character assassination. It's not. It's not holier than thou to comment on a players off the field history either. Calling a guy like Blackmon (who unfortunately was a terrible alcoholic) a head-case does sound holier than thou to me though. 

By all accounts he's a great personality and really worked his [BLEEP] off this offseason/season. As another poster said his issues are more to do with maturity and poor judgement than anything else.

And the Calais comparison was simply to do with the nature of the incident with the two ladies. It wasn't illegal. It wasn't even that "bad". It's just some people have a habit of getting in poor situations. Calais would be an example of a guy I'd consider to be pretty good at avoiding "poor situations" for himself.

Most alcoholics have a mental issue and turn to the bottle to drink something away or completely off their minds. As most addicts do with whatever they're addicted to. He had a problem and Gene Smith got duped by Tampa Bay's front office at the time after they saw him go into the same bar too many times in one week. That's not a "holier than thou" statement though. Holier than thou is saying that you, as an individual, are somehow better or morally less corruptible than the next man or woman who are all battling personal demons, etc. 

That was my point. People throwing stones at this kid for something that's happened a year or two ago when he's still a kid mentally. He'll be 24 right around when pre-season starts and he missed his entire rookie year while seeing a guy like Ngakoue come in and handle business on the field last year better than he could. So I am sure there's a lot going on through his head and he's probably had a few lapses in maturity because he's just that, a kid. 

But I think he'll get it. He seems to be getting it now.

And at what point did I do anything other than say this his off field issues are "not good at all".  How is that holier than thou?

---

Suffice it to say, Fowler is no longer a kid so all of his maturity issues need to remain parts of his past. Should they become part of his present again, he can hit the street. I'm certain Coughlin won't put up with it.

On Fowler vs Williams that's a tough one. I'm excited by what Fowler did last year as a part timer putting up stats even better than Leonard's best season, but on the flip side, Leonard has been a 16-game starter every year. I'll say Williams would have been the better pick using the following logic...

If Williams were the pick, we never would have needed Malik Jackson. Now granted it's slightly better to have Jackson and Fowler than just Williams, but it's not that huge of a difference when you consider how much we spent on Malik Jackson and how else we could have used that money. 

---

'02

Suffice it to say, Fowler is no longer a kid so all of his maturity issues need to remain parts of his past. Should they become part of his present again, he can hit the street. I'm certain Coughlin won't put up with it.

On Fowler vs Williams that's a tough one. I'm excited by what Fowler did last year as a part timer putting up stats even better than Leonard's best season, but on the flip side, Leonard has been a 16-game starter every year. I'll say Williams would have been the better pick using the following logic...

If Williams were the pick, we never would have needed Malik Jackson. Now granted it's slightly better to have Jackson and Fowler than just Williams, but it's not that huge of a difference when you consider how much we spent on Malik Jackson and how else we could have used that money. 

Jackson>Williams

---

I recall personally wanting Vic Beasley, but I'm glad we ended up with Ngakoue. Beasley's monster season makes him a better pick as well, but I like how it's turned out.

Looking back at that draft, we probably should have drafted Amari Cooper or Todd Gurley, but who knew?

---

Suffice it to say, Fowler is no longer a kid so all of his maturity issues need to remain parts of his past. Should they become part of his present again, he can hit the street. I'm certain Coughlin won't put up with it.

On Fowler vs Williams that's a tough one. I'm excited by what Fowler did last year as a part timer putting up stats even better than Leonard's best season, but on the flip side, Leonard has been a 16-game starter every year. I'll say Williams would have been the better pick using the following logic...

If Williams were the pick, we never would have needed Malik Jackson. Now granted it's slightly better to have Jackson and Fowler than just Williams, but it's not that huge of a difference when you consider how much we spent on Malik Jackson and how else we could have used that money. 

Jackson>Williams

I agree that Jackson is better than Williams. What I'm saying is that Williams plus the money spent on Jackson wisely used somewhere else is better than Fowler and Jackson. 

---

'02

I recall personally wanting Vic Beasley, but I'm glad we ended up with Ngakoue. Beasley's monster season makes him a better pick as well, but I like how it's turned out.

Looking back at that draft, we probably should have drafted Amari Cooper or Todd Gurley, but who knew?

---

Jackson>Williams

I agree that Jackson is better than Williams. What I'm saying is that Williams plus the money spent on Jackson wisely used somewhere else is better than Fowler and Jackson. 

Brandon Scherff is the best player and still a huge need , the biggest on the team.  He would of helped solidify this oline

---

I was interested in Leonard Williams to an extent.

My real interest was in trading up to draft Jameis Winston. His monumental career continues to eclipse many legendary figures of the forward pass.

He turned 24 January 6th. Prior to that birthday, Jameis passed some career benchmarks of Hall of Fame quarterback, Dan Marino.

Winston now holds the NFL record for most touchdown passes throw prior to the age of twenty-four.
He also now holds the NFL record for most passing yardage prior to the age of twenty-four, as well.

Both records were previously held by Dan Marino since 1985. That's 32 years ago.

He likely will set a new Tampa Bay Bucs' franchise record for TD throws sometime next year.

Oh well.

---

I was interested in Leonard Williams to an extent.

My real interest was in trading up to draft Jameis Winston. His monumental career continues to eclipse many legendary figures of the forward pass.

He turned 24 January 6th. Prior to that birthday, Jameis passed some career benchmarks of Hall of Fame quarterback, Dan Marino.

Winston now holds the NFL record for most touchdown passes throw prior to the age of twenty-four.
He also now holds the NFL record for most passing yardage prior to the age of twenty-four, as well.

Both records were previously held by Dan Marino since 1985. That's 32 years ago.

He likely will set a new Tampa Bay Bucs' franchise record for TD throws sometime next year.

Oh well.

I don't recall any talk about trading up at the time, but that might have worked out great. I'm a huge fan of famous Jameis and view him as being flat out better than Bortles. ...and I like Bortles don't get me wrong. Even if it meant using our 2nd and 3rd round pick... we're talking about YJ Yeldon and AJ Cann. I'd easily trade Fowler, Yeldon and Cann for Winston. ...although that was year two for Bortles so I can't imagine that actually happening. 

---

'02

Had they taken Williams then they might not have Calais, so I'm happy with how it worked out.

Good point.

---

I was interested in Leonard Williams to an extent.

My real interest was in trading up to draft Jameis Winston. His monumental career continues to eclipse many legendary figures of the forward pass.

He turned 24 January 6th. Prior to that birthday, Jameis passed some career benchmarks of Hall of Fame quarterback, Dan Marino.

Winston now holds the NFL record for most touchdown passes throw prior to the age of twenty-four.
He also now holds the NFL record for most passing yardage prior to the age of twenty-four, as well.

Both records were previously held by Dan Marino since 1985. That's 32 years ago.

He likely will set a new Tampa Bay Bucs' franchise record for TD throws sometime next year.

Oh well.

I don't recall any talk about trading up at the time, but that might have worked out great. I'm a huge fan of famous Jameis and view him as being flat out better than Bortles. ...and I like Bortles don't get me wrong. Even if it meant using our 2nd and 3rd round pick... we're talking about YJ Yeldon and AJ Cann. I'd easily trade Fowler, Yeldon and Cann for Winston. ...although that was year two for Bortles so I can't imagine that actually happening. 

We had the the number three over-all in 2015. We could have taken that and given up the pick we used on Ramsey in 2016 to move up two slots. Bortles would be traded, or retained as a back-up.

What's gross is somewhere around the end of 2014 we were actually winning the battle of draft position. Nuts. We had to win for "pride". Like a team that bad had ANY sense of pride not knocked out of their ear holes...

Winston's contract is up after this coming season. There seems to be a fifth year option available.

---

Had they taken Williams then they might not have Calais, so I'm happy with how it worked out.

Good point.

Until it came playoff time. Calais Who? Malik Who? Throw the eight-figure bums out on their ears.

---

I don't recall any talk about trading up at the time, but that might have worked out great. I'm a huge fan of famous Jameis and view him as being flat out better than Bortles. ...and I like Bortles don't get me wrong. Even if it meant using our 2nd and 3rd round pick... we're talking about YJ Yeldon and AJ Cann. I'd easily trade Fowler, Yeldon and Cann for Winston. ...although that was year two for Bortles so I can't imagine that actually happening. 

We had the the number three over-all in 2015. We could have taken that and given up the pick we used on Ramsey in 2016 to move up two slots. Bortles would be traded, or retained as a back-up.

What's gross is somewhere around the end of 2014 we were actually winning the battle of draft position. Nuts. We had to win for "pride". Like a team that bad had ANY sense of pride not knocked out of their ear holes...

Winston's contract is up after this coming season. There seems to be a fifth year option available.

I have a lot of friends who are Bucs fans that have abandoned the Winston ship.  Watching him play is a bit infuriating, he sails a ton of passes and takes unnecessary risks.  I think he came into the league a lot closer to his ceiling than people anticipated.

---

Go Jags!
*To stay up for atleast 2 years 3/6/17
2016 draft players I think will be good

• On the Fournette train, will be best back of his class 3/6/17
  
• Lattimore please,  Lockdowns on both sides would be nice
  
• Engram at TE and the MJD clone Samaje Perine
  

I don't recall any talk about trading up at the time, but that might have worked out great. I'm a huge fan of famous Jameis and view him as being flat out better than Bortles. ...and I like Bortles don't get me wrong. Even if it meant using our 2nd and 3rd round pick... we're talking about YJ Yeldon and AJ Cann. I'd easily trade Fowler, Yeldon and Cann for Winston. ...although that was year two for Bortles so I can't imagine that actually happening. 

We had the the number three over-all in 2015. We could have taken that and given up the pick we used on Ramsey in 2016 to move up two slots. Bortles would be traded, or retained as a back-up.

What's gross is somewhere around the end of 2014 we were actually winning the battle of draft position. Nuts. We had to win for "pride". Like a team that bad had ANY sense of pride not knocked out of their ear holes...

Winston's contract is up after this coming season. There seems to be a fifth year option available.

That would have been worse tho. I'd rather have Bortles and Ramsey than Winston.

---

'02

We had the the number three over-all in 2015. We could have taken that and given up the pick we used on Ramsey in 2016 to move up two slots. Bortles would be traded, or retained as a back-up.

What's gross is somewhere around the end of 2014 we were actually winning the battle of draft position. Nuts. We had to win for "pride". Like a team that bad had ANY sense of pride not knocked out of their ear holes...

Winston's contract is up after this coming season. There seems to be a fifth year option available.

I have a lot of friends who are Bucs fans that have abandoned the Winston ship.  Watching him play is a bit infuriating, he sails a ton of passes and takes unnecessary risks.  I think he came into the league a lot closer to his ceiling than people anticipated.

Couple that with him being an absolute moron and you've got a guy who will always let you down

---

Coughlin when asked if winning will be a focus: "What the hell else is there? This is nice and dandy, but winning is what all this is about."