Create Account


Board Performance Issues We are aware of performance issues on the board and are working to resolve them! The board may be intermittently unavailable during this time. (May 07) x


The Jungle is self-supported by showing advertisements via Google Adsense.
Please consider disabling your advertisement-blocking plugin on the Jungle to help support the site and let us grow!
We also show significantly less advertisements to registered users, so create your account to benefit from this!
Questions or concerns about this ad? Take a screenshot and comment in the thread. We do value your feedback.
Putting Leonard Fournette’s rookie year in perspective - PFT

#81

Highly drafted players often get more credit than is due for a teams success. I remember Reggie Bush early on was getting credit for Brees success. Andrew Lucks play was grossly exaggerated while colts beat up the division. Sam Bradford Can still demand big money whilst never having a good season. The draft hype continues for quite a while sometimes
Reply

We show less advertisements to registered users. Accounts are free; join today!


#82

(05-09-2018, 08:11 PM)JackCity Wrote: Two of the teams we played were two of the worst defenses in football last year and the Bengals were one of the worst run stopping teams in the league.  

Of course Blake and our offense as a whole is gonna play better against them. We weren't a better team or offense without Fournette, just played weaker teams.  Even though the Bengals had a good pass defense. 

And I agree our play calling could be better from a personnel and philosophical standpoint. I think with more receivers and field stretchers we'll see them lineup with 3 wide a good deal more than last year.  Hopefully LF7 will make roads to get better out of shotgun and improve his vision.

That's why the last part of the 2nd paragraph said it included the on/off splits in the games he played too. Yes our 3-0 without him was largely due to the opponent, but we were also just better when he was on the sidelines in the games he was active too...for a plethora of the reasons stated.
Reply

#83

Dude had to of faced the most 8-9 men boxes in the league.
Also had contact behind the LOS many times and still got positive yards.

While I am also on the "don't draft a RB high" I think this article is misplaced... I haven't heard anyone claim Fournette was the reason for our teams success. Everyone knows we were ride or die with our D. But in certain instances LF really did help us win and in some flashes you saw some real star power.
Reply

#84

I hate the idea of taking runningbacks early.
But, that pick was a bit of a perfect storm. The team wanted to be tougher, more physical run oriented team. And the perfect back is sitting there to accomplish that.
LF filled a massive need but the pick also accomplished sending a message to the team and league of this is what we are.
Reply

#85

(05-10-2018, 01:15 AM)Upper Wrote:
(05-09-2018, 08:11 PM)JackCity Wrote: Two of the teams we played were two of the worst defenses in football last year and the Bengals were one of the worst run stopping teams in the league.  

Of course Blake and our offense as a whole is gonna play better against them. We weren't a better team or offense without Fournette, just played weaker teams.  Even though the Bengals had a good pass defense. 

And I agree our play calling could be better from a personnel and philosophical standpoint. I think with more receivers and field stretchers we'll see them lineup with 3 wide a good deal more than last year.  Hopefully LF7 will make roads to get better out of shotgun and improve his vision.

That's why the last part of the 2nd paragraph said it included the on/off splits in the games he played too. Yes our 3-0 without him was largely due to the opponent, but we were also just better when he was on the sidelines in the games he was active too...for a plethora of the reasons stated.

The problem with using on/off splits in the NFL is the variety of situations and personnel used doesn't allow for a like to like comparison. The NBA on/off stats is flawed too but it's easier to look at it like for like.
Reply

We show less advertisements to registered users. Accounts are free; join today!


#86

Consistent 8-9 man fronts on a team that EVERYONE knew was going to run on 1st down.

I think the argument could be made that he's better than people think. I think a less predictable offense would go a long way in increasing his average. We can still be a run-first offense without being so predictable.
Reply

#87

(05-08-2018, 01:18 PM)NYC4jags Wrote:
(05-08-2018, 01:04 PM)Deacon Wrote: The thing that I don't understand about the "don't waste a high round pick on a WR" philosophy is that it seems to not view the draft as a single entity, which from my perspective, it is

I do understand the idea of taking a larger perspective on the draft, to me each class has it's own intrinsic value and that is based on the talent of the available players. Each draft has a "best" player in it, every single one. You need to get as many good players as you can but you only get one pool to gain talent from. For those that would not want Fournette, my response is "then who is better?" Which player out of that top ten has more talent? I get that there are possible answers to it, but I (way too optimistically probably) think that is the reason for why the Front Office collects the talent that it does.

For me it really comes down to this simple opinion. (for better or worse)

I think it's easier to find an impactful RB in the second-fourth rounds than it is to find an impactful defender or QB there. (OT deserves mention as well ahead of RB when picking early)
Adams and Mahomes are the obvious examples of that in that particular draft to me. I'd see them as wiser usage of the pick. I could even make a case for Jon Allen there over Fournette. 

Another thing floating around this topic is this idea that "putting Fournette on the field forced defenses to load the box." I don't know about that. 
I think that about 60-70% of those loaded boxes were a direct response to the offensive formation. Not the guy standing in the backfield. The Jags telegraphed run quite often last season when Fournette was in the game - and the responses many of those run sets garnered would likely have been the same if it were Ivory lined up behind an identical set.

You make a great point, and I think that all of the changes around the organization are really masking the truth. With the installation of a quality Staff and a more dire commitment to the running game, who is to say that Yeldon could not have produced at the same level? Or if Hunt would have been as effective late in games? Despite starting in three less games, Fournette carried just four fewer times than Hunt. Granted, Hunt had 15 more Targets in the passing game overall, so maybe the touches smooths out but I don't know that this Offense would have maximized Hunt's abilities the way that Reid's system does.
I'm trying to make myself more informed and less opinionated.

Stop saying whatever stupid thing you're talking about and pay attention to all the interesting things I have to say!
Reply

#88

Signing Norwell could/should have a huge impact on Fournette and our ability to control the game via the run.
While we did this some last year we struggled late in games and late in the season to do it consistently enough.
Enough to put teams away by controlling the clock on the ground.
One of two things(or both) need to happen this year.
If they continue to stack the box gameplanning for Fournette.....Bortles needs to take better advantage of this and make them pay through the air.
If he can't then nothing will change...."Unless",and this is my hope,that adding Norwell makes stacking the box against us a bad idea all around.
Robinson-Norwell-Linder-Cann-Parnell/Richardson I'm hoping is such an improvement none of this will matter.
Run baby run!
Reply

#89

He seemed to tire as the season went on. From calling for Malcolm Mitchell to hit him early on he started to slow.

That's quite typical for a rookie especially with his workload.

The biggest impact was on the goaline. No more 4 runs from 4th and 1 to come up empty. He invariably seemed to get in.

This team has gone to speed on the outside and physical blockers at wideout to sell the play action and hopefully make teams respect the deep ball a little more. That plus norwell an off season of rest and conditioning and if we would run a little more read option should make things a little better for him. I think he breaks out next year
Reply

We show less advertisements to registered users. Accounts are free; join today!


#90

We may have been the most predictable team ever in 2011 and MJD still had great stats. Fournette was decent not a difference makes last year. Elite runners find yardage.
Reply

#91

(05-09-2018, 02:13 PM)jessepeck1213 Wrote: If cam continues to develop and turns into a top 5 LT in the league we can just all pretend we took him in the first and Leonard in the second.

This thread is pure gold and this hidden nugget is pretty good. You can look at the guys you drafted 3 years later and re-slot them in your head to decide on their value vis a vis their reassigned draft position.

(05-10-2018, 10:48 AM)jagshype Wrote: I hate the idea of taking runningbacks early.
But, that pick was a bit of a perfect storm. The team wanted to be tougher, more physical run oriented team. And the perfect back is sitting there to accomplish that.
LF filled a massive need but the pick also accomplished sending a message to the team and league of this is what we are.

Great post as well.
Season Ticket holder since 2004. Smile

 

        
Reply




Users browsing this thread:
1 Guest(s)

The Jungle is self-supported by showing advertisements via Google Adsense.
Please consider disabling your advertisement-blocking plugin on the Jungle to help support the site and let us grow!
We also show less advertisements to registered users, so create your account to benefit from this!
Questions or concerns about this ad? Take a screenshot and comment in the thread. We do value your feedback.


ABOUT US
The Jungle Forums is the Jaguars' biggest fan message board. Talking about the Jags since 2006, the Jungle was the team-endorsed home of all things Jaguars.

Since 2017, the Jungle is now independent of the team but still run by the same crew. We are here to support and discuss all things Jaguars and all things Duval!