I wouldnt be surprised if we went 8-8 next year. The question is, what happened to the front office if we do that?

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Yes, it's improvement, but it's Blaine Gabbert 2012 level improvement. - Pirkster

http://youtu.be/ouGM3NWpjxk The Home Hypnotist!

http://youtu.be/XQRFkn0Ly3A Media on the Brain Link!
 

Peyton must store oxygen in that forehead of his. No way I'd still be alive after all that choking.

 

I wouldnt be surprised if we went 8-8 next year. The question is, what happened to the front office if we do that?

I don't think any judgment will be made on one single stat, even if it is as important as that one.   It'll depend on a whole host of things, like, what factors went into that 8-8 record, how do our draft picks look after one season, is there a reasonable plan in place, how is our salary cap situation, and so on and so forth.  If I were the owner, I would try to assess whether the front office made intelligent decisions and if there was a good plan in place for the future, not just wins and losses the previous season.

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Would like to hear their numbers when the game is within two scores. Bortles has a lot of garbage time stats.

Actually he mostly doesn't. Last year aside (because I haven't looked at those numbers and because a season where you've lost just about everyone at OL and WR doesn't make for a fair comparison) Bortles actually had very few garbage time stats, because the team had very little actual garbage time. When they lost a lot of games, they lost a lot of close games. Feel free to be negative about Bortles, but the argument that his stats came in garbage time never made a lick of sense.

Yeah it never made sense until you've actually watched him play that is... HOW can you be a jags fan and have watched Bortles all these years and not realize so many games he ever did jack until the game was out of reach and the defense was in soft zone prevent ?

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Actually he mostly doesn't. Last year aside (because I haven't looked at those numbers and because a season where you've lost just about everyone at OL and WR doesn't make for a fair comparison) Bortles actually had very few garbage time stats, because the team had very little actual garbage time. When they lost a lot of games, they lost a lot of close games. Feel free to be negative about Bortles, but the argument that his stats came in garbage time never made a lick of sense.

Yeah it never made sense until you've actually watched him play that is... HOW can you be a jags fan and have watched Bortles all these years and not realize so many games he ever did jack until the game was out of reach and the defense was in soft zone prevent ?

This argument should be done as he is no longer a jag.  As Jags fans this is just a situation where knowledge of the game is different amongst us.  I felt the coaching staff didnt know how to utilize Blake to expand on his strengths and minimize his weaknesses popping up.  Other fans felt that the staff couldnt do anything and he just sucked due to not being able to read a defense and his throwing motion.  

I see it as this. If Blake sucked and could barely do anything then this staff should be fired for keeping him as long as they did.  I also feel that if they saw any glimpse of hope, they suck, because they didnt know how to harp on it and make it work.  I saw an inconsistent gameplan week in and week out almost every game of the season these past few years coupled with an excuse that the QB was inconsistent.  You cant have both, and even if you do, one needs to go to even try to get some form of consistency in motion.  I focused on ways we could work with BB and actually use his strengths to get better results and the staff chose to go run first and erase all hope for a consistent passing game in a passing league.  

Some argue he just sucks so there was never any hope.  I argue this staff was incompetent and didnt even try basic strategy to help him moreso than running crossers.  No read option for alot of plays, no qb designed runs, nothing to mix up the offense to keep the defense off balance.  Just run run, then pass or scramble due to pressure.  We'll never know because we have Foles now.  I just know we could've won a ship with him but went soft so hopefully Foles is the answer and its playoffs and ship in the next 2 years.  IF not fire everyone.

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Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

I like analytics, but sometimes the depth of these numbers are just stupid. We all know Bortles just wasn't that good here. He played well at times, but was way too inconsistent. We've seen Foles make big plays over and over. I don't know if Foles is the missing key, but I do know Bortles wasn't. Sometimes it just comes down to whether you can play or not.....

Agree.  Analytics are useful, but only if you truly understand them and understand how to use them.

Most don't.  Particularly those who use them most often for their opinions.

Case in point, it was PFF who incorrectly placed Demetrius McCray among the top CBs in the league based on their manufactured rankings system.  https://blackandteal.com/2015/02/17/deme...backs-nfl/

Sometimes, the numbers simply don't add up... so to speak.

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"You do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud."

Actually he mostly doesn't. Last year aside (because I haven't looked at those numbers and because a season where you've lost just about everyone at OL and WR doesn't make for a fair comparison) Bortles actually had very few garbage time stats, because the team had very little actual garbage time. When they lost a lot of games, they lost a lot of close games. Feel free to be negative about Bortles, but the argument that his stats came in garbage time never made a lick of sense.

Yeah it never made sense until you've actually watched him play that is... HOW can you be a jags fan and have watched Bortles all these years and not realize so many games he ever did jack until the game was out of reach and the defense was in soft zone prevent ?

Because that didn't particularly happen, certainly not consistently. How you can think it did is beyond me too - so many of the games Bortles played in through most of his career just plain didn't have garbage time by any sane meaning of the words, and in many of the ones that did he actually played worse with the game going out of reach, as he tried to do too much.

Just as a quick experiment, let's look at Blake's top passer ratings in games (the 14 with a passer rating over 100) and see which involved racking up stats in garbage time.

1. 2017 HOU - 143.7
This one was a 45-7 win. Don't tell me he racked up those stats in garbage time against a prevent defense.

2. 2015 @TEN - 134.5
A 39-42 loss that was competitive all the way through. No garbage time.

3. 2017 BAL - 128.2
Another big win (44-7) - again, no garbage time stats.

4. 2015 @TAM - 125.4
Lost 31-38. Was within a score until half way through the fourth quarter, and his stats weren't out of kilter for the few minutes where the Jags were down by two scores (one three-and-out, one touchdown drive leading to a failed onside kick).

5. 2017 @IND - 124.7
A 27-0 victory. Did the Colts start the game in prevent defense, maybe?

6. 2015 @NOR - 124.5
27-38 loss. The first example of some good stats with the game out of reach (13-31) - one deep TD pass and one long drive in large chunks.

Then 7-10 are all wins, so no garbage time. 11 was a very tight loss @IND. 12-14 were all wins.

Also of note, he has a career QB rating of 80.6 - when down by 14 points or more in the 4th quarter he has a QB rating of 62.6, with over twice as many interceptions as TDs.

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Yeah it never made sense until you've actually watched him play that is... HOW can you be a jags fan and have watched Bortles all these years and not realize so many games he ever did jack until the game was out of reach and the defense was in soft zone prevent ?

Because that didn't particularly happen, certainly not consistently. How you can think it did is beyond me too - so many of the games Bortles played in through most of his career just plain didn't have garbage time by any sane meaning of the words, and in many of the ones that did he actually played worse with the game going out of reach, as he tried to do too much.

Just as a quick experiment, let's look at Blake's top passer ratings in games (the 14 with a passer rating over 100) and see which involved racking up stats in garbage time.

1. 2017 HOU - 143.7
This one was a 45-7 win. Don't tell me he racked up those stats in garbage time against a prevent defense.

2. 2015 @TEN - 134.5
A 39-42 loss that was competitive all the way through. No garbage time.

3. 2017 BAL - 128.2
Another big win (44-7) - again, no garbage time stats.

4. 2015 @TAM - 125.4
Lost 31-38. Was within a score until half way through the fourth quarter, and his stats weren't out of kilter for the few minutes where the Jags were down by two scores (one three-and-out, one touchdown drive leading to a failed onside kick).

5. 2017 @IND - 124.7
A 27-0 victory. Did the Colts start the game in prevent defense, maybe?

6. 2015 @NOR - 124.5
27-38 loss. The first example of some good stats with the game out of reach (13-31) - one deep TD pass and one long drive in large chunks.

Then 7-10 are all wins, so no garbage time. 11 was a very tight loss @IND. 12-14 were all wins.

Also of note, he has a career QB rating of 80.6 - when down by 14 points or more in the 4th quarter he has a QB rating of 62.6, with over twice as many interceptions as TDs.

A year ago Bortles had thrown 69 career TDs. Only 5 of them had come when his team was leading. He's literally called "the Tom Brady" of garbage time by media, because that's what the stats show for most of his career. Yeah the one good year was different because the team usually had a lead but then they ran to eat clock. 


Here's a example https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bla...bage-time/

Still amazing to me that you claim to be a fan and watch the games but somehow have managed to not see this phenomenon take place. Did you only become during the afc game run?

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Here's a example https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bla...bage-time/

Still amazing to me that you claim to be a fan and watch the games but somehow have managed to not see this phenomenon take place. Did you only become during the afc game run?

Your example includes in its definition of 'garbage time' games where the Jaguars ended up with the ball less than a score down. That's not garbage time, and is a prime example of looking at the stats at a high level and completely ignoring the detail.

It's also worth pointing out that it's not something that happened after those years. Bortles barely even shows up on those ratings in 2017-2018. Russel Wilson and Drew Brees are way up there. Closely followed by Nick Foles (albeit on a smaller sample size). Is Russell Wilson the Tom Brady of garbage time? Because his QB rating in those situations was far higher than Bortles' had been in 2015-2016.

But I don't see a million articles about how Drew Brees is a garbage time prodigy. And, as you point out, they are there about Bortles. Why do you think that is?

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Because that didn't particularly happen, certainly not consistently. How you can think it did is beyond me too - so many of the games Bortles played in through most of his career just plain didn't have garbage time by any sane meaning of the words, and in many of the ones that did he actually played worse with the game going out of reach, as he tried to do too much.

Just as a quick experiment, let's look at Blake's top passer ratings in games (the 14 with a passer rating over 100) and see which involved racking up stats in garbage time.

1. 2017 HOU - 143.7
This one was a 45-7 win. Don't tell me he racked up those stats in garbage time against a prevent defense.

2. 2015 @TEN - 134.5
A 39-42 loss that was competitive all the way through. No garbage time.

3. 2017 BAL - 128.2
Another big win (44-7) - again, no garbage time stats.

4. 2015 @TAM - 125.4
Lost 31-38. Was within a score until half way through the fourth quarter, and his stats weren't out of kilter for the few minutes where the Jags were down by two scores (one three-and-out, one touchdown drive leading to a failed onside kick).

5. 2017 @IND - 124.7
A 27-0 victory. Did the Colts start the game in prevent defense, maybe?

6. 2015 @NOR - 124.5
27-38 loss. The first example of some good stats with the game out of reach (13-31) - one deep TD pass and one long drive in large chunks.

Then 7-10 are all wins, so no garbage time. 11 was a very tight loss @IND. 12-14 were all wins.

Also of note, he has a career QB rating of 80.6 - when down by 14 points or more in the 4th quarter he has a QB rating of 62.6, with over twice as many interceptions as TDs.

A year ago Bortles had thrown 69 career TDs. Only 5 of them had come when his team was leading. He's literally called "the Tom Brady" of garbage time by media, because that's what the stats show for most of his career. Yeah the one good year was different because the team usually had a lead but then they ran to eat clock. 


Here's a example https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bla...bage-time/

Still amazing to me that you claim to be a fan and watch the games but somehow have managed to not see this phenomenon take place. Did you only become during the afc game run?

That article if from before the 2017 season began, i.e. the Gus Bradley era. The team was rarely leading during those years, so it's no surprise that the small percentage of the time the team was leading results in a small percentage of TDs.

Bortles had his problems, but the garbage time claim is ... well, garbage. He was just an erratic passer, stuck for most of his career with coaches who crippled the passing offense because they didn't trust him.

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Lol, using methodologies created by J-School dropouts to gather, analyze, and interpret statistics. 

Stay in your lane, bro.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Here's a example https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bla...bage-time/

Still amazing to me that you claim to be a fan and watch the games but somehow have managed to not see this phenomenon take place. Did you only become during the afc game run?

Your example includes in its definition of 'garbage time' games where the Jaguars ended up with the ball less than a score down. That's not garbage time, and is a prime example of looking at the stats at a high level and completely ignoring the detail.

It's also worth pointing out that it's not something that happened after those years. Bortles barely even shows up on those ratings in 2017-2018. Russel Wilson and Drew Brees are way up there. Closely followed by Nick Foles (albeit on a smaller sample size). Is Russell Wilson the Tom Brady of garbage time? Because his QB rating in those situations was far higher than Bortles' had been in 2015-2016.

But I don't see a million articles about how Drew Brees is a garbage time prodigy. And, as you point out, they are there about Bortles. Why do you think that is?

I think that's because of the stat I posted that you conveniently ignored to try and make your "point" .. The fact he'd only thrown 5 career tds with a lead and 60 something when behind.

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Your example includes in its definition of 'garbage time' games where the Jaguars ended up with the ball less than a score down. That's not garbage time, and is a prime example of looking at the stats at a high level and completely ignoring the detail.

It's also worth pointing out that it's not something that happened after those years. Bortles barely even shows up on those ratings in 2017-2018. Russel Wilson and Drew Brees are way up there. Closely followed by Nick Foles (albeit on a smaller sample size). Is Russell Wilson the Tom Brady of garbage time? Because his QB rating in those situations was far higher than Bortles' had been in 2015-2016.

But I don't see a million articles about how Drew Brees is a garbage time prodigy. And, as you point out, they are there about Bortles. Why do you think that is?

I think that's because of the stat I posted that you conveniently ignored to try and make your "point" .. The fact he'd only thrown 5 career tds with a lead and 60 something when behind.

Who's the new Jags fan in this debate.  When have we ever been the dominant team and winning the majority of the time in games?  i'm lost, especially during the Bradley era.  The defense kept us close in 17 but that was the best chance we've really ever had for a full season to try an get, then hold the lead.  The defense is the reason people were content with running all game hoping the clock would expire before we had to actually pass frfr.

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Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

I think that's because of the stat I posted that you conveniently ignored to try and make your "point" .. The fact he'd only thrown 5 career tds with a lead and 60 something when behind.

Who's the new Jags fan in this debate.  When have we ever been the dominant team and winning the majority of the time in games?  i'm lost, especially during the Bradley era.  The defense kept us close in 17 but that was the best chance we've really ever had for a full season to try an get, then hold the lead.  The defense is the reason people were content with running all game hoping the clock would expire before we had to actually pass frfr.

We've had a lot of good seasons, you sure you've been around since 95? If Bortles was good Bradley would still have his job, end of.

Seriously HOW can anybody have been a Jags fab through the Bortles Era and not seen how much better he is in garbage time? It's so obvious if you watch the games. Over and over and over again he'd do absolutely nothing until the game was out of hand and opponent had dropped back in prevent. This argument is genuinely useless. If you haven't realized that than I really wonder wth you've both been watching all these years????

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Who's the new Jags fan in this debate.  When have we ever been the dominant team and winning the majority of the time in games?  i'm lost, especially during the Bradley era.  The defense kept us close in 17 but that was the best chance we've really ever had for a full season to try an get, then hold the lead.  The defense is the reason people were content with running all game hoping the clock would expire before we had to actually pass frfr.

We've had a lot of good seasons, you sure you've been around since 95? If Bortles was good Bradley would still have his job, end of.

Seriously HOW can anybody have been a Jags fab through the Bortles Era and not seen how much better he is in garbage time? It's so obvious if you watch the games. Over and over and over again he'd do absolutely nothing until the game was out of hand and opponent had dropped back in prevent. This argument is genuinely useless. If you haven't realized that than I really wonder wth you've both been watching all these years????

You trust your eyes and memory? Foolish, it's a fact that you lie to yourself every day. It's how we all cope.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

No. Forget those stats. Foles has won a ring, Blake never will. You have a better shot with Foles.

Incorrect, Bortles has a good shot to win a ring next year while Foles is having a 5 to 8 win season.

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Jaguars | Pacers | Purdue | Team USA