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Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez


(08-12-2018, 07:00 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 12:15 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Except when they're liberals.  When they're liberals it's not that they are hurling insults they're making jokes people can relate to.  We have to understand what they're saying no matter how much it actually contradicts everything feminism actually stands for or how it's obviously covering an overwhelming lack of substance.  We have to UNDERSTAND!

Not really.  There is a line.  "Mexican immigrants are rapists and drug dealers" is clearly beyond the line, and "I don't owe you attention just for offering me money" is not.  If your personal line has these things in reverse, you are blinded by either partisanship or racism.

That isn’t at all what he said.
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(08-12-2018, 07:00 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 12:15 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Except when they're liberals.  When they're liberals it's not that they are hurling insults they're making jokes people can relate to.  We have to understand what they're saying no matter how much it actually contradicts everything feminism actually stands for or how it's obviously covering an overwhelming lack of substance.  We have to UNDERSTAND!

Not really.  There is a line.  "Mexican immigrants are rapists and drug dealers" is clearly beyond the line, and "I don't owe you attention just for offering me money" is not.  If your personal line has these things in reverse, you are blinded by either partisanship or racism.

[Image: giphy.webp]
“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

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(This post was last modified: 08-12-2018, 07:19 PM by jj82284.)

(08-12-2018, 07:11 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 07:07 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: And once again your repeating a left wing lie shows that your claim to be a Republican is a lie.

Help me out.  Which part was a lie? What is the truth?

You leaving out the part where she called him a sexist for wanting to engage in a conversation.

Just goes to show that there is an engrained double standard for conservatives. The left is actively harassing and threatening their political opponents in the street saying they don't deserve to live peaceably in society. Not just fringe pundits, elected officials. Not a peep.

Trump says a non pc word "ARMAGEDDON"
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(08-12-2018, 07:16 PM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 07:11 PM)mikesez Wrote: Help me out.  Which part was a lie? What is the truth?

You leaving out the part where she called him a sexist for wanting to engage in a conversation.

Just goes to show that there is an engrained double standard for conservatives.  The left is actively harassing and threatening their political opponents in the street saying they don't deserve to live peaceably in society.  Not just fringe pundits, elected officials.  Not a peep.  

Trump says a non pc word "ARMAGEDDON"

Hmm.  I don't see the word "sexist" in my copy.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-12-2018, 08:24 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 07:16 PM)jj82284 Wrote: You leaving out the part where she called him a sexist for wanting to engage in a conversation.

Just goes to show that there is an engrained double standard for conservatives.  The left is actively harassing and threatening their political opponents in the street saying they don't deserve to live peaceably in society.  Not just fringe pundits, elected officials.  Not a peep.  

Trump says a non pc word "ARMAGEDDON"

Hmm.  I don't see the word "sexist" in my copy.

Yeh, accusing him of "catcalling" was meant to insinuate he's a bad fortnight player.  My mistake.  

You still didn't comment about the actual rapes and drugs that are a result of our immigration policy.  

This what it boils down to.  Trump says something poliyltically incorrect but with at least some factual basis "this is beneath or discourse" tge left calls someone sexist because they dared invite them for a conversation but that plays into the pc narrative and that's something "most WOMEN can relate to"
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(08-12-2018, 08:51 PM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 08:24 PM)mikesez Wrote: Hmm.  I don't see the word "sexist" in my copy.

Yeh, accusing him of "catcalling" was meant to insinuate he's a bad fortnight player.  My mistake.  

You still didn't comment about the actual rapes and drugs that are a result of our immigration policy.  

This what it boils down to.  Trump says something poliyltically incorrect but with at least some factual basis "this is beneath or discourse" tge left calls someone sexist because they dared invite them for a conversation but that plays into the pc narrative and that's something "most WOMEN can relate to"

AOC said that Shapiro's invitation was like a catcall, not that it literally was a catcall.  It's a simile.  A comparison that is not meant to be perfect.  Jacksonville public schools typically teach about similes during middle school.

Trump said that the government of Mexico was deliberately sending us rapists and drug dealers. I don't think he was using simile or metaphor there.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-12-2018, 09:00 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 08:51 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Yeh, accusing him of "catcalling" was meant to insinuate he's a bad fortnight player.  My mistake.  

You still didn't comment about the actual rapes and drugs that are a result of our immigration policy.  

This what it boils down to.  Trump says something poliyltically incorrect but with at least some factual basis "this is beneath or discourse" tge left calls someone sexist because they dared invite them for a conversation but that plays into the pc narrative and that's something "most WOMEN can relate to"

AOC said that Shapiro's invitation was like a catcall, not that it literally was a catcall.  It's a simile.  A comparison that is not meant to be perfect.  Jacksonville public schools typically teach about similes during middle school.

Trump said that the government of Mexico was deliberately sending us rapists and drug dealers. I don't think he was using simile or metaphor there.

I never said that was A PERFECT COMPARISON.  I said it had an explicit derogatory implication.  A simile or a metaphor can be used to make an insulting or derogatory comparison.  But u knew that.  

And the Mexican government does both encourage illegal migration and release prisoners with the intent that they migrate.  

Lol.  Info see what flsportsgod was talking about.  U must have drawn a mean straw man in middle school.  Lol.
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(This post was last modified: 08-12-2018, 09:30 PM by mikesez.)

(08-12-2018, 09:18 PM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:00 PM)mikesez Wrote: AOC said that Shapiro's invitation was like a catcall, not that it literally was a catcall.  It's a simile.  A comparison that is not meant to be perfect.  Jacksonville public schools typically teach about similes during middle school.

Trump said that the government of Mexico was deliberately sending us rapists and drug dealers. I don't think he was using simile or metaphor there.

I never said that was A PERFECT COMPARISON.  I said it had an explicit derogatory implication.  A simile or a metaphor can be used to make an insulting or derogatory comparison.  But u knew that.  

And the Mexican government does both encourage illegal migration and release prisoners with the intent that they migrate.  

Lol.  Info see what flsportsgod was talking about.  U must have drawn a mean straw man in middle school.  Lol.

So we agree that she did not intend to make a perfect comparison.  So if we list things that are true about catcalling, some of those things will also be how AOC feels about the invitation, but some of them won't be.  For instance, we know that catcalling is (a) annoying (b) sexist and © not worthy of response.
AOC explicitly said in the tweet that the invite was (a) and ©.  Whether we think she meant (b) or not is left open for interpretation.

Meanwhile, Trump used no art or ambiguity when he said the Mexican government is deliberately sending their most dangerous people to us.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-12-2018, 09:29 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:18 PM)jj82284 Wrote: I never said that was A PERFECT COMPARISON.  I said it had an explicit derogatory implication.  A simile or a metaphor can be used to make an insulting or derogatory comparison.  But u knew that.  

And the Mexican government does both encourage illegal migration and release prisoners with the intent that they migrate.  

Lol.  Info see what flsportsgod was talking about.  U must have drawn a mean straw man in middle school.  Lol.

So we agree that she did not intend to make a perfect comparison.  So if we list things that are true about catcalling, some of those things will also be how AOC feels about the invitation, but some of them won't be.  For instance, we know that catcalling is (a) annoying (b) sexist and © not worthy of response.
AOC explicitly said in the tweet that the invite was (a) and ©.  Whether we think she meant (b) or not is left open for interpretation.

Meanwhile, Trump used no art or ambiguity when he said the Mexican government is deliberately sending their most dangerous people to us.

Not when you ad on the part about men with bad intentions and feeling entitled.  You yourself used the term sexual harassment to define the implication.  Is checkmate one word or two?

And the imperfection isn't that the comparison was devoid the accusation of sexism or derogatory connotation.  It's that he didn't whistle or actually use a pick up line.  

But when it's the liberal darling we have to play word games and understand and try to find the humor. 

And I never insinuated Trump was being ambiguous, I said he's right.
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(08-12-2018, 07:11 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 07:07 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: And once again your repeating a left wing lie shows that your claim to be a Republican is a lie.

Help me out.  Which part was a lie? What is the truth?

Trump did not say what you claim in quotes that he said. That's the lie you posted. 

The other lie was your claim to be Republican. You have proved over and over by your posts that you buy into the whole Leftist philosophy.



                                                                          

"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"
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(08-10-2018, 07:56 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-10-2018, 06:09 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: The only version of that that I've considered is one where the immigrants (and their children) can't receive benefits, have to pay taxes, and neither them nor their children will be citizens unless through application. 

I'm still not a fan but that's the only way I'd considered it personally.
I think that a lot of the voices wanting  punish illegal immigrants are the same voices that hire them and don't want to do e-Verify.  Obviously e-Verify is an imposition on the liberty of employers to hire whomever they want. It's not a purely libertarian idea.  Ideally, in my opinion, we would make it easier for people with skills that employers want to come and stay permanently if things work out.  But they should be doing it above board so that everyone knows the right amount of taxes was collected.  And no one gets benefits until they become a citizen.  
I think a lot of the reason we don't want surges of immigrants is because increasing the supply of labor depresses wages, but I think that effect is stronger for temporary immigrants and weaker for ones that want to stay.  The temporary stuff is what I'd like to see them do less of.  There are a lot of H1-B people working with computers on Jacksonville's southside and I don't think them coming and going without laying down roots, getting married, and buying houses does anyone any good.
I'd also want the children of immigrants to not be citizens unless they specifically apply to be citizens, but that might require amending the constitution.  Maybe it'd be as simple as saying, citizenship alone isn't enough for a kid to qualify for welfare; one parent has to be a citizen too.  But that sounds mean.
Quote:1. She said conservatives wont debate her about issues
2. A conservative asked to debate her about issues
3. She deflected and said a virgin-until-marriage orthodox Jew was catcalling and felt entitled

She's absurd and I'm not even sure how you can defend the hypocrisy here. Shapiro merely asked for a debate, and people like you are saying that he's acting entitled her attention. Let's be real here... she's too scared to debate him. She can barely get through friendly interviews. Shapiro is a neocon, and I don't agree with many of the things he says, but he'd take her to the shed and she knows it. You can pretend it's about something else but it isn't.

I'll take your word for it that "she said conservatives won't debate her about issues".  I hadn't heard that.  I don't know if she meant pundits or other candidates.  I don't know if she meant that she specifically should be in the debate or that someone should debate in her place.  But suppose she meant pundits and that she would personally debate them.  Fine.  It was a stupid thing for her to say in that case, because there's no way that she ever intended to stage a debate between herself and any pundit.  No candidate would.  It's equally stupid for them to call her out on it, and her replying with the sexual harassment angle was well-deserved.  Worst case, her mouth wrote a check she had no intent of cashing.  She might be guilty of braggadocio, but not cowardice or stupidity, not for this anyways.

Difficulty level on the mental gymnastics just went up playa

#MAGA
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(08-12-2018, 09:46 PM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:29 PM)mikesez Wrote: So we agree that she did not intend to make a perfect comparison.  So if we list things that are true about catcalling, some of those things will also be how AOC feels about the invitation, but some of them won't be.  For instance, we know that catcalling is (a) annoying (b) sexist and © not worthy of response.
AOC explicitly said in the tweet that the invite was (a) and ©.  Whether we think she meant (b) or not is left open for interpretation.

Meanwhile, Trump used no art or ambiguity when he said the Mexican government is deliberately sending their most dangerous people to us.

Not when you ad on the part about men with bad intentions and feeling entitled.  You yourself used the term sexual harassment to define the implication.  Is checkmate one word or two?

And the imperfection isn't that the comparison was devoid the accusation of sexism or derogatory connotation.  It's that he didn't whistle or actually use a pick up line.  

But when it's the liberal darling we have to play word games and understand and try to find the humor. 

And I never insinuated Trump was being ambiguous, I said he's right.

I used "sexual harassment" the same way she used "cat calling." A clearly not nice action, that has some things in common with what Ben Shapiro actually did.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-13-2018, 07:33 AM)7vmikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:46 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Not when you ad on the part about men with bad intentions and feeling entitled.  You yourself used the term sexual harassment to define the implication.  Is checkmate one word or two?

And the imperfection isn't that the comparison was devoid the accusation of sexism or derogatory connotation.  It's that he didn't whistle or actually use a pick up line.  

But when it's the liberal darling we have to play word games and understand and try to find the humor. 

And I never insinuated Trump was being ambiguous, I said he's right.

I used "sexual harassment" the same way she used "cat calling." A clearly not nice action, that has some things in common with what Ben Shapiro actually did.

Man, you can't ever agree with people on your side of the aisle, it's almost like your whole shtick is contrived. Well, not almost, rather, completely.
“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

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(08-13-2018, 07:33 AM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:46 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Not when you ad on the part about men with bad intentions and feeling entitled.  You yourself used the term sexual harassment to define the implication.  Is checkmate one word or two?

And the imperfection isn't that the comparison was devoid the accusation of sexism or derogatory connotation.  It's that he didn't whistle or actually use a pick up line.  

But when it's the liberal darling we have to play word games and understand and try to find the humor. 

And I never insinuated Trump was being ambiguous, I said he's right.

I used "sexual harassment" the same way she used "cat calling." A clearly not nice action, that has some things in common with what Ben Shapiro actually did.

And the explicit derogatory connotation of a masochistic act (a man with BAD INTENTIONS). 

But hey it's all in fun.  When the media says Trump does something LIKE Hitler they don't really mean that he's racist because that's a simile not a metaphor and Mike redefined the word similie with a non-existent inherent benevolence that he can use any time he wants to defend one of his lefty buddies.  

And he would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for me and the little dog that DIDN'T eat my English homework.
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(08-13-2018, 08:19 AM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-13-2018, 07:33 AM)mikesez Wrote: I used "sexual harassment" the same way she used "cat calling." A clearly not nice action, that has some things in common with what Ben Shapiro actually did.

And the explicit derogatory connotation of a masochistic act (a man with BAD INTENTIONS). 

But hey it's all in fun.  When the media says Trump does something LIKE Hitler they don't really mean that he's racist because that's a simile not a metaphor and Mike redefined the word similie with a non-existent inherent benevolence that he can use any time he wants to defend one of his lefty buddies.  

And he would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for me and the little dog that DIDN'T eat my English homework.

How far you stretch a simile, how many other things the two have in common, is in the eye of the beholder.

Similes are not "inherently benevolent" and I never said that.

Here's the thing.  I'm going to criticize lazy thinking whenever I see it.  The right wing victim complex is mostly based on lazy thinking.  There is also a left wing victim complex, and it is also based on lazy thinking, but those guys don't seem to post here.  My dad dives into a left wing victim complex whenever we talk politics.  "Oh the media lets right wing guys get away with X and Democrats never get away with X!". Tiresome.  Lazy.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-13-2018, 08:57 AM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-13-2018, 08:19 AM)jj82284 Wrote: And the explicit derogatory connotation of a masochistic act (a man with BAD INTENTIONS). 

But hey it's all in fun.  When the media says Trump does something LIKE Hitler they don't really mean that he's racist because that's a simile not a metaphor and Mike redefined the word similie with a non-existent inherent benevolence that he can use any time he wants to defend one of his lefty buddies.  

And he would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for me and the little dog that DIDN'T eat my English homework.

How far you stretch a simile, how many other things the two have in common, is in the eye of the beholder.

Similes are not "inherently benevolent" and I never said that.

Here's the thing.  I'm going to criticize lazy thinking whenever I see it.  The right wing victim complex is mostly based on lazy thinking.  There is also a left wing victim complex, and it is also based on lazy thinking, but those guys don't seem to post here.  My dad dives into a left wing victim complex whenever we talk politics.  "Oh the media lets right wing guys get away with X and Democrats never get away with X!". Tiresome.  Lazy.

Name calling because u can't defend ur point.  PRICELESS!  

#TDS
#CHECKMATE
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(08-12-2018, 09:00 PM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 08:51 PM)jj82284 Wrote: Yeh, accusing him of "catcalling" was meant to insinuate he's a bad fortnight player.  My mistake.  

You still didn't comment about the actual rapes and drugs that are a result of our immigration policy.  

This what it boils down to.  Trump says something poliyltically incorrect but with at least some factual basis "this is beneath or discourse" tge left calls someone sexist because they dared invite them for a conversation but that plays into the pc narrative and that's something "most WOMEN can relate to"

AOC said that Shapiro's invitation was like a catcall, not that it literally was a catcall.  It's a simile.  A comparison that is not meant to be perfect.  Jacksonville public schools typically teach about similes during middle school.

Trump said that the government of Mexico was deliberately sending us rapists and drug dealers. I don't think he was using simile or metaphor there.

U attempted the slight of hand that because an insult (which you admit it was) was structured in the form of a simile that it somehow obscured or softened the plain context or implication (in this case the accusation that ben shapiros invitation was akin to sexual harassment and misogyny which you yourself admit to) Which is of course absurd.
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Here's the thing, you ain't qualified except in your own mind.
“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

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(08-13-2018, 10:01 AM)jj82284 Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 09:00 PM)mikesez Wrote: AOC said that Shapiro's invitation was like a catcall, not that it literally was a catcall.  It's a simile.  A comparison that is not meant to be perfect.  Jacksonville public schools typically teach about similes during middle school.

Trump said that the government of Mexico was deliberately sending us rapists and drug dealers. I don't think he was using simile or metaphor there.

U attempted the slight of hand that because an insult (which you admit it was) was structured in the form of a simile that it somehow obscured or softened the plain context or implication (in this case the accusation that ben shapiros invitation was akin to sexual harassment and misogyny which you yourself admit to) Which is of course absurd.

Similes have a small number of explicit readings and a large number of possible implicit readings. The plainness of an implication is always debatable.  It's part of the art of political discourse to leave things implied but deniable.  And it used to be that way on the Republican side too, until mid 2016.
My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.
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(08-13-2018, 11:18 AM)mikesez Wrote:
(08-13-2018, 10:01 AM)jj82284 Wrote: U attempted the slight of hand that because an insult (which you admit it was) was structured in the form of a simile that it somehow obscured or softened the plain context or implication (in this case the accusation that ben shapiros invitation was akin to sexual harassment and misogyny which you yourself admit to) Which is of course absurd.

Similes have a small number of explicit readings and a large number of possible implicit readings. The plainness of an implication is always debatable.  It's part of the art of political discourse to leave things implied but deniable.  And it used to be that way on the Republican side too, until mid 2016.

No reasonable person would lend ant weight to your version of her comments.  Frankly, ur just not challenging yourself enough.
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